I'm fairly new to the community, but I think this a valid point of inquiry. What, if any impact, would a PUA have in Japan that they wouldn't necessarily have in the west?

I've been studying for a career that'll take me to the far east in the coming years, and since I have no intention of isolating myself from the rest of the world while I'm there, I've been doing some research into dating women in Japan. The more I look into it, the more it seems like a place full of people receptive to an enterprising PUA.

The common motifs I find where ever I look are as follows. Keep in mind I don't know any of this personally, but it's what everyone on the internet with a voice for this kind of thing insists upon:

1) Japanese women generally aren't interested in sex or relationships. Japan's at an all-time low in fertility due to both men and women, apparently, being disinterested in one another. To me this says "repressed souls willing to break out", but I digress. When looking up the "why" of Japanese women in pertinence to men, this leads me to the next motif.

2) Japanese men are perceived as "weak" by Japanese women. This really doesn't surprise me, as everything I've read about modern Japanese culture seems to kill off the notion of freedom and happiness in adult life. When you're young, you're allowed to be young, albeit your parents are generally a bit strict. After that, you go to college, go to work in some office job you hate, TRY to get married by 25, and kiss your aspirations of being in a relationship goodbye by the time you're thirty. Do this, or you're essentially considered a failure by others.
So it doesn't surprise me that men might be considered "weak" over there. Hell, they're never really allowed to be men at all. Japanese women say they want men to men, and I'd like to imagine a PUA is nothing if not at least capable of pretending to be a man.

3) Foreign men are apparently "exotic". I don't know why, I don't know how, but the more I read up on the subject, the more people say that foreigners (even ugly ones with little to no game) can ensure himself company in Japan if he's at least willing to put in the effort to do so.
Some posts I've read have said that Japanese women might have an interest in foreign men because they expect different things from them. Whereas Japan is a place mired with traditional values, foreigners might seem fun, liberal and outgoing. Where Japanese men seem to have been beaten into submission, foreigners seem confident and bold.

4) Mannerisms seem entirely different. Where a woman is expected in Japan to do certain tiny favors for the man all the time (pour his drinks, take off his coat when they sit down to eat, etc.), men in the west generally do these sorts of things for women instead. I've heard some American women accuse Japanese men of being rude, bossy and patriarchal, and Japanese women considering American men to relatively polite and encouraging.

Is any of this true? And if it is, what (if any) impact will this have? I'm going to be over there at least a year, and I'd like to have all this figured out before I take off.

I'd suggest reading this

But only if you can manage to sort info well. Rio has so many useful field reports. Just pay little attention to any of his tactics. He really has issues with thinking he's some sort of awesome NLP puppet master, when he's mostly just handsome, tall, fun and foreign.

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RSDTyler

I'll chime in here.

First things first: ignore the Japanese PUA community like the plague. You will never find a more woman-hating place on the planet. It's basically a forum filled with posts about getting "bitches drunk and fucking them", how to cheat on your girlfriend, and all around just horribly negative stuff.
I've met quite a few of them while I was there, and they are in general fairly socially awkward between guys, and just douches to women, and tend to bang mediocre chicks.
The fact that one of the most famous ones used to post a blog, about how he would scam money out of women, post nude pictures of them online, sex videos, stuff like that, says a lot about the community.

Now, onto your questions.

1) The info is correct, but your conclusion is wrong. No one is "just dying to break out". Instead, it tends to lead to depression that no one talks about.

2) The current young (20-somethings) tend to be seen as "herbivores", the weak men you talk about. But in contrast, the older men are very oldschool, and domestic abuse is not at all uncommon.

3) That's very old, and not really relevant anymore. It topped around 15 years ago, and these days is almost non-existent. In fact, with the really hot girls, being a foreigner can often be a negative. Foreign white guys have over-used this so much, that we pretty much just have a reputation of being sleazy guys that just wanna fuck j-girls.
You can read this on it too:
http://redsunblue.com/2013/10/the-white-god-is-dead/
(that is, by the way, the only PUA-Japan blog that I recommend)

4) True, but not in the way you describe. You're describing somewhat old-fashioned, or very high-class/polite situations. Go to a bar and expect a girl to poor your drink? Hah, good luck.

