Read aninteresting article just now
I have to say, I agree. Most of my family is a complete mess. They are losers in life with bad, negative attitudes. My mother was generally a positive influence in my life, but their influence in her early life haunted her and dragged her down, her entire life. She was never mentally free of them. I was lucky in that she escaped them, and I had very little contact, thanks to geography.

Most of my friends are exceptional. Their families? Rarely. At best they're average, and oftentimes, they're actively hindering them in life.

What say you? Should you stay loyal to your family members, even if they are generally a drag on your life? Or cut off anyone who isn't adding to your life positively?

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RSDTyler

The families that are a mess are definitely a drain but I think people overlook the less obvious "normal" families. They can screw you up just as bad. The ambitious mothers, the silent fathers, they look on paper to be perfect, they might not screw you up as bad as an alcoholic can but they'll screw you up all the same. I know mine seem "normal" but there's a hell of a lot of baggage that took me a long time to break free from.

Cutting free of them is one thing but unless you make the effort to overcome their effects then you might as well not bother. I was married for four years and when it ended, when I looked back I was living out my dad's script and my ex was living out her mother's. If you're interested, on another forum I got recommended an audio series called Home Coming by a guy called John Bradshaw. He has some really interesting ideas on how families fuck you up and some of it is very tough listening. Some of the exercises are worth doing, some of them are bit odd.

Its important to never let your family hold you back or hold you down. When I was a kid my mother pretty much laughed at all my business ideas and told me to be realistic. That was part of my motivation to succeed.

Family dont believe in you? Fuck them... prove them wrong. Trust me, it feels good.

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Never get broken up with again: the-addiction-formula-never-get-broken- ... 88794.html

I documented cutting off my family in my field report. I reached that enough is enough point after thievery. I fully endorse completely cutting all contact and communication with those types of family members. Since cutting them off my life has been outstanding. I feel that sense of freedom I felt while flying first class to Japan while in the marines. (For you active duty military readers. They upgraded me to first class because I wore my alphas btw. I was their little security guard against any terrorists. It makes everyone feel safe. )


You get pop up thoughts from our conditioning that will make you want to reach out to them. Like any other habit (neural network) you just have to ignore it and use interrupts and eventually the feelings subside.

Law #10 INFECTION: AVOID THE UNHAPPY AND UNLUCKY

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

The families that discount and make fun of their children's every move are also very annoying, especially when you have no choice but to rely on them for some of your life. Regardless, we shouldn't let that influence us at this point in our lives. Lets go out there and become successful beyond their wildest expectations.

I don't agree Da.

Do you have two brothers addicted to heroine? Do you have to worry about your valuables being stolen if they come over?

Has your brother ever started shit with you, and then you slam him because you don't want to hit him in the face only for him to then cowardly run for a pistol to try and shoot you?

Saying family is family is a gross generalization. It's like saying everyone of a certain race all act the same.

Anyway: Great advice on this topic - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6oV4hwVqGc

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

It's not pain. I already dealt with that stuff. I cut them all off.

"Sometimes you gotta cut off your finger, to save your hand. You don't understand that mean? That's that gangrene." - Rocko the Don.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJGO1fThfUU

I'm much happier and healthier mentally these days.

I am just saying, as a moderator you should not make comments like that because a new guy would read your words and take it as law thinking there was nothing they could do about their situation. Then they would give up and resign themselves to their fate, altering the course of their entire future. Unless of course that's just your philosophy, "give up and accept reality" then by all means spread the word, but I will be there to combat it as much as I can.

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

Not sure how you're inferring all of those things from 3 words.

_________________
RSDTyler

Versalis, you're speaking from your own perspective. These guys are green. They see "Moderator" on a PUA forum and think he is some sort of guru, so then they fall into that trap. The one a person without knowledge or experience falls into when they meet an expert.

I just heard a quote from Tony Robbins that has a little relevance to my last statement. His quote is in regards to trading, but I think the underlining principle can be applied here.

"When a person with money meets and expert, the expert usually ends up with the person's money."

Simply, they won't know any better and the result will be what I said earlier.

