semantics...

Typical nice guys= it is not good for seduction, love, future or whatever... Re-read my last entry and re-watch the video...

A confident, guy, that has boundaries, self respect(most of the guys posting in this threat) that do nice things, is not the "typical nice guy"...

Making a woman fall in love with you is counter productive and stupid(cause it will make you outcome dependent)... And you will probably lose the girl if your goal is "to make her fall in love with you" .

The best way to get a girl invested(the more invested the more likely to fall in love she will be) is to fuck her fast...

EDITED OUT.... OTHER FORUMS CAN NOT BE LINKED. PLEASE READ THE FORUM RULES!

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Ok now we are speaking about a specific type of guy being NICE... that is an entirely different thing... you're asking a "nice guys" to not be a bitch... why not write that out right? Why write something as farfetched as women don't value kindness?

1. There are guys who do nice things because they are simply nice people.

^These guys are fine... they simply must gain confidence and move on through life the way they prefer. If they are like this they'll be fine as long as they aren't outcome dependent. These are actually good guys...

2. There are other guys who do nice things as a trade... such as to build attraction.

^These guys on the other hand... these guys are just unconfident bitches that offer no value to a woman because they are kind people they simply are trying a different form of prostitution (if the route they are going is to buy girls shit). These are the commonly referred to "nice guy"... that really just means a lil bitch that won't go for what he wants so he tries passive behaviors to build attraction.

The thing is you aren't really doing nice things if you're simply attempting to trade for something... if you're doing shit for a reason.... that's not what I consider nice.

WOMEN VALUE KINDNESS... they don't value trading shit for attraction (agreed) or needy guys who think if they buy them shit they're owed attraction or a chance at dating...

The basic overall statement: Be outcome independent...if you are nice simply because you are nice... be nice but this doesn't meant let folks step on you... If you want shit go after it... don't attempt to "buy" a chance at her pussy by doing "nice things" for her.

Peace and Love,

Vic

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Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Pitch black...

Dude, you're nice and all but you're overbearing like youre in a damn cult. There is no need to re-read your post or to watch the video. It ain't true.

It's not semantics. There's nuance...

I suppose it's possible nice guys think if I'm not nice people won't like me, but I'm sure the logic is more let me be nice so she'll like me.

Could it be a confidence problem to think you have to be nice to get a girl and not just "be yourself?" yes

Could it be reasonable that you have to be nice and compromising if someone is going to like you? Yes

Who knows

I do know people don't appreciate what's easy. Nice guys finish las t because they're not appreciated.

You make a woman invest in you by putting her to work. Make her do things for you. Push and pull as well.

Dude, your mindset is fucking retarded.

There is nothing wrong with being a GOOD PERSON who DOES NICE THINGS BECAUSE HE REALLY WANTS THEM AND DOES NOT EXPECT ANYTHING IN RETURN. Women actually LOVE that.

However, women are not machines that you insert kindness coins into and sex all of the sudden falls out. Your typical "nice guy" doesn't think that way and he is nice to people BECAUSE HE WANTS SOMETHING IN RETURN.

Here's an example of a GOOD GUY...

I have a girl over at my house... she is leaving really really late at night... I walk her to the door, look out to my driveway at her car, notice that her front passengers side tire is COMPLETELY flat, I say "baby, I'm not going to let you drive home like that. Let me take your car to the gas station and put some air in the tire for you so you can get home safe."

Now, if you would let the girl drive home or put the air in her tire, late at night, by herself...... You're just a fucking dick. You don't deserve women.


A good guy doesn't do stuff for people because he's ASKED to do it or SEEKING something of it. A good guy does stuff for people because he is just a GOOD PERSON WHO GENUINELY CARES.

You're putt ing words in my mouth...people don't value what it is given to them. So if you spoil a woman with kindness she won't appreciate you. You have to be friendly to make friends so it's perfectly logical to think you have to be nice to a girl for her to like you, but guys overlook that they are being too nice and spoiling the girl. Then she turns around and values this asshole because she has to work for him. Do you understand that?

Being nice to a woman to make her like you doesn't make you a bitch. It makes you a sucker for love. Athletes, soldiers and even gangsters get played by women. It's not because they were bitches. It's because they spoiled women. I knew this guy that bought a girl a range rover while another guy was fucking her behind her back. This just makes you a fool.

Regular people are outcome dependent. That's life you want who you want. Being Pleasant will help, spoiling her wont.

I have not said one damn thing thats retarded so check yourself son.

