Atlanta

EDIT: I should also add that they aren't all bad, but there are many that would not have a problem of cussing you out in public if they thought they could get away with it. But what would you expect from a town where strippers are considered semi-celebrities?

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Yeah I havent seen this either...and I lived in Atlanta for a few years a couple years ago. Most girls were just normal, unless fudge is dating the extreme hood chicks, but I'd say they're the same as hood chicks everywhere. Maybe he is dating the hood chicks I dunno.

I'm from Ferguson, but I live in Atlanta right now.

Yes I have dated my fair share of hood chicks, and yes they tend to explode more than other women. Comes with the territory.

I can admit my 90/10 mentality has evolved from being in the trenches with them. The educated higher class girls I date are extremely easy to deal with in comparison. They do less explosiveness, but I find it's the same in terms of respect if a woman is left to her own devices. This only hold true when dealing with a certain type of woman.

As you probably know I have studied pandora's box. To break it down simply for people who don't know it. a woman has 3 things when it comes to dating. with these 3 things there is a spectrum associated to each one.

The first one being time. The second one being sex, the third being relationship.

time - one end of the spectrum you have a girl who wants to invest all of her time into one guy, she will try to mold and shape him into becoming her perfect man. the other end you have a girl who invests her time in a bunch of men and she pulls certain traits from each guy to form her ideal mean through the combination of all of them. Nothing to do with sex, this is why girls have orbiters.

sex - one end of the spectrum you have a girl who sleeps with many men hundreds sometimes and justifies it in her head that "it's only sex" sleeping with a girl like this is an equivalent to a hand shake, on the other end you have the church girl who will deny everything to do with sex and gets uncomfortable at the mention of it. Sex holds tremendous emotional value to her and if you sleep with her it's pretty much guaranteed that she will want to be your girl friend.

relationship - one end you have the disney princess who wants to be supported by her man, raise the family and live in a nice house with the white picket fence. On the other hand you have women who can support themselves don't like men trying to take care of them, in fact they love to take care of men. CEO's and lawyers and doctors and what not.

You can form 8 different combinations of women through how they view each of these things.

Lesson over.

The thing about my 90/10 mentality, and the boundaries I set. The girls with the timeline of pulling traits from different guys. I cut her off from that if she wants to be in a relationship with me. The investor type won't bother with it in the first place. The disney princesses won't challenge you at all to begin with. The powerful women will challenge you constantly. I find the more you comply to her, the more she will try to flip the balance to you being on the 10% side of power and her having 90%, or you being on the 0% and her 100% in power.

The problem is she is still a woman and will eventually tire of bossing you around and leave or cheat. I don't do it in a way that's like a tyrant, but I finesse it in a way that 9/10 we do what I want to. Each instance depends on the situation, and like I said if her suggestions are better than mine I will go with them. That's still different than me doing something against my will.

You can act like a tyrant to the Disney princess girl and she will be fine with it king would be a cleaner word right? The powerful girl won't stand for that shit it's more negotiation and persuasion with her.

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Tried freezing out my gf after months of dating... HORRIBLE FUCKING IDEA. It may initially make her blow up your phone, make her miss you, etc. But there is so much unnecessary stress, and she will then think it's okay t freeze you out.

As of very recently, I have communicated EVERY SINGLE FUCKING THING with her. If she does something I don't like, I'll tell her mature. If she does something I like, I tell her. Effective communication in a maturely adult manner is key.

Already noticed a HUGE difference in her attitude towards me. Very sweet.

I really do think we are missing a huge part of this topic and that is communicating to your gf the things she is doing WELL!

What are the ways then, if we are not freezing her out, that we are going to communicate the things she is doing well and praise her for all of those things?

***Does too much praise kill attraction?***

Thought? -- Not trying to change the topic but I feel this could add to the discussion.

Just tell her or show her. Just be open. You should be telling her what you like that she does, and she should be doing the same. Here are my thoughts on attraction...its overkill. Was her last bf some alpha male god? Most likely not. Don't be needy, keep improving yourself, mix it up and fuck her well. Tbh, that's 99% of what will keep her from getting bored or losing interest.

Once you set the tone for an adversarial frame in a relationship (e.g., freeze-outs), a new dysfunctional cycle will usually begin. One where manipulation tactics on either end rule, and the relationship eventually fractures due to the various splinters that are left behind from each manipulative tactic used to get what you want.

Relationships are supposed to be partnerships. 'Freezing-out' is a tactic that is contrary to forming healthy relationships with people. One would be far better off learning effective, clear communication of needs rather than resorting to such infantile, passive aggressive and highly caustic tactics.


Freezing-out is merely a form of punishment (in the classical conditioning sense of the word). It is the equivalent to what ignorant parents do to their child when he/she acts in a way that is deemed undesirable. What's the problem with this? For starters when you punish somebody, it tells them WHAT NOT to do, rather than WHAT the desirable behavior(s) is/are. What happens here is that the child (or adult) starts feeling ever-more anxious, not knowing what behavior may illicit a negative reaction from their caregiver or partner. In addition, freezing-out plays on the existential fear inherent in all human beings, that is the fear of being alone. It doesn't feel good when your supposed love one uses their attention and/or affections as a tool to get what they want from you - that isn't love at all in fact, but rather ego. Withdrawing from somebody only serves to infuse greater anxiety in a relationship; this is far removed from any notion of having something healthy. This is such a destructive tactic, yet so much is written about it on this forum. Remember when you wanted to play with the cool kids on the playground as a kid but they acted as though you were irrelevant? I imagine it didn't feel too good. Probably felt pretty heavy for you, lonely, maybe at times you harboured deep-seated resentment towards them, and paradoxically a longing to be accepted, a place to belong. Why go do that to somebody you're trying to build a relationship with? It sounds absurd now doesnt it. Why? Because it is.