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

We are social creatures with a capacity for a wide spectrum of ideas, feelings, and spirituality. Thus we are more than an on/off switch. People in relationships aren't hot for each other 365, 24/7, and sworn enemies do not hate everything about each other. And yet, we have somehow developed a habit for binary decisions in all that we do. Between cutting off (pretty strong language for people who raised us) and bending over backwards for everything that the family desires,(equally whacked) there exists a whole spectrum of relationship possibilities.

Some thoughts:

1. It's a good idea to seek and befriend those who will mutually benefit from your relationships. It's nice to meet people with common interests, goals, and abilities to cheer each other on.

2. Money is important. We tend to equate "Life success" with "money" . . . but money is dynamic. It comes and it goes. People very close to me went through many cycles of rags to riches to rags to riches. And it's only natural that their attitudes change throughout the roller-coasters of life. Suck up to them? Cut them off? Suck up to them? Cut them off? If your "money-friend" loses it all and becomes an alcoholic, you tell him to fuck off? When he goes to rehab and starts up a new company, you kiss his ass? If you have a business client who loses it all and becomes bitter with you, you tell him to F off? When he makes a whole lot of money again and becomes a happy dude again, you invite him back as a client?

3. So there's more to life than just money . . . and in extension, there's a lot more to life than how we define success.

4. It's not easy. It's not easy to forgive. It's not easy to deal with it. It's not easy to listen to crazy. It's not easy to live crazy. But meet a whole lot of people and you might realize that "our families" aren't that unique. It just seems that way because we know our families "intimately".

5. And now the most important point. . . anybody I have ever known (me included) who has cut bridges/ties in negativity has always replaced previous bad relationships with new "bad relationships", ironically of the SAME NATURE. We always seek disclosure. If you really want to end any relationship, then turn it into a good relationship first . . . but then, there's no reason to end it right?. . . and good is never good "365, 24/7".

6. To do ^this takes strength. It takes some power and success of your own. You can take time off. You can tell family that you are busy with your work. You can call back once in a blue moon with a "Oh, I'm sorry. I've been so busy.". . . You can figure out a balance. But avoid any sort of "cut off". . . that's what the negative losers of the World do. . . and that's why they are where they are. . .

Your post managed to wiggle it's way into my morning meditation believe it or not. My mind brought it up several times. I cut the tangent off and labeled it a distraction until it crept up again. This is usually an indication that I should spend some time thinking on the subject. So I did. Shows the quality of your post.

I agree and see the light in everything you said. Here is the thing...
This gets into a realm of compromise. We're about to go into a little personal philosophy here, but I'll include as much reason as I can.

Words are symbols. They are also powerful in the things they represent. The concepts they represent are intangible powers in the world. Some of them exist outside the scope of science, but you can see them in your day to day life. Words like: Chaos, Peace, I, Karma, Almighty, or...Compromise.

Compromise, to me can be a demon or an angel. It exists to help create bridges between individuals without many things in common. It can be a great force that prevents wars and death.

It can also be the single biggest inhibitor in a persons life. I don't feel like family has earned the right to behave however they want towards you just due to your history. The past is an illusion. It only exists in our minds. I am grateful for my past and I mention that in my morning meditation, but I am not defined by it.

I'm defined by the choices I make today. I cannot accept compromising, and suffering the presence of others just because we have a history. In your post you address cutting off as creating a never ending cycle of bad relationships. The hole I see here is that, the individual you cut off was due to their own actions. Not an unhealthy antisocial habit that you have.

If you've spent a lifetime trying to help someone through every method in the book and they refuse to hear it and continue their relentless pursuit of bringing you down to their level. You have to sever those ties... or fall.

Here is the reason why I specifically cut my family off. My middle brother was facing a life sentence in prison. (won't go into those details) I had already distanced myself from him because he got together with a friend of his and broke into my car and stole my sound system so he could sell it for drugs.

I was going to let him have all of his Karma. My mother showed up on my doorstep with my nephew (his son) and manipulated me emotionally (comparing it to my father dying when I was 3) into helping him. I spent a large percentage of my income (the way I manage money I had to take this money out of an account dedicated to paying my bills and buying food etc) which took half a year off of the time I had left before I came crashing into a wall of not having any money to survive on unless I brought in new income. (at the time I was living off the sum and wasn't bringing in more)

I hired a super lawyer who got his sentence reduced down to 3 years, he had time served 1 year so he can realistically get out in 1 year with good behavior. I then paid him $500 to learn how to trade forex pairs under me so he could start generating himself an income for his family. He started coming over to my place and trading binary options on my account making around 75-100 bucks a day.

