They are scarce because, those are the guys that realize they are being taken advantage of. The ones that still exist are there because they are that desperate. You eventually realize you are doing all these things for someone else, and you are getting nothing really in return and are not happy. At that point might as well just be up front and pay for sex.

I know, I used to be one.

If MM works for you then whatever...personally, I just don't see the point in a DHV. I don't really talk about myself or put details out there for people to like me. At first I thought I had trouble being vulnerable but it just never occurred to me to brag about myself. I'm naturally private. The funny thing is that it creates mystery. Not because i want to be mysterious, it's just a natural cause and effect from being naturally private.

If such things come up in conversation then I will entertain it for a bit, but that's about it. Only if it's relevant. I never understood why I had to prove myself to anyone other than myself. Only people I want to prove myself to is my family since they look up to me. They helped me when I was down so I just want to make them proud. Other people, not so much unless I respect them for helping me in some way and I just want to be a good person and return the favor. That's why I am a little harsher on women who have this whole "I'm pretty, so you should treat me this way". I don't fall for it. I don't know them and I won't be seeking validation in such a way.

Approach a genuine way. Its a better connection and you'll get your healthy relationship that way.


Edit: And as you see, I'm not forcing you to adopt it if you don't want to. If it works for you then like I said whatever man.

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Do both aqualol. Why not have solid inner frame and use tactics? As opposed to going all in on one?

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Genuine, meaning not having the usual strong frame and bla bla bla, just doesn't work for me, I could go months without getting laid. Literally. Girls aren't attracted to introverts, people that like coding and many other things and people that are often deep thinkers and love to talk about life and stuff. This just doesn't work.

Yes, I could tell you that I got into 20 women even like that during my life, and I could tell you that I had the best relationships coming out of "being myself", but it doesn't work day to day. And 20, over 14 years, is barely more than 1 woman/year.

But with my usual funny/strong/masculine/active frame I have (which is also a part of me, I'm not just an introvert or shy, ecc)? Then it's MUCH easier.

I had a break up like 5-6 months ago, a rough one, I wasn't into picking up and I would approach women for what I was in the moment and it was a tragedy, think I dated only two women, none closed.

But with my "pick up frame"? 4 sets closed in 3 weeks, with a 100% hitmark.

That's why I'm always confused. If I meet somebody and play with the PUF then I have no problem atleast getting one date but then I don't know how to transition into showing vulnerabilities and such and "the rest". If I play a more genuine/natural game then I have problems distinguishing myself from the other "regular guys that don't get laid".
Not following.

What does genuine have to do with frame ? Lol have you seen the way I write , pretty straightforward and politically incorrect. Like I said, girls don't ever really find a lot about me anyway. Unless it comes up in conversation. I could care less if she likes what I do or what hobbies I engage in. It's my life.


You can be funny strong masculine and active without tactics. I don't need to DHV or find indicators
Of interest etc. if she wasn't to fuck it will happen, if she doesn't she will let you know. Simple.

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I just personally reject that idea of "either she likes me or not, and there's nothing I can do." Even changing the "can do" to "want to do" or "am willing to do" just seems...lazy. Dat's just me doe.

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Nah I hear what you're saying. I forgot to mention that I try another time. I work on the hot leads and sprinkle pimp dust on the leads that have yet to be converted to hot leads. Works for me that way. I mean like I told Aqua if it works for you, I'm not gonna rag on you lol. If getting laid is what you want, then there it is. Aquas talking about what happens after the lay when you can't really keep gaming because you have to eventually let that frame go. He talks about how girls find out what he's really like and he loses them.

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I still don't understand you.
Ofcourse I am, what I'm saying is that there isn't only that part in me.

Yes, that's what I show off at beginning, but the real me is a much more complex person, I have yet to understand how and when to show.

What do you think about this video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BNWkDSB_qg

Have a look in the friend zone. That's where they tend to herd up.

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How to keep a girl.

Yeah, you're right LOL.

But I don't have the heart to use them like that. They're decent guys.

Actually quite the opposite man. Most women have a low self esteem as it is. The reason most guys compliments don't go over well with women is because they deliver them looking for a compliment back.

Why would you want a woman to have negative feelings and emotions when she thinks about you? Why would she come back around you knowing that you're going to "indirectly" put her down?

Build women up. Make them feel beautiful. Be the guy who they can come to who IS going to make them feel like a goddess and I promise you, you will ruin their fucking sex life. They won't be able to get that amazing feeling from any other guy... because most guys are too concerned about "making a good impression."

Show her that she made an amazing impression on you and quit worrying about what type of impression you leave on her. Make her feel like she earned it. Think about it... she spends all that time in the mirror to look sexy for you. That's what she's concerned about.... "Does he think I'm sexy?"

