Dude you're doing great! Just keep approaching and you'll start noticing things that work and things that don't. Don't be afraid to experiment, and remember that at this stage girls reject your approaching style and the image you're displaying, not you yourself and who you are.

Also, from experience sex happens like a champagne cork popping out of the bottle. At some point you might notice that you're making a lot of efforts and still no results, and with just a bit more effort you'll find yourself with three dates on a weekend, all leading to sex. So keep the hopes high and flex the social muscles.

Just one thing that bothers me: No friend of mine would tell me to go to a different bar when I'm in a set. You want to make it clear with them that there are rules, and that you're not bouncing if you're talking to a girl.

_________________
We do what we have to do in order to do what we want to do.

Thanks. Although it doesn't feel like that! I'm proud that i'm able to 'man up' and approach and am 'doing great' in that respect, but night like Saturday kill me. I was able to get a makeout with an old bird, but there were lots of instant rejections in their from the hot young ones!
I haven't really learnt anything yet though, and I must have made a good 500 approaches or so by now! My problem is that it seems like nothing works! Or it feels completely random and 100% down to the girl rather than me. Sure, I might get a good reaction from smiling, saying 'hey!' and comlimenting the girl on something she's wearing. But then, I might get 5 instant rejection after that using teh same approach, What exactly am I supposed to do with that info?

In What other ways (and how) can I experiment? If you give me something tangible and specific (how to open, what my vibe should be, idea on 'approach style' etc, ((remember I do nightgame in bars)), I will do it on my next approach!


Thanks for teh motivation. I won't lie - I've been fairly low this week thinking about the fast rejections I got this weekend. Felt quite hopeless and kind of angry that my results are the same as my AFC friends, but i've put in so much effort in terms of approaching and reading etc etc

Regards!

How do you dress when you go out?

I dress nice. I take a look at what other guys who seem to be doing OK are wearing, in my area. I take hints from popular programs. I read GQuk. I have a personal shopper on a UK based fashion site who I use to buy certain items from. basically, I'd be ASTOUNDED if my clothes were the problem!

Been silently following this thread for a while and think you're doing great op. I'm only really starting out myself, so it's quite inspiring seeing someone who was in a similar situation to mine having the balls to try with so many different women.

If I was in your position now, I would look back and be proud of the positive reactions rather than think to much of the negative ones.

I've been rejected by women who I didn't even approach or even speak to, on the same night as I've not approached women who basically invited me to do so.

I would suggest that you go to some events you can find on www.meetup.com, and try to just befriend with people (preferably hot girls, even if they have a boyfriend, but really anybody can do). That would be your first mission. Once you can befriend most people, you will know that you got the right vibe. Then you can attack girls at nightclub.

One thing that could help you with that is the book "The Charisma Myth," that contains a good bunch of advice.

_________________
We do what we have to do in order to do what we want to do.

Hey Stoliar.
Unfortunately, meetup.com was a huge failure for me. Maybe it's just the area I live in, but every meetup was full of lonely, older people. I went too all kinds of meetups, and I don't think I saw one attractive girl! Even teh '20's and over' bar meetups were just women and men in their 40's and 50's. To be honest, I've always been quite good at befriending people though. I don't really think that's my problem. It's just that often hot girls in clubs seem to make up their mind before I've opened my mouth, as if they are all waiting for Justin Bieber to approach them, lol, I can't seem to often get even a chance to change their mind.

Anyway, probably out tomorrow night, so I'll be back at it, doing it all over again!!

Fair enough as for meetup, but I'm sure you have clubs or events where you can drop by and make friends. If you say you can befriend people, try befriending hotter and hotter people.

You should also try to diversify your hunting pool, to try what you can catch as of now. And one last thing: if you can manage to have a shot at sex with a girl you wouldn't mind fucking (even if she's not what you're looking for in the long run), do it. It's a confidence booster.

_________________
We do what we have to do in order to do what we want to do.

I'm assuming that's a reference to the field report from a few weeks back. And yes, I do regret leaving her! I should have just borrowed some money from my brother and paid him back later, probably by staying in the following weekend to save the money to pay him back or something. I hope I get that sort of opportunity again!

Went out last night:

Worst part of the night was not having the balls too approach two gorgeous young girls who were sat outside in the beer garden fairly early into the night. A blonde and a brunette. Both my type. Young, slim, pretty faces

Anyone who reads my FR's will know that i've experienced lots of 'instant rejections' from hot young girls recently, and I just couldn't stomach the kick to the ego of having it happen again, especially so early into the night. they were gorgeous, though!