How did he repay me? While in apartment with the sole purpose of making money for himself and his family through a method I had to pay him to learn because he wouldn't have any other way, he stole my most valuable possessions. He stole my class ring which took me years to earn, and it irreplaceable. He also stole a diamond pinky ring that was worth over $2,000 that I haggled a slick New York Jeweler down to $1,750. I bought it on my first trip to New York which had memories tied to it from one of the greatest experiences of my life that I would often rub and draw power from.

I developed the habit and often find myself rubbing my finger where the ring used to be then my mind triggers over to the fact that it's gone forever.

He then stole my money clip. At first I thought I had just misplaced these things because I thought he wouldn't possibly do something like that, but I caught him in the act of taking the money clip.

I'm not a christian, but back in the day when I went to church the preacher said. "Why after being slapped on this cheek would I then turn and allow you to slap me on the other one?" I'm paraphrasing a bit but that was essentially the message for the day.

The underlining message I got from your post was to accept others the way they are no matter how bad or negative a person they are, and you are weak if you cut them off. I send love to all of my family in my morning meditation. I don't harbor any hatred or ill will towards any of them. I told them that as I was severing the ties. and if they hate me for wanting better then it shows their character.

This is a bit extreme, but if you had a friend from childhood who grew up into a child molester (btw that not what my brother was facing life for) and he touched your son or daughter would you then help him into child molester rehab and invite him back into your life around your child again?

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

I will spend my time with people who make me better and who I can help make better.
Any time I spend with someone who fits neither of those criteria is a time sink. It is always better to spend your time on those who contribute positively to your life.

Kasabi seems to be speaking of someone consumed by anger and living their life thinking of these people in spite. Provided you just move on, and stop bothering with them, I fail to see the issue. It's very, very easy to lose contact with people. You usually have to make an effort to see them. Why make the effort for someone who is a drag on you?

If would be like forcing yourself to cram down 5,000 calories of ramen noodles everyday to put on 100lbs of fat. When you don't enjoy doing it, and it makes your life much worse, why would you?
But think of how "strong" it will make both you and your child?

_________________
RSDTyler

I saw your post before the edit. It was great you could have left the prison guard analogy and the thing about your family in there. It had value. But essentially you are saying the same thing and I agree.

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.

I read it, and felt I may have been strawmanning to some extent. He's not saying "surround yourself with losers", but rather "stick it out(with family), regardless of if they are or not".
And I realize that my experience with my family may not even be what he means. Since I barely met them, there isn't much to push away.

I still think my mother did the right thing. It made her life better, and mine, better still. He is partially right. She could never totally break away from them. And she would have some bad people in her life(though far fewer). But one good thing it did, was totally free me from the situation. Otherwise, I'd be battling the same demons that she did, when I decided to leave(or worse, spend time with them and have them rub off on me, actively).

Being a single mother is hard. And I think it took more "strength" to leave them than to stay with them. Though they were not emotionally healthy to be around, they would help her out financially(they have decent incomes), they could also help her take care of me.

When your family puts you down and emotionally drains you, why should you keep spending time with them? I don't care about DNA or blood. It doesn't matter to me. I want the best possible people in my life. That has nothing to do with who changed my diaper or who I ate Thanksgiving with when I was 8.

You should be with people who suit you. They're pessimistic and static. They should be with people who share their view of the world.

_________________
RSDTyler

I asserted my independence quite early from my mom. I have my own place but she's always welcome when she visits once a month. I don't encourage her to stay long or visit me more often. When she starts opening those depressing and negative topics, I immediately state in very clear terms that I don't want to hear those. When she starts nagging me about changing my dark red curtains with pink ones (she nags me on this often), I tell her immediately to leave.

But of course, when it's her birthday, I treat her out to a nice dinner. At Christmas, I get her favorite ham and some of her favorite fruits. It isn't a black or white cut off. There are always shades of gray.

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Approach. Open. Escalate. Isolate

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