Don't put women down.

People tend to make assumptions about pickup as a skill/strategy. The big one is that women can immediately sense some nefarious intent at worst or severe lack of confidence at best. That is not true - because it is all in the execution.

Look at it this way. Inner game, in a nutshell, is just not being afraid of women and acknowledging that they are sexual beings that want to bang. Outer game is understanding just enough of human neurology and psychology to know how to guide an interaction towards sex. Only doing one raises the odds of failure. Do both and your success rate goes up. Taking either too far is just silly.

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But so to speak, was it YOU who talked her down or some imagination delusional version of you? I've never been a fan of fake it until you make it. If you dated a supermodel before, then by all mean, mention it. If you're lying about it, I suggest not to. You already know that the minute your frame is inconsistent and she found out you're not whom you built up to be, she will walk away. So why waste your time? Of course if you look for one night stand, you trick her into bed once and for all. Then this method work. I'm not not a fan.

I like to plan things ahead. I'd be honest and fair with anyone i date. Even we dont work out, somewhere down the road we can always hook up again or if she has hot friends she would introduce me. But if you lie, and things fall out on a bad note, chances are you also lose all the potential connection you could make through her.

With I said, my advice, if you run into a hot girl whose value is much greater than you, focus on things that only you can offer or your best quality. No need to demeaning or bring her down to your level. Appeal to the thing she lacks.

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"fake it til you make it" is a dumb idea in pickup. If a guy is learning to fuck women more often, it means that at the start he wasn't doing it. So how is he supposed to be a fuckin authentic casanova if he objectively is not.

Lie. lie lie lie lie lol. Girls stay with guys that lie all the time because having sex is such a massive compliance that the average girl would rather stay with a liar who makes her feel sexy than admit she is a shitty judge of character.

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I've not read everything here... that said it is natural to try and illustrate your attractiveness. In the hunter and gatherer days it might have been your animal pelt, or animal tooth... perhaps your weapon.

That said we're still trying to illustrate our value but we can't just do it with a bank account statement showing, or other reasons women may find us attractive.

This means wardrobe can play a part in illustrating your value as well, choosing to dress well with a sense of style.

Now there are also instinctual natural non-verbal behaviors someone with confidence tends to exhibit that help illustrate your point far better than saying how much money you have or how great you are. That said, with the amount offered through verbal communication we will have a tendency to put much more Conscious stock in words spoken... but we feel differently as we decode body language instinctively.

There is also something else you seem to not understand... the natural process of courtship. The process of a woman sending signs a man receiving signs... a man responding. It's been like this way for millions of years, your friends and women in general are just following instinct. We have to take that into consideration when you say why won't a girl show overt interest. Well women tend to have tons of potential suitors when they are attractive, thus have no reason to put themselves out there... the more attractive they are however the less reason they have to follow an UNNATURAL instinct.

Now I feel that men should learn to dress properly, build their confidence, correct their body language, learn to approach in an effective non-threatening way, and learn to have a natural conversation... along with the sexual aspects. A man needs to gain a lot of tools on his journey to being good with women and it takes a lot of 2 step forward 1 steps back to get good. I feel the best way a man can show himself to be great is through great story telling, being able to tell a good fun story from his past can make all the difference.

Once you collect a variety of great attributes and tools, you can become very good with women. One of which is avoiding the pitfalls of insecurity... which is as simple as building your inner game (self-esteem and self-confidence). The biggest problem is a lot of people never really understand having great self-esteem. Self-esteem is essential to happiness, being ok with weaknesses rather insecure over them is important, we all can use some work on that.

The other aspect often ignored is being ok with your "spiritual ego"... you not giving a flying fuck what everyone thinks. This is the biggest issue I've come across with people in general is their frail egos... I had an ex-gf that cared more what people thought than what I thought. Obviously a relationship can't work if you're caring more over how strangers feel then your BF. Her insecurities showed through regularly, her ego was massive, and she was hypocritical. Obviously things didn't work out long term because how could they? Both sexes have very similar issues illustrated in different ways... a woman may change 5-6 times before going out, a man overstates himself 5-6 times lol.

Working out your inner game solves the whole "pedestal issue". I don't rate women nor do I paint a woman's value based off her level of physical attraction. Who she is and the attributes she has that I value make her more attractive to me... that said I don't feel anyone in this world is "better than me", they might have a higher social status or whatever or might be smarter or more athletic, but those are attributes, that doesn't make them a better person that me. We are all special in our own way, brilliant in our own way, and have our own light that we need to learn to shine brighter. Once we can see that in ourselves we can eliminate this "pedestal issue" because we won't be trying to "show value" our value will simply show. It's we are all the prize!

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