It was also partly a 'competence' based fear/approach anxiety.
Like, I looked at them and tried to work out what I was going to say after I opened. Usually people advise some sort of cold read or a comment on something they are wearing or something, but nothing was jumping out and I didn't just want to do what every other guys does and just be like ''how is your night going?'' as people tell me that that is NOT a good thing to say straight after opening. Still not really sure what the best 'post open conversation starter' is, really.

Anyway, after that place we went straight to some smallish club with a dancefloor.
I started approaching on the dance floor.

I tried a couple of 'hand of God' type moves and trying to make Eye contact and pretend to pull girls towards me with an imaginary rope (has worked before for me) but none of them wanted to play.
Then I tried a few verbal openers Like commenting on a girls dance moves or something. Most kind of ignored me. One of them talked back a little, but I ran out of things to say very quickly.

Then I went and stood near like a pillar close to the dance floor and drank my beer. There was a girl sitting next to me who was OK looking, but nothing special.

I opened her with ''I can tell you're dying to get out there and dance''. She actually laughed even though it's hardly a hilarious opener which made me think she might be interested.

We started to talk a little. I ran out of things to say a good few times, but I DIDN'T eject, which is something i'm trying to work on! There were some awkward silences as I was thinking of what to say next, but luckily she filled in the gaps a few times. Turns out she is a GRANDMOTHER at 37 years old! haha. Quite funny that i'm only in this to get hold of young girls, and here I am hitting on a grandma! She was actually OK looking though, and I assumed she was maybe 26 when I approached.

Then her friend turned up and done some mild cock blocking and kind of tested me.

Funny how it's often actually the friends that try to make me look bad and test me. Happens a fair bit. It's usually the targets friends who shit test me as opposed to the girl herself.
This friend was giving me shit about being young and not being able to grow a beard! I'm 30 but look about 24 adn that's usually the age I tell girls I am.
Having no facial hair (genetics) is actually something that I used to hate and even looked into facial hair transplants at one point. However, I made my peace with it some time ago and now I actually kind of like having smooth skin as it make me look younger which is probably for the best since i'm always lying about my age to young girls and they seem to believe me!

I laughed it off and agreed about not being able to grow a beard and even grabbed the friends hand and made her rub it against my soft skin and I told her ''you love it!''. Meanwhile, the girl I approached seemed to be enjoying me teasing her friend and her attraction was growing.

I done some light kino on her.

Soon after she got up and was like ''listen. I really have to go! It was fun meeting you'' and she walked off outside. It was close to closing time. I didn't really care, obviously and just said ''Cool See ya!''

About 5 minutes later I was in the same spot, just talking too a friend and felt a tap on my back. She had come back. She pointed to teh corner of teh bar, as in she wanted me to follow her.
She asked the bargirl for a pen and told me to write my number on a piece of paper. Told me she thought 'we had a connection and you have good banter'' lol. We walked outside to meet her friends, but whilst we were on our own, I went in for the kiss. Just to practice escalation, really. She didn't pull away.
Similar night to last weekend in a way. A makeout with an older girl who I don't have interest in and no joy with the hot young ones, lol.

Went out last night:

Worst part of the night was not having the balls too approach two gorgeous young girls who were sat outside in the beer garden fairly early into the night. A blonde and a brunette. Both my type. Young, slim, pretty faces

Anyone who reads my FR's will know that i've experienced lots of 'instant rejections' from hot young girls recently, and I just couldn't stomach the kick to the ego of having it happen again, especially so early into the night. they were gorgeous, though!

It was also partly a 'competence' based fear/approach anxiety.
Like, I looked at them and tried to work out what I was going to say after I opened. Usually people advise some sort of cold read or a comment on something they are wearing or something, but nothing was jumping out and I didn't just want to do what every other guys does and just be like ''how is your night going?'' as people tell me that that is NOT a good thing to say straight after opening. Still not really sure what the best 'post open conversation starter' is, really.

Anyway, after that place we went straight to some smallish club with a dancefloor.
I started approaching on the dance floor.

I tried a couple of 'hand of God' type moves and trying to make Eye contact and pretend to pull girls towards me with an imaginary rope (has worked before for me) but none of them wanted to play.
Then I tried a few verbal openers Like commenting on a girls dance moves or something. Most kind of ignored me. One of them talked back a little, but I ran out of things to say very quickly.

Then I went and stood near like a pillar close to the dance floor and drank my beer. There was a girl sitting next to me who was OK looking, but nothing special.

I opened her with ''I can tell you're dying to get out there and dance''. She actually laughed even though it's hardly a hilarious opener which made me think she might be interested.

