Hey guys,

For the past 2 years, I've been running game and having a good time with all I've learned on this forum (much thanks!). My take on the goal of being a PUA is eventually knowing what you want in a person for a LTR, and after playing the field I think I've met someone worth starting a LTR with.

Of course, there's always gotta be a snag....

I met this girl about 2 months ago through a friend at a club. She's planning on being in my city for about a year. On our first date, we clicked instantly. While getting close and making out in the club, she told me she just broke up with her BF back home (LDR). I assured her I wasn't just playing around with her, so we ended up going back to my place and having sex. The sex was mind blowing and the best I've ever had (and I've been around the block so I know).

A few days after that, she told me that she patched things up with her LDR BF. Now she's feeling guilty about seeing me and staying together with him. I know she really likes me, but there's always gonna be the BF in the picture. I kinda went AFC and told her about how much better I am (she knows this) and how I've done LDR and it's hard to make things work. Also, how it's natural that people in LDR break up when they meet someone close to them who can give them everything they need, blah blah blah instead of a guy that's 10,000 miles away. I've tried running the BF destroyer technique (strawman), but I'm thinking the more time we spend together she'll eventually forget about him. I try not to bring up the BF but she does sometimes. We meet up a couple of times a week, have a blast together, have great sex, but then the BF issue keeps coming up weekly and she says she's confused. She says that her "heart" is 80% mine and 20% his. I told her confidently that I'm gonna get that last 20% and she's gonna be my GF. This may have been a beta move, but I've told her I got lots of options and I can go out and fuck around but I don't want to as I only want to be with her. She knows about my PUA past. It's weird as she told me that even though she has a LDR BF, she doesn't want me to fuck around and that she doesn't want to either. If i do, she says it's over.

I've read other posts by other guys in a similar situation and the advice you all have given them. I know I still should be out there sarging, but I think at this point I'm all about quality over quantity. I know what I want in a GF and she fits the bill. I would try going MIA but she's the type of girl to not initiate contact. I usually call/text her and she always comes out when I tell her to meet up. The other day she suggested we maybe not see each other for a month or so she can figure out her feelings and see who she misses the most, me or her BF. If I went MIA or freeze her out, her BF is still gonna call her everyday so I might lose out on the communication war. Time is also a factor and she's only going to be here for a year, so I think days/weeks without contact would be a waste. She's not much of a talker on the phone or texter, but we always have such a good time when we meet up. Her BF obviously doesn't know about me and he even told her that he wants her to tell him if she starts to like/date someone else but she says she's too weak emotionally to say it. She's met a lot of my friends and they all say we're really good together. The sad part is that she won't introduce me to her friends as most of them know she has a BF back home. Also, she doesn't want to hang out or show PDA downtown as too many of her friends could possibly see us.

I haven't had it this bad for a girl in a long time. Damn oneitis! I'm confident enough I can go out and sarge and pick up girls, but my mind and heart isn't focused on that. I went out with a few buddies to some clubs recently and there were plenty of chances to pull girls home but I didn't. I've always had a few girls on the go at the same time but since meeting this girl, she's the one I'm only seeing. I'm trying not to screw this one up, karma-wise.

That's my situation in a nutshell. I may have left out a few details, but this is the jist of it. I'm trying to be Alpha and non-needy, but I think I'm coming across as Beta, needy and AFC.

So gentleman, please bestow upon me your widsom. Any and all advice/criticism will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

K

_________________
In a world of compromise, some men don't.

So "quality" means:
1.Chick with a BF
2. Can't introduce you to her friends because of BF
3. Only in city for a year (planned at least)
4.Even if she leaves him, you can't trust her.
5. Even if she leaves him, she will need time to get over him.
6. You initiate most contact.

Sorry, dont see this ending nicely. Best case scenario, she chooses you, gets second thoughts as she's not fully over him and she knows you'd be ldr in a yr too and eventually asks for "space."

Thanks for your reply neo87.

When I said "quality", I meant the ideal personality traits and characteristics we all are looking for when thinking seriously about a girl. I'm not just out to get any piece of ass (quantity), but at 35 years old I'm at a point where I'd like some substance there as well. I've set standards for myself now after working my inner game and hooking up with random hotties just for their looks.

