Hey guys, I am pretty new at this. I have been using mystery method but am having trouble building attraction and moving sets. Sometimes I ask too many questions and come off as fake and insincere and I feel like girls can tell. Does anyone here use MM? Does MM work or is it outdated as others have told me? If so, are there better methods to use?

MM works but it requires a lot of time and effort. MM is suited to same night lays and women that are of high standards. Keep that in mind.

Regards to your problems it seems like you've identified them yourself. If you want specific help provide more information such as the general interaction with women you go after(For instance tell us your routines, how you approach, when you approach and what a typical conversation goes like).

Personally, the best approach is a hybrid approach to PU. Incorporate Unnatural(MM) and Natural methods. Use MM for it's structure and Natural(Like the Natural) for filling the in between and specifics within your game(Like flow of conversation, approach, opening and when/how to close).

Thanks for the advice. In order to give you an idea I will give you an example of one of my sets last night, and then analyze what I think went wrong.

I walk up to 2 girls (1 attractive and 1 average). I ask them if they would go on a reality tv show (they seem interested). I explain that my friend signed up for it as a joke but they called her back and wanted to bring her on the show. (This did actually happen, but not now, but I pretend it just happened). They give their advice and then I say I have to get back to my friends in a minute.

I ask them how they know each other, make an observation that they make the same facial expressions and then do the best friends test, which goes fine.

Next (this might be an issue) I say their interacting reminds me of a game my friend taught me (the cube), which I saw I will do on them and be able to read their personality. As I am asking the questions to the average looking girl, the attractive girl keeps pulling out her phone and is kind of rolling her eyes, so I start negging her. Some spark and tension is created but eventually she gets mad and walks away.

She comes back and I start talking about myself and my friends to DHV (however, this may have bored them). I tell them I will introduce them to my friends and we should grab a table upstairs. They look at each other for like 20 seconds without saying anything (it looked like the average girl wanted to go, but the attractive girl didn't). Eventually they say they are leaving, which was a lie.

Since I am new at this I am not exactly sure what I am doing wrong. Maybe the friends DHV story is boring. The cube works but I feel it is too try hard. I feel negging is good, but don't know when to stop before pissing the girl off too much. Also, I'm not sure if I should be using kino in the first 5 minutes, how long it takes to hook a set, when I should try to move them, etc.

Even though I am new I have been using a thread similar to this, and have had issues where either the set won't move or they will move, but then after we grab a table they immediately get up and leave. I was making progress before but have hit my first real sticking point. Knowing exactly how to hook the set and then successfully move them.

Please let me know what you think, and give me some advice that could help whether it is switching up structure or something else. I am not quite sure what to do.

Thanks

Mystery Method is like rehearsing a standup comedian show, and will work as long as you have material and can play a role. I would say you should use it if you see women as a piece of meat only, since you will find it hard to take it beyond the second date when you run out of material.

In general, avoid talking about yourself. People usually like to talk about themselves, so if you focus on the girl and talk about her she will most likely be flattered. Besides, if you don't talk about yourself you will remain a bit mysterious. If you want to talk about yourself, which you need to in order to build comfort and trust, and to be able to relate to whatever she is talking about, you should focus on experiences you've had and avoid boring facts (where you live, what you do etc). I think DHV (from MM) is far less effective compared to offering value (from RSD). As long as you are funny (as in interesting and stimulating) you will be offering value.

When you approach a 2-set alone, you need to entertain both girls and give them equal amounts of attention and IOI's to keep them stimulated. As soon as one of them feels like she is freezed out, she will become bored. This can be really hard to do if you are not one of the girl's "type", so don't blame yourself too hard if you fail.

In order to offer value you need to be in state. You need to have a higher energy level than the set, but just a bit. That can be really tough unless the conditions are just right. The so called "law of state transference" (a term from RSD) will drag you down if the mood in the club is bad, and people have low energy. Some would say that you "let" the environment affect you as if it is a bad thing. But it isn't. It's a natural way to pace (from the NLP technique "pace and lead") and build rapport. So you need to put some effort in the interaction (which is the "leading" part, offering value), and hopefully the people who you talk to will offer some value back to feed your energy. If they don't, they will bore you and drain your energy, and you will become boring as well and fail creating attraction. Avoid such sets at all cost, even if the girls are attractive. That is why a girl's personality is so important, and not only her looks.

Hey mate. Your issue is that you're not having enough fun.

Example: You feel that the cube is try hard. Then why do you use it? You're not supposed to rehearse lines that you don't feel real to yourself because the girls can tell that from million miles away.

MM does work but it's too much trouble in my opinion to go by the textbook. MM has concepts which are awesome.

For example, that the interaction has three stages (attraction, comfort, seduction) is widely accepted. The only exception is when the girl is already aroused and you can skip A and C phases, but that takes massive calibration to notice, and is quite rare besides the dance floor anyway.

I don't usually neg on purpose. I'm just trying to keep up the flirty push-pull dynamics. This cat and mouse game that girls just love playing.

My point is: Don't take everything word by word from MM. Focus on the grand picture instead, and work out your own ways. It's nice to have a few routines if you somehow run out of things to say, just to be sure, but having a script all the way is just too robotic, it makes it extremely difficult to keep a fun vibe and very easy to blow yourself out.

As to your question about kino... 5 minutes is too much. You should start touching the girl as soon as it is possible. Here's what I like to do early on...

I notice a girl looks at me, or is bored, or is simply too hot to not open her. So I go over and throw in a little bantering line. Nothing too much or too offensive, just a little bit cocky. Immediately after I open, I take on a body language as if I'm just about to leave. Sometimes I might even turn my back to her, but I'm still looking at her smiling. I do this for a few seconds and then I turn back to her and throw in a light hearted compliment. Something I noticed on her. At this point my hand gestures are already close to her body, almost as if I were to touch her. Once I see that she's comfortable with my hands being close to her body I can tell that she is ready for me to touch her. This should not take more than a minute. I start touching her upper arm, her shoulders, and her upper back to move her around, or to emphasize my point. These touches don't last more than a few seconds and I stand relatively close to the girl so that I don't have to actually move in to touch her, that creeps most women out. Of course later on as I move through the different phases I would touch her elsewhere but that's just going with the vibe pretty much. I hope I could help a bit on how to start kino escalation.

Also, you opened a two set, and as it has been already mentioned, it's not easy to keep both girls entertained. When this happens, I game them equally. I try keeping the entire vibe fun and once they are comfortable with me I will soon leave to let them discuss about me. At this point I can only hope that they don't start fighting for me, hehe, and I usually come back with another guy or even better, a girl to the set. I then look at whether things changed and choose a target depending on that, and isolate her as soon as it is possible. I come back with another person because I can't just leave the other girl alone she will be bored to death, and her friend won't let that happen. Girls appreciate when they see you are socially intelligent.

A three or more set is harder in terms of keeping all of them entertained, but it's easier to isolate from them, because noone will be left alone, just mentioning this for you to keep in mind.

Good Luck on your sarges mate,

Peace,

In$tinct

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I read it. It seemed like a whole bunch of stuff to memorize. I think you just gotta be less robotic and be 'into' the interaction.

As someone who's also using the Mystery Method (Although with just one of his products), I'll also admit to some difficulties in attracting not-so-perfect women. What I do is tone down the negs (Especially the sharp ones) and up the DHVs and sincere comments at the right time. Also to OP, I'd recommend the negs used on this forum along with the ones from Mystery, as relying on his material wouldn't match some girls. You could also make up your own and be natural! (I can't do that for the life of me )