A lot of what you write seems based in how Japan/Tokyo was somewhere between 5-10 years ago. You might still find something slightly like this, if you're in the more rural/non-touristy areas of Japan, where foreigners are still fairly rare, but apart from that, naw.

Will it impact your normal routines? Hell yeah.
The one place where your normal routines might work, might be Roppongi. It's the "foreigner area" in Tokyo, though that too is somewhat changing.

While there, I found that a slightly toned-down Mystery Method worked quite well. But don't be too loud or braggy, that's a negative in Japan. Don't be too touchy, that's a giant invasion of personal space. Read the blog I mentioned above, it has some good points.

I should also add, that your approach to women (and what women you'll be able to get at all), largely depends on your Japanese proficiency. The average English level in Japan is very (very) low. Some women will outright refuse to talk to you because you're not Japanese. Others will simply not care, because they can't speak English at all, and don't care that you can say "konnichiwa". Others will, on the flipside, only date foreigners who CAN'T speak Japanese (the "exotic" part), though I generally advice against such women, they tend to be a fairly slutty.
Though on language proficiency, the worst place to be, many say (and I agree), is actually at "half-decent". You're not fluent enough to be elegant in the language, or hold truly interesting or clever conversations, but you're good enough that it's awkward switching to English, and you've lost the "exotic" bonus.

Looks-wise, everyone gets a +1-2. If you're a 5, then in Japan you're a 6-7. The same goes for the Japanese though, experience tells me, that many Japanese who are 5's, are considered 6-7's by foreigners.

Hope it helped!

I take it you're western, right?

There is no pick up in Japan when you're caucasian or black. You're a gem in Japan and especially China or any other asian country(Vietnam, Thailand). You do realise just because you're from the west bars will actually give you free drinks for the night because it will entice women to come into the bar if you're there?

Forget pick up. Playing hard to get over there will basically tell them you're not interested. In those countries you're like a celebrity by default. Women want to be seen with you, want to talk about having fucked a western man and men want to hang around you and buy you drinks to impress everyone else. You're essentially the biggest fashion accessory to them... the women just happen to want to have sex with you and you get a lot of free alcohol.

You are just making bigoted racist generalisations based on isolated anecdotes or hearsay. You haven't got a clue what you're talking about. Most of my family is Japanese, the culture in Japan is nothing like Thailand or Vietnam. Saying they're all the same is like saying American and Mexican cultures are exactly the same. Do some research.

Zepzep is the only poster in this thread who actually knows what he is talking about.

I have done research on the subject. I was planning on going to Japan, China or Thailand a few years ago and looked up a lot based on cultural differences between each and the differences between their cultures and my own. A common thing for these cultures, actually living in those countries, is to place high value on westerners. I know that Chinese and Japanese culture are vastly different especially in terms of their night life and what they actually do when they get together. For instance in China they generally don't go to night clubs instead they do all their socialising in restaurants and it's completely normal for them to do this, strike up conversations over dinner and not go out as we do in the west. China and North Korea are very similar in this aspect of their social life. In Japan and Thailand however this is different and it's quite normal to be more Western, visit clubs, pubs and actually drink. In Thailand there is a massive importance placed on family, your religious beliefs(Buddhism) and your educators/elders. Needless to say Japanese men and women are very vain.

There is, however, a massive difference in cultures who actually live in these countries and those who are second generation living in different countries.

Oh, you've never been to Asia? Anybody reading your first post would think you were an expert on the subject...