You saying a good guy does this and doesn't expect anything in return. Bullshit. The only reason you did was probably to say you better than others guys. Don't lie to yourself homie.

If she was looking like these girls would you say "baby, I'm not going to let you drive."

No, actually... I did that because I GENUINELY CARE about the girl and her safety. I treat women as if they were taking care of my child...

You're just an asshole dude. Straight up.

People don't need to learn anything from you... There are plenty of assholes out there.

Learn how to be a fucking MAN... Not some childish little prick.

Many people don't value what's given to them... but that's not all people. You're making generalizations about 7 billion people means you're wrong a even if by 1% (which it's a bit more) is 70 million people....

She also values the day she ditches him and finds real man that is confident and not a lil bitch.

See guys like me are genuinely out to do nice things because it's a part of our NATURAL behaviors... lets not confuse this with bending over backwards for her... or not confronting her. This doesn't mean buying her shit... and yes I'll give a girl a ride if she really needs it and I can... but ... these happen on MY TERMS BECAUSE I WANT TO HELP HER... not because I want her to fuck me for a ride.

Being nice to women and kind to women are pluses.... and you keep putting a shitty spin on things.

So because you're outcome dependent (regular) that means all these other guys should be???... Why not solve the problem and eliminate that limiting feature?

The goal: To be a confident, outcome independent person, who is an individual that does your own thing.

^^Women will appreciate that.

Note: Don't know whether this is still true (old fact) but in the past there was a study done and the average guy (regular) has 6 sex partners in his life.... Regular is not the proper cup of tea on this venture to be above average with women.

I'm not putting any words in your mouth you're words are leading to my conclusion.

Peace and Love,

Vic

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Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

You wouldn't do it for an ugly girl tho lol

Don't get mad at me because you know you wouldn't do that for an ugly girl

Everyone wants to be different, but people are all the same. You value what you have to work for and sacrifice for more than whats given to you. That's just human nature.

Its also natural to be attached to an outcome when you want something. If you don't care if you get the girl I don't think you like her very much.

It doesn't matter if you're outcome dependent. What matters is that you have self-discipline and can control yourself and act rationally even when you have a passion for someone.

You're jumping to conclusions...

What is the goal of this post? what is the lesson to be learned?


This is the last thing i am gonna say take it or leave it, but this is mainly for people that may be reading this post.

Present your best attractive self to women, either they like you or they don't... Even if you can manipulate her to love you, it will not last if you present and act as someone you are not for her to love you, and you will have tons of issues and drama in the relationship.

If you are nice and kind, is cool, just get your timing in check, do not be a push over, have strong boundaries, don't be a sucker.

Fastest way to get a girl invested is to fuck her first.

Low self esteem women that like assholes are women with codependency issues anyways...

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Learn the proper way to maximize your results in a dancefloor/club environment, check out my blog and youtube channel:
http://www.dancefloorseduction.com

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The point of this post

1.) A new take why nice guys finish last. They are easy
2.) To encourage guys to make girls do things for them.
3.) To bounce ideas around on how to make a girl love you for romance.

I see where dream is coming from. I used to be an asshole. I realized why I was an asshole thought, b/c I didn't know how to be nice without communicating that you have boundaries. (e.g., a man)

What Majik said about the tire is what a man should do. You should be a gentlemen, and take care of your woman. Isn't that common sense? lol. Does that really not seem alpha as fuck? You're providing a safe way for her to get home, providing security... c'mon son. At the same time, if she's crossing the line you need to call her out on it. You CAN react by being an asshole to her but that is childish.

For example.. Say you go to pick up your girl. You be a gentlemen and greet her, hold the car door for her, etc. Let's say she decides to be in a bad mood with you while you're in the car ride. You can A be an asshole and threaten her that she is going to get dropped right back off unless she fixes her bitchy attitude. Or B, be a man and say something along the lines of "Babe, I picked you up to hang out with the fun you. If something is bothering you and you want to talk, that's fine. But if not, then maybe we should hangout another time." If she continues being bitchy without wanting to talk, you politely drop her off and that's it. A couple to a few days goes by and BOOM! She calls you and is a sweetheart. Voila... no need to be a dick.

Plus, if you do decide to go with option A 9/10 you will get your door slammed when you drop her off.. Omg I fucking hated when that shit would happen to my car lol.

Actually you got it the opposite... nearly everyone wants to fit in.... which is why people have psychological break downs when not included.... kids in school suffer huge life long self-esteem issues. Very few of us go against the grain... the key is those that go against the grain are those that have what all those other guys to want. If you want what the masses have then be regular... get laid by your 6 total women in your life. I on the other hand joined this website to fuck women and multiple women at that.