We started to talk a little. I ran out of things to say a good few times, but I DIDN'T eject, which is something i'm trying to work on! There were some awkward silences as I was thinking of what to say next, but luckily she filled in the gaps a few times. Turns out she is a GRANDMOTHER at 37 years old! haha. Quite funny that i'm only in this to get hold of young girls, and here I am hitting on a grandma! She was actually OK looking though, and I assumed she was maybe 26 when I approached.

Then her friend turned up and done some mild cock blocking and kind of tested me.

Funny how it's often actually the friends that try to make me look bad and test me. Happens a fair bit. It's usually the targets friends who shit test me as opposed to the girl herself.
This friend was giving me shit about being young and not being able to grow a beard! I'm 30 but look about 24 adn that's usually the age I tell girls I am.
Having no facial hair (genetics) is actually something that I used to hate and even looked into facial hair transplants at one point. However, I made my peace with it some time ago and now I actually kind of like having smooth skin as it make me look younger which is probably for the best since i'm always lying about my age to young girls and they seem to believe me!

I laughed it off and agreed about not being able to grow a beard and even grabbed the friends hand and made her rub it against my soft skin and I told her ''you love it!''. Meanwhile, the girl I approached seemed to be enjoying me teasing her friend and her attraction was growing.

I done some light kino on her.

Soon after she got up and was like ''listen. I really have to go! It was fun meeting you'' and she walked off outside. It was close to closing time. I didn't really care, obviously and just said ''Cool See ya!''

About 5 minutes later I was in the same spot, just talking too a friend and felt a tap on my back. She had come back. She pointed to teh corner of teh bar, as in she wanted me to follow her.
She asked the bargirl for a pen and told me to write my number on a piece of paper. Told me she thought 'we had a connection and you have good banter'' lol. We walked outside to meet her friends, but whilst we were on our own, I went in for the kiss. Just to practice escalation, really. She didn't pull away.
Similar night to last weekend in a way. A makeout with an older girl who I don't have interest in and no joy with the hot young ones, lol.

It's usually when you're the most relaxed that your game shines through.

The women who are too "old" for you, ironically, have been the ones who've actually chased you. Possibly because you were less anxious and able to have a real conversation and connect with them. I'd suggest maybe focusing just a bit more (sometimes the balance can be hard) in having fun and a good time and meeting new people as opposed to sarging. See how many connections you can make as opposed to how many girls you can pick up. For now, don't think of any fantastic openers (although if you make a good observation then do that) just focus on making sure that people want to keep talking to you!

Ive always found all girl groups the hardest to pick up. There's ALWAYS some bitch who feels it's their duty to cockblock guys. Half the time it's when they notice that their friend is actually interested in you!

Went out AGAIN last night!

Ok. Interesting night. Both frustrating, but possibly a few positives, too.

I'm out with just 2 friends. Both AFC's but my attempts at pickup, despite generally failing for the last 9 months seem to have inspired them to try (a little bit!)

They leave to have a cigarette outside. I'm now sitting near two hot '2-sets' in close proximity. I'm desperate to open one of them, but I just don't have the balls. I think about saying something like ''Hey. My friends just left me to have a smoke. Keep me company for a minute!''. I don't have the balls, though. Partly because both sets seemed to be so engrosssed in conversation and giving me zero kind of IOS/invitations to approach/eye contact etc.

My friends come back. After a few minutes one of the hot '2-sets' get up and leave. I feel the sense of lost opportunity which inspires me to 'man up' with the other 2 set.

This 2-set is in fact a 1-set, temporarily, as her friend has gone too the bar. I notice that she is holding and checking 2 phones. Typing away.

I slide over to her and open with ''Hey! Are you texting yourself?'' It barely lands and she just tells me she's trying to find out where a certain bar is. I tell her it's basically next door. She tells me she lives here, and I tease her for not knowing where the bar is and ask her if she's been in prison for the last few years or something. She laughs.

At this point, even though i've opened her and she laughed, I find myself completely shutting up and it becomes slightly awkward. This actually happens a fair bit. I think, I notice that she is still slightly uncomfortable about talking too a stranger, and my INSTINCTS always seem to be to back away. I can't seem to help it. It's like, unless she's asking me loads of questions straight away, I feel as though it's a dead-set.

I re-ignite the conversation when her friend comes back. We small talk. She tells me she's an air flight attendant and is 21. She guess my age to be much younger, and I go with it!

Soon after, she tells me they're going to that bar. I'd told her that were were going there too, and she said ''Maybe i'll see you in there''. I said ''Cool. See ya!''