Don't judge countries you've never visited. Your first post made it sound like any old shy bald fat ugly hairy white dude can go to Japan and girls will be fighting each other to worship his cock. Gaijin are very common now in the big cities and dating them has become very cliché for many Japanese women. It's not the same as it was 10 - 15 years ago. The more white guys who arrive (and believe me, there are a ton of white guys, especially Tokyo), the more picky Japanese girls will be. The slightly overweight white dude with glasses is no longer the "God" he used to be.

That sucks. I've pretty consistently heard that average looking white guys could do pretty well if they were over 6', provided they matched Japanese guys in career and fashion.

_________________
RSDTyler

And yet you jump to the conclusion i'm talking about bottom of the barrel here? I take OP to be a normal looking guy and what I said still stands: You're like a fashion accessory and will generate enough interest just by being caucasian not to bother with pick up. True there are enough people visiting but that doesn't demerit the fact that you're more sought after and don't need to apply "game" to pick up women as you would in your own country.

Don't be dissuaded. There are still plenty of Japanese girls who love Gaijin and you will still be in a minority as a white guy.

One positive for noobs is that "nice guy game" works much better in Japan, the women are not as entitled/bitchy and don't shit test you as hard.

Average looking white guys over 6'ft should do really well ANYWHERE in the world, if they got game. I was just saying if you are 5'2", shy, bald and fat, don't expect to be treated like a god in Japan. You still need to approach. You would need to lose the weight, shave the rest of your hair etc. Dress well. Be well groomed.

I'm sorry, I can't seem to find the part where you have actually been to Japan and tried to pickup a Japanese girl? You have been to Asia precisely zero times and you have slept with precisely zero Japanese women. Women are attracted to foreign guys??!!! Oh my goodness, what a revelation! Who knew??

Hey, if we're going learn about Japanese culture from you, we might as well learn sex techniques from a virgin while we're at it. As long as he's read articles online, he's sure to know more about sex than us, right?

I don't think you fully understand where I'm coming from here.

1) I don't mean "break out" as in "girls just want to have fun on the weekends". I mean I'm under the impression the story is "underneath layers of forced banality and subservience, where I'm frequently judged by my age and relationship status, I want to have a relationship where I'm not so pressured from all sides".
If the things I've read about those women over there are true (Christmas Cake women anyone?), I pity them.

2) That is really sad to hear, though I suppose it's not entirely unexpected. I didn't think they'd actually be beating up on their wives.

3) What you said at the end (+1-2 in terms of looks) is far more relevant to what I was thinking than the White God myth. I don't have a beer belly, a balding head, and I'm only 23 years old as of now. Regardless if I do possess these traits or I don't, or even if I were ugly or handsome, I don't expect to go over and think women are going to throw themselves at me. It sounds like I'll have an edge, which would be nice, but I like to think I'm not biting any hype.

4) I don't expect women I just met, or am still in the process of meeting, to do those sort of things for me. Nor would I want them to. I live in a house with two Vietnamese women who don't let me clean anything but my own room, not even the dishes I use, and it drives me up a fucking wall.

Outside of that, thank you for the input. I've got a long life ahead of me, and I'm just stepping into the PUA community. As far as I'm concerned if it's worth doing, it's worth doing right the first time.

You'll have to excuse me for not meeting your oh so god given standards. Perhaps I shouldn't base knowledge on what is widely reported on and information passed on from people who have actually been there. Who would have known so many were so wrong in reporting how much attention they got in country X. Must all be wrong, right? The internet and anything posted has zero merit to it, eh?

By your logic we may as well discredit PUA altogether because it's on the internet.

Wow... what a load of complete bullsh!t.
Let's take this one point at a time:
- First off, you're comparing completely different cultures, and just throwing them into the mix together. Vietnam and Japan is as different as Mexico and the US. There's no comparison, really.
- No, bars will no give you free drinks because women will want to go there to talk with you. That said, I can imagine some bars in Thailand, for instance, which will give you free drinks, because they have deals with the local prostitutes. So you get there, you get drunk, go home with a prostitute, bar gets 20%. Tokyo bars have the same system with hostesses (no sex generally involved, though that sometimes changes with foreign hostesses). But yeah, the dream world you're talking about, where you get free drinks, and women flock to the bar to speak with the white westerner, doesn't exist.
- No, do not forget pickup.
- No, you're not a celebrity. As I noted before, you're about 15-20 years behind on your perception of this. Foreigners are common these days, especially in Tokyo, you see them everywhere. Same goes for the fashion accessory.