When you don't care if you get the woman that is when you get the woman... when you value yourself more than her and know she is missing out... self-confidence and self-esteem. This basic dude... when you show her you don't need her she realizes you have plenty of other potential mates and that makes her more assume you are a higher value male. (Basics dude... we haven't even got past chapter 1 here)

Yes it completely matters whether you are outcome dependent this changes your frame and your entire perspective... let me give you an example.

2 guys walk up to a girl...

They both walk up and say to a girl "Hi, you are a beautiful woman with great style... What was your name?"

Now one guy gets blown out... the other guy builds instant attraction.

What's the difference? One guy walks up with self-confidence he says it because he feels that way and he wants to meet the girl.... but doesn't really give a fuck if she is attracted this is his natural behavior...

The other goes up and does it because he needs her validation... and because he thinks she'll be attracted if he says such a thing.... because he finds her attractive he wants to trade a compliment for her attraction to him.

Now I'm not asking if this happens I'm telling you it happens... I'm telling you I was those two different guys and have said lines just like that and got exact opposite reactions... The difference? My level of self-confidence and self-esteem... the frame I had when I walked up to the girl. I didn't walk up like I needed her approval like the outcome of my entire emotional state was based on her reaction to my words...

I agree that you should act rationally and with self-discipline but only until you eliminate that behavior or you're needy behaviors and mindset will leak out... and you'll fuck yourself somewhere in the courtship process...

And yes I don't give a fuck if a woman doesn't approve of me... that's her opinion... and she's welcome to it. Even if she is attractive and I have a crush on her... I don't say shit I don't mean... in other words I don't say shit for her ears... I say it because I mean it... THAT IS HOW MAN ACTS.

Outcome dependence is a sign of low self-esteem... this is something I've talked to you about... your low self-esteem. Those with high self-esteem don't worry as much about it... They do THEIR THING because THEY WANT TO... See outcome dependence in one aspect is fine... you don't scream bitch at a woman at work so you can keep your job. At the same time walking up to a girl is not the same.... we are talking about you valuing a woman and her approval of you more than your own opinion.

Someone with high self-esteem gets knocked down... then goes on to be a success in whatever he wants.... someone with low self-esteem on the other hand... gets knocked down and feels that this is a sign of his true value... Outcome dependence = assuming your value based off of someone/something else(1 example of it also known a low self-esteem)..

You have literally some of the sharpest most experienced guys on this forum trying to teach you.... why do you think that is? It's because you'd don't know an ass from a face... you had some decent concepts but nothing more... overall you are so off it's ridiculous.

And yes I would do the same thing for a fat girl and the ugly girl... my behaviors don't extend just to beautiful women... It's a part of my behavior.... I've given people rides at 3 am in the morning because I wanted to help them... Being a GREAT GUY is a good thing... and it's a part of my own NATURAL behaviors however I don't do nice things tentative on them thinking I'm nice. I don't expect shit for it... that is outcome dependence... My behaviors are independent of other people's thoughts.

Peace and love,

Vic

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Girls like guys that kinda don't give a shit, but that's casual dating. You telling me you have a crush on a girl and you not going to care? You never want to show a woman she can affect you emotionally that shows she has power over you. I'm telling you outcome dependence does not matter. It's about self-discipline, being rational and maintaining a strong bearing. People are going to affect you emotionally, but you can work not to show it. If you approach a hot girl chances are she will affect you, but that's where self-discipline comes in. Mind over matter.

Being sensitive doesn't mean you have low self-esteem. Settling for things you don't have to settle for show low self-esteem. Yes, behaving as if you have something to offer women does equate self-esteem. you want that vibe, but its not going to attract every woman. Otherwise every cocky guy would have a HB10. Some women want kindness, but this post is about having discretion with kindness. It all breaks down to values...

You want to act and talk as if you have value. You don't want to show you've been affected emotionally because that hurts your value. You want to be kind because that has value, but you don't want to spoil people with kindness because you value what you work for.

Some of these thibgs are just part of being human and you can't change, like outcome dependence and sensitivity. It's wrong to lie to people and tell them they can get rid of these things. It's like saying you can get rid of fear... Not possible.

Lastly, I have integrity. If i am with a girl and she has a problem I will help her as a matter of principle, but guys need to realize that they are inclined to want to help attractive women and you don't want to turn into some "Captain Save A Hoe."