This thread identifies the difference between guys who are into pickup and guys who just don't know shit...

Pickup isn't about winning "arguments." And if you're more concerned about looking smart and having the last word, you aren't gonna get any good at this.

Look up Ezo's old thread on letting your ego be like smoke, and you'll all learn.

If you're in a position where a woman's calling you a pathetic waste of a human being, you probably fucked up

This is a subject that many people misunderstand, abuse or just do not care about.

I am taking a couple of minutes to explain my view on frame wars because I see a lot of people here flexing their PUA muscles and think that this is an actualy war. I can see how this concept can be confusing but hopefully this post will help some of the people overdoing it.

So what is frame wars? Basically a PUA term meaning that whenever two people meet, they are gonna establish a social structure between themselves, who is invited into the others world. Who will subject to the others view of the world? In short, who is dominant and who is submissive. Who leads the conversation?

This is normally nor a problem, it is obvious in most scenarios with people you have daily contact with. Some frames you have to accept: Teachers, bosses etc. Others accept yours: Your employees, students, pets etc. And others are people you just dont care about, like people you meet on the bus.

But when you are in a sarging situation, it can matter. Of course it matters most to the people who are about to lose their frame, or people with weak inner game. Basically, people who feel the need to protect themselves. Sadly, they often do so by attacking, and attacking, and attacking. Until they wear down the other persons frame, and interest.

There are a few tools PUAs use to beat at other peoples frames: Negs, cocky funny, false disqualifiers, and above all, that air of arrogance that tells everybody that, I am not taking anybodys shit and I will teach anyone who even thinks about questioning my authority a lesson. Obviously this mindset is just bad.

That last sentence can be read again!

Get it? Good.

That is a terrible mindset to have. Sadly, I see so many PUAs with this exact mindset. They go around telling themselves that they are the shit. That they can believe that they are awesome and become awesome. The outcome of this mindset is an overly dominant personality, which is in fact not dominant at all. It shows weakness and insecurity.

It is the kind of mindset of people who think that they are right just because it is them and they are always right. Instead of being right because you have experience. Or even better, to accept the fact that you may not be right at all.

But, people with this mindset love to show others how right they are, how awesome they are. That kind of behaviour radiates an air of, I am not strong enough to accept criticism or questioning. So yes, it may seem like strong inner game to some but it is in fact weak.


So the solution to a girl with a strong frame to these PUAs is to smash their own frame down on top of hers. To bury her frame in a barrage of bullshit. To win every single discussion or disagreement by walking all over her and not listen to anyones opinion but their own.

This is overdoing your frame wars.

The other extreme is when you let a girl walk all over you and you agree with everything she says just because you wanna get on her good side. That sucks even worse.


And, no. The answer does not lie somewhere in the middle.


This is how I win every single framewar I enter.

My frame accepts the existance of other peoples frames.

There you have it, a simple solution which is difficult to achieve.

Whenever I meet a person, I expect the other person to have a frame. I expect that this person is better than me in some way or at something and that is not only ok, that is optimal. If the other person is weaker than me in every respect, why would I ever wanna spend time with that person. Sex? Yes, but then I would rather go out or move on until I find another girl who is equally sexy but is mentally at my own level. I can stand not so attractive girls for a night but I cannot stand even 10 seconds with girls who annoy me mentally.
That doesnt mean that I never give anyone a chance, it only means that I give them a chance to impress me and if they cant do that in other ways than looks... Next.

Now I dont mean to sound like oh yes, it is so easy, you can get whoever you want, it is just a sarge away... But that is not the point. The point is: You dont have that girl either. The one you are just sarging, you dont have her yet. You will find out if she is strong enough within the first 10 minutes of conversation. So you have an equally good chance with the other girls in the club.

Having spent the last half year in search for inner strength and harmony, I have found that my frame is strong, very strong. Not because it walks all over other peoples frames or that it destroys them. On the contrary, my frame is strong because I know myself. I know my weaknesses and my strengths. And I accept that I have them. I do not accept that I am gonna have them forever though. So when I meet a girl with a frame that is strong in a different way than mine, my frame merges with and/or absorbs hers. I take the opportunity to learn from her. Not trying to be arrogant or anything here but my frame will not be threatened by hers because I know that the overall inner strength of me is way stronger than the inner strength of most people I meet. Not bragging, just telling you that I have worked hard on it. But most of my strength comes from the fact that I do not see it as a failure if I am wrong. If I have a weakness and someone points out I feel stronger, because I just levelled up by learning from her.

So you see, it is not a war. Fight and you will eventually lose. Both the girl and respect for yourself. Build up your inner game so that you will not feel threatened by someone who is stronger than you, you will get the ability to take a mental beating and like it. Simply because even though it damaged some part of yourself to realize that you suck, it is only a small part of what you build your self confidence on, you have enough to spare. Build up your pillars of confidence, not only on your strongest characteristic but on all of them, if one crumbles, you have the rest to support your ego.



During my half year vacation from the PU world, I have had many interesting discussions with people from the BDSM subculture (real dominant men and women, and also submissive ones). People who jusr radiate strength and confidence so much that it affects others sexually. And they all agree on one thing. Real strength is to admit weakness.


Hope this post will help some of you not to fall into the same arrogancefilled hole I fell in to...

Love

Ezo

Found it

Real strength is also being vulnerable, and having the courage to do so.

Ego only blocks things. Comebacks may satiate it momentarily but they are just tactics to protect the ego. Once you get past the ego there's no resistance and there's an indifference towards one's acceptance to you (or lack thereof).

You simply don't argue with verbal insults face-to-face. Just ignore and don't turn your back. Look the person straight in the eye and don't ever look down.

When he makes a physical move to hurt you, simply slam your palm on his chin or nose and trip his leg at the same time so you slam him on the pavement as the impact of your palm pushes him down while catching him off balance with the leg sweep. End of argument.

Everything else is mental masturbation.

It's a different thing though online.

I wouldn't even bother, why not just simply say "You are not someone i want to be around" and just leave.

Sometimes a girl will use over-the-top teases that may seem very harsh as a means of testing to see how alpha you are. They do this not out of disinterest and sheer-hate but rather because they are interested in you potentially romantically and want to gauge your reaction. She needs to feel safe with you. And if you can't properly stand up to her, then how will you stand up for her - in this competitive, brutal world we live in today.

Furthermore, I agree that only bitchy girls would do this - but is it a good idea to not be able to have sex with these bitchy girls only because you lack the ability to properly respond? Sure, they might not be relationship material but why not have sex with them. I'm of the opinion that bitchier girls are also sluttier.

They aren't, it's just your way of justifying this silly behavior.