I have no clue where you're getting your information, but wherever it is, you should stop getting it from there. It's not a little off, it's amazingly off. Sorry, but I don't even get how you could actually believe this, it's so obviously BS.
Thank you!
Yes... decades ago. And again with the vastly different cultures here...
Yes, they do go to nightclubs. What are you on about? While my experiences in Hong Kong already prove me right, a simple Google search for "nightclubs in Beijing" is enough to show that you're wrong.
Surely you mean South Korea, and not North Korea? You know, the country with the harshest dictatorship in the world, where people are starving to the point of having to eat their own children when they die?
From my friends who have gone to Seoul (SOUTH Korea) and lived in central china, who have also lived in Japan, as far as I gather, both of those countries actually place a higher value on monetary goods. Not to mention that South Korea is (in)famous for plastic surgery.
Isn't that the case most places in the world? I mean, you just said "If you have a decent career, solid fashion, not ugly, and do solid pickup, you'll do OK!", which... is pretty normal?
Solid point. Because of the way Japanese culture is, Japanese men tend to not be very open or romantic, tend to want to control the relationship, and can, certainly in the long run, be a little harsh. Westerners, whether true or not, have a reputation of being very romantic and sweet in relationships. Being a nice guy in Japan isn't necessarily bad, though you'll still need a bit of game, of course.
I just want to point out, that Japanese tourists are a bit different. Japanese people are very xenophobic (I'm generalizing, of course), and the majority have never traveled outside the country, and if they do, the common places are Hawaii and Guam, where there are tons of Japanese people. If you run into one in a western country, they're already considerably more open to other cultures than the average Japanese person.
I'm sorry, but you shouldn't need "many psych and sociology courses" to figure out that culture, the very concept that shapes the personality of an entire region of people and is one of the main causes of conflict throughout human history, is important.
Had to look up Christmas Cake women... not a super common expression. But yes, if you're a woman in Japan, and you hit 30, and you're not married... you start to panic a little. 30 tends to be a very big deal for women in Japan.
You're somewhat correct in what you say, but from a pickup/relationship/advantage point of view, it seems like you're overestimating it a bit.
Sadly, it wasn't until a few years ago, that things like spousal rape was even illegal.
Let me quote:
"The revision to the Law for the Prevention of Spousal Violence and the Protection of Victims passed, expanded the definition of spousal violence to include mental, sexual, and physical abuse and increased the length of restraining orders from 2 weeks to 2 months."
Notice the bolded parts, primarily meaning that they weren't included before. Most of it goes unreported too:
"When Japan improved its system for reporting and investigating domestic violence in 2011, the number of cases reported increased dramatically. An additional 46.3 percent surge in cases were reported after the National Police Agency changed its policies that year on domestic violence."
(source)
It's also estimated that only 1/10 women report rape.
Yes, you get a small edge. You're interesting because you're not from around there, and while there's a lot more foreigners now, you're still more in the realm of 1/100.
That said, as I noted before, you'll also run into women that will just simply refuse to talk to you, because you're not Japanese. I remember being in a nightclub once, saw a cute girl, walked up semi-behind her, said "konbanwa" (good evening), she turned around with a big smile, face in my chest, looked up, saw my face, just instantly walked away. Harsh.
In general, don't expect them at all, unless you're in a hostess club.
Best of luck!


I'm not a PUA master in any way, not by a long shot, but I do know my Japanese culture pretty damn well.

"Ok" and "pretty well" are quite different things to me. I thought you would do better in Japan than say, Germany or Finland. Possibly a lot better.

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RSDTyler