I completely understand this and in fact agree with you.

However, girls love having a "roller-coaster" of emotions... the push-pull...the I love you... I hate you....

**isnt freezing her out just a way to "push" her a little bit? If you straight up just "told her how you felt" there isnt any excitement in that. She doesn't have to chase you... she isnt feeling it as much emotionally.

Example - your gf blew you off on Friday night to hangout with her friends. This isn't a relationship ending behavior, but she isnt spending time with you and not meeting your needs.

How would you handle this?

Well what you are suggesting is to just tell her "hey baby listen i really enjoy it when we spend Fridays together and it hurt me that you wanted to spend your Friday with your GFs without me".

Where as freezing her out for a day she will be thinking "is he mad at me? is he just super busy? I want his attention... i want to know if I did something wrong? Or maybe hes just occupied with something, like his friends, like I was last night," -- You can hear her "freaking out a little" and becoming much more emotionally stimulated in your relationship.

Freezing out is way more emotional for a girl. Which is the language WOMEN SPEAK

*** And if a girl every freezes you out how do you feel? you want her attention EVEN MORE because you feel a "loss". This isnt a BAD loss... its a GOOD 1 because it puts you (the person who is freezing out) in a higher position. It makes you look more valuable. Like you have more going on. And that you dont NEED her.

This is what girls want. They dont "communicate logically" --


Just my opinion. Thoughts?

Never had to do what you're suggesting. And I ve been with many women and have had over 6 LTRs.

So she blows you off and doesn't meet your needs? That's not a sign to find someone who respects you? I'm sorry but what's the point of being with someone who is not spending time with you

Neo

In any relationship it is impossible to meet the others persons needs 24/7 365...

All i am saying is that if she does something you do not approve of freezing her out is a way of communicating to her and...

It is also going to be more emotionally stimulating than just "talking it out".

This is why I disagree with these tactics. If you need to freeze out for emotional stimulation then you're already not stimulating her emotions enough in the first place. For eg..if you need to tell your gf or show your gf that girls want you...what does that mean? If you're a great guy and fun and all that she should know just from being around you that other girls would want you.

I know it's nice to have a girl chasing you but is that really effective long term? If she does something, you freeze her out..she chases..you give in and things to back...what's really being accomplished? You ignore she ignores. You make her guess she'll make you guess.

Yep, exactly what happens. This might sound crass, but you actually train her to respond like this. It gets into her understanding that if she has a problem, the tone set for the relationship is withdrawal being the answer.

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I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

So toying/poking with/at each others attachment buttons is your philosophy to romantic relationships. In short, you're promoting the use of passive aggressive tactics in a relationship to get what you want out of your partner.

The illusion is this can't ever work for a healthy long term relationship. Why? The relationship becomes about who has the stronger defense mechanisms. It becomes a besting of who's ego beats out the others and dominates the frame in the relationship. I'd seen this in countless couples in my work as a budding therapist; one person would use a tactic (Protest behavior), and the other would follow suit. For example, a partner may pursue the other using various tactics, and the other would withdraw.

This is typically what happens when you have two people with insecure attachment styles. SO, for example, one partner is an anxious preoccupied type, whereas the other has a more avoidant style (the roles can actually switch within a relationship many times). So, for example, the anxious preoccupied person wants to 'fix' things immediately, but the avoidant, who is fearful of being vulnerable wants to withdraw and protect him/herself. Both actually want the love of their partner, they just have different tactics of going about it. The withdrawing partner illicits greater anxiety in the anxious preoccupied partner (the pursuer) and pushes him/her away, or simply becomes non-responsive. What happens when the avoidant comes-to and the war of attrition is over? The anxiety is left behind, you have both partners who are weary and suspicious of each other. Once the 'honey moon' ends, the cycle continues and this is how people slowly fall into abusive relationships.

Withdrawing is probably one of the most damaging things you could do to your partner. It actually shows weakness in that you are unwilling to deal with things in a healthier, more proactive ways other than using punishment tactics. If you believe that's the way to build healthy relationships with people, your mentality is highly dysfunctional, and the relationships you have will only reflect that. I don't fault you for being this way, you learned it from your parents - that was their pattern, and this is what a lot of people lacking in self-awareness do - its in their programming.

People who are securely attached to THEMSELVES do not do this.

Before anything else N2 is also learning from these discussions on freeze outs; not just sharing his professional insights as a clinical therapist.

Moreover, N2 suffered (or still suffering? not sure if he already broke up with the abusive gf he consulted us about in the past) from an abusive LTR (physical, verbal, emotional and mental).

Either he has learned his lessons well or he keeps on getting into an abusive LTR right one after the next. Based on his posts and initial beliefs, I am postulating that he suffers from a pattern of abusive relationships with women due to some nonverbal communication deficiency in his communication style.

N2 is open minded though as you can see from his last reply to me on this thread. What I am saying is that I still have to suffer from an abusive relationship with a woman because I cut abusive women off immediately before they even get an opportunity to have a long term relationship with me.

I had more girlfriends and LTRs than N2 and still notching the gf count up. I am NOT a clinical therapist. I work on and with the people part in technology products and services. Currently studying in a university to become a corporate lawyer. I love women though and I guess that's my best qualification in disagreeing with a clinical therapist on relationships.

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