Hey guys - quick question about a probably-pretty-common situation:

There's an HB10 that I've known previously but haven't interacted with in a year, with no prior history. I saw her at an event (no alcohol) where I put in a lot of game and got some promising IOIs. At one point, her friends pointed out that we must be really close while she had her head on my shoulder and my arms around her. We end with her asking to hang out soon to catch up, and some more IOIs (although more subtle).

Felt great!

I text her the next day and set up a day 2 over coffee. She takes like 5 hours to respond to each of my texts, but agrees and we come up with a date and time.

At this point, I was confused so I checked her instagram and find out that she's been in a LDR for the past 2-3 months. Apparently everyone knew except me . I'm guessing she agreed to hang out to be nice.

A day after we confirmed the date, she texts me and says another mutual friend of ours wants to come along as well... I say that's cool.


I love her personality and feel like we meshed really well during the spots of time alone that we were able to spend. I was wondering what you guys' take on this is. Should I cancel the date to DHV? If I decide to just go and have coffee with her/her friend, what frame should I take with me and what should I aim to be the outcome?

Thanks!

You are not going on a date, there's three of you.

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Yep you're fully in the friend zone.

Don't cancel. HB10's are useful wings. Instead, put HER in the friend zone by disqualifying your interest in her. Meet up with her but chat up other women while you're there.

Sounds like the best approach. Though I'm curious - how did I get dumped in the friend zone (for next time's sake)?

This is great advice. I'd also like to add. Charming the panties off of her friends, if one day you'd like a chance to win this target over it is in your best interest to create intrigue and attraction with those that she is in heavy communications with. Women always talk in detail about men they have been with or have attraction too ( its a great way to DHV without having to consciosly try with the target) if done right by you, it can be a powerful tool in building attraction from your target.

Just be sure not to overdue it or create a bad reputation for yourself within her group of friends. Iit is also very important that you do not show your interest at all towards the real target. The less she suspects your motives the better. Also be sure not to reveal your interest for her to her friends.

Just as when one of the boys tells you about how good of a blow job a specific woman gives in that very moment every man he tells instantly gains a little more attraction to her, the same goes for women.

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Seduce their mind and the rest will follow.

What you did wrong:

Mistake #1 - You conveniently left out the reason why you never approached when you first met her over a year ago. She was probably single back then, you didn't make a move and she friend-zoned you back then, just like she friend-zoned you now.

Mistake #2 - Waiting for IOIs before making a move. Classic newbie mistake. Waiting for IOIs is the way insecure guys game women. Hugging is not an IOI. Girls hug EVERYBODY. Old people, ugly people, fat people, relatives. It means NOTHING. It's all about strong eye-contact, your dominant masculine touch and your sub-communications to her. You're not sending the right body language messages to her clitoris, basically. See my posts on the recent IOIs topic: iois-vt175723.html

Hi guys, giving a quick update . I'll be a bit more detailed this time.

I went to meet with HB and her friend yesterday purely for educational purposes and to see if I can learn anything from this situation. Here's what happened:

It started out neutral. I went on to set the frame, and maintained it. We talked for 2 hours before I had to leave for something else.

Throughout, she showed a lot of IOIs. I was particularly observant since that was what I went with the purpose of doing. Here's a few things I noticed:

- Dilated eyes
- Constant/excessive touching (I sat next to her where her friend was in front of us)
- Non-stop playing with hair
- Tries to compete for my attention when I was talking to her friend
- Lots of giggling

At one point, her friend wanted to get a coffee but HB decided to stay and we were left alone for a bit. We talked about a bunch of stuff. While she continued to show the IOIs above, I also noticed:

- Kept looking down and looking around when talking (???)
- Played with hair a lot more
- Kept correcting herself – “blah blah blah..... actually I have no idea what I’m talking about hehe”
- When there was even 1 second of silence, she picked up on conversation even though the topic was honestly kind of dumb

I asked her if she had a million dollars, what two cars would she buy and why. We talked about that for a while, and as soon as her friend returned, she directed the question to her.

^I'm confused about the whole section where we were alone, and what it all meant

Anyways, we finished up after 2 hours. She voluntarily told me her schedule, and I told her what I'm doing. She asked to hang out again next week. I say okay, hug, and I leave.

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My assumption is that she is attracted, but feels guilty?/nervous?, and I also haven't built enough comfort. Do you guys have the same read?

What do you think should be the next step (set up an actual D2? with her alone or in a group?)

Thanks!

I'm going to try again to set up a 1-on-1 d2 next week. What are you guys' thoughts on the above?

One of my biggest pet peeves on this board is when people act like they know everything and they know nothing. At this point, it's pretty clear you're not in the friend zone, if what you're telling me is true.

I'm actually terrible at long term pursuits of women. Typically if I don't start it hot from the get go, I crash and burn, or I give up easily and move on. You sound like you have a good handle on the situation up to this point, so take my advice with a grain of salt.

My read of the situation:

She invited a friend for insurance. Maybe she was afraid of it being a bad date (not likely?) or maybe she wanted a friend's advice after her meeting you (maybe?) or maybe she was afraid of being guilty and figured it wouldn't be a "date" if her friend came along (more likely). You seem to have played it like a pro talking to her friend and having her compete for your attention. Good job.

Anyway, she definitely seems interested. My advice would be as follows:

1) Don't overthink it. She's into you.
2) Don't be too available. I've been getting big into instagram DHV's. I used one the other day, I approached a hot girl with my same shirt and said we had to take a picture together. Put it on instagram. Stupid shit like that.
3) Try disqualifying yourself to feel out the situation. "that's why we could never date" or something. This isn't a magic pill but almost always lets me know where I'm at in the game. (if she shrugs it off, I know I have to work harder... if she disagrees, I know I have her where I want her... etc)

Awesome, thanks for the constructive tips!

Follow-up question regarding point #2. She has a boyfriend, albeit LD. In this situation, does 'don't be too available' still apply? As in, if she feels like crap that I may or may not be interested in her and/or seeing other people, wouldn't she just go back to the BF to find comfort? Or am I thinking too much like a man

Just wondering what your thoughts are on this.

Thanks!