5 minutes later we leave, queue up at the bar. Suddenly the girls join us in the queue. We talk a little bit. We all enter the club together, and then the girls spot a massive group of HOT girl who they know! I'm talking gorgeous Spanish air hostesses. One STUNNING blonde Russian one. A like 6 others! They tell us to join them and their friends!! Smile

We all start dancing. I keep trying to ignite small talk with my one. The 21 year old girl from France (but she has an English accent).
We are all dancing together. The hot blonde Russian girl is basically being raped by random guys. It's amazing how creepy some of these guys are! I actually almost respect their balls, though! They are just groping her. She pushes them away. They come back 2 seconds later and grope her again.

She kind of has herself to blame, though. She kind of grinds up on random guys and flicks her hair in their face. She actually done it to me. I tried to open her on the dancefloor (I never know what to say in these situations....HELP??) and she blows me off. She's kind of rude and has an attitude in the way she does it, but she is as hot as fuck.

I chat briefly with the Spanish one, but make a dick out of myself! Basically she tells me she's Swedish. She's being sarcastic because she obvsiouly isn't, but i'm 'in my head' so much that I don't get the joke/her sarcasm, and say some words in Swedish! She asks me what i'm talking about and I call her out for not being Swedish and then she's like ''Obviously!''. I try to recover, but I feel like a complete moron, lol

I find my girl again and some guy is now creeping over her, but I can see she's doesn't like it. I step up to her grab her by the hips and pull her into me.

She asks me to go outside with her and her friend. We banter more.

We go back inside and carry on dancing together. I've got my hands on her, and she doesn't seem to mind at all.
I think this is where I fucked up, because I didn't go for the makeout at any point whilst we were kind of grinding.

HOWEVER, It was partly on purpose. I read a lot recently about how making out in the club can decrease your chances of getting laid. PLUS, I was having difficult isolating her and didn't want to try to kiss her in front of her friends since she's feel like a slut. However, lets not lie. I was also lacking balls! Classic case of not wanting to ruin a set that seems to be going ok

A few minutes after she walks past me and tells me her and her friend are going home

Feels bad. She was hot and young. Like a decade younger. And I was basically the only person all night who she SEEMED to somewhat like.

I don't go for the number, either. Error again on my part.

I spend the rest of the night trying to open girls on the dancefloor, but 100% failure rate.
Lots of girls seem to dance real close and you think they want you to open them, but when you do, they look at you like you're on fire, lol.
It was a fun night, but the interesting thing is that if I hadn't have opened them girls (albeit it was a kind of awkward open) then the night would have been CRAP!
All of the girls in the group were nice to us since we were kind of WITH the other girls.

Keep thinking about that Russian girl too, though! I'd love to know if someone got her. there were 2 really good looking guys who were both almost fighting over her near the end of the night and she seemed to be somewhat into both of them. She was like a 10

There you go, keep going like that! Don't feel bad about it, that night was a great success as far as I can see. And you know exactly what you need to do next time.

By the way, you mentioned that you don't have any issues befriending people, yet you said sometimes with girls you'd find it hard to come up with what to say. This is exactly what I was pointing at: if you really had no problem with making friends with random people, you would never run out of discussion. Which is why I recommend you talk to as many people, regardless of the seduction aspect. Practice makes perfect.

_________________
We do what we have to do in order to do what we want to do.

@stoliar

To be honest, i'm actually not entirely sure what I did wrong and what I need to do next time!

Initially, I thought it was a simple case of not escalating enough – i.e going for the kiss after i’d been touching her and had my arms around her and stuff. But then people say that making out in a club can be counter productive – even mystery, in fact.

So then I wonder what I did do wrong?

I wonder if maybe, despite me touching her, she maybe thought that I wasn’t that into her!!? I never actually SAID ”I think you’re hot!” kind of thing.

Or maybe, even without going for the kiss I should have brought up her plans for after the club and maybe kind of invited myself back to her place and see what she said or something?

I just haven’t got a CLEAR picture in my head of what exactly I done wrong. I feel like I opened, was able to build some attraction. I later spoke a but more serious with her and built some comfort and qualified her. Mixed in some emotional spikes with cocky/funny stuff. Got a BIT physical (although didn’t try to kiss, but then that MIGHT have been te right thing?) and then she says goodbye and leaves.

I also need help with dancefloor game, I think, It seems to be mostly non-verbal I guess, but I rarely am able to get a girl to dance with me or take my hand or whatever. I tried smiling, not smiling, offering my hand, just grinding on girls, dancing near them and making some sort of comment (never know what to say, so it’s just maybe something about her dancemoves, or I ight just smile and say ‘hey, who are you?’ or something), but nothing seems to get me in, I haven’t tried the sexual molesting route that the guys in the club were trying on the Russian stunner yet, but maybe that’s my next move!!