She has what I'm looking for in a LTR. Let me address your post:

1) Yes, she has a BF but that's a separate issue from her personality traits. We've all met someone amazing that unfortunately has/had a BF.
2) I get the fact she doesn't want to be perceived as a "cheater", but that can be overcome.
3) True, but there are always options depending on level of commitment
4) I can't trust women in general, but I'd like to see her work to gain my trust
5) True, but with him not here that time will be spent together
6) Yea, I don't know what to do about that

I'm in the "YOLO", "go after what you want", "best things are worth fighting for" kind of mentality right now. It's cliche to say that and "I've never met anyone like her before." But it's all true. I want to take this as far as I can go before going back to the PUA lifestyle.

_________________
In a world of compromise, some men don't.

If she cheats with you, she'll cheat on you. She is NOT quality material. She's also incredibly weak. I think you are kidding yourself here.

This too.
Plus, she is still emotionally attached to him. If you were 80%, she would leave him for you. I guarantee months of back and forth for her between you 2. She will be conflicted for months even if she breaks up with him tomorrow. If you're that into her now, that you are already considering gf status and a yr down the line, imagine how hurt you will be in a year?

Agree with the guys above. There seems to be a lot of rationale being manufactured on your end.

I understand the feeling and I understand the need to glorify her great traits and rationalize the questionable parts. I think that its part of falling for somebody and to an extent, its healthy...but only when balanced correctly.

In this case, you are grossly under-analyzing/judging her bad traits. We all will never have the full picture of how you guys are together, so none of this analysis will be exactly pertaining to your situation...but from the information you've provided, its not looking good.

80% you, 20% him...yet she wants to give herself some time to think about it? This aint 50-50, its 80-20...and you are on the outside looking in. Regardless of her "reason", its a shitty situation for you...perpetuated by her. This makes you a victim on a leash. This doesn't feel very good does it?

The most alpha thing you can do at this point is give her the ultimatum. Be with me or keeping dealing with your oblivious boyfriend.

Your rationale: unless you are dipping into her life at a reasonable clip, she’ll just stop contacting you. This is AFC behavior at its purest form. You aren’t stupid, I think you know the type of situation you are in but you just cant come to terms with it because of the disappointment in your head about finally meeting a decent person, only to realize they have a BF.

There are times to pursue, and there are times to sit back and see what happens. In this case, you’ve used all your ammo and now it’s a strategic waiting game. If she is going to gravitate towards the BF because you aren’t giving her sufficient attention, then you are dealing with a woman that may screw with you in a similar manner.

Like one of the posters above said, if she cheats with him, she’ll cheat on you. I don’t know how I feel about that sentiment, because cheating can be an anomaly or something that happened with various circumstances, maybe not necessarily with malicious intent. However, it is a red flag when you combine it with the fact that she cant make decisions, she obviously doesn’t know what she wants and yet she will sleep with you and keep you interested. That is a clusterfuck of red flags. Its shining light on a much bigger character flaw on her end. She may not cheat on you per se, but problems may arise when her attention-demands are not met by you.

Soak it in and re-analyze. And if you need to take action, be the man and tell her what she needs to do. If she loses sight that you are much better suited for her than this other guy, you shouldn’t be wasting your time anyways.

I agree with the others. Your judgement is clouded here.

Even if the is what you're looking for, timing is everything. Smart people don't get involved with people who aren't cleanly over their last relationship. You're setting yourself up for a lot of pain and suffering.

Show your value for yourself. Break it off with her, and then if she is 80% yours, she will try like a motherfucker to get you back. Stick to your guns and don't give yourself to her until you're 100% sure she is COMPLETELY over the EX bf.

Until then, keep looking for another keeper. She's not the only one, that is a promise.

She`s keeping you on a leash mate. She may even be keeping you in the wings in case she and her bf breaks up. I get that you have a connection with this girl, but I completely agree with the other posters. She`s even got you not sarging other girls, wtf? So, she can have her boyfriend and her bit on the side but you can`t have anyone else?

You need to show her who`s boss mate.

It's this simple - she's just afraid of committing to you. And it's probably got to do with your PUA past. I know from experience. In fact, she told you "if you fool around, it's over". So I'm 100% sure its that she doesn't feel the boyfriend vibe from you. When she said 80%, that means there's an extra 20% of the boyfriend vibe she's not quite getting from you yet.

The only reason she's still 20% with this guy is because she feels safe with him due to past experience.

All you have to do is stick with it, be alpha, show you're reliable, show you've made your decision and that you'll be there and take care of her, and she will feel safe enough to jump ship.

Many guys here will say those things are AFC or something - don't listen. The reason why AFCs do those things is because those are the things we all know men are supposed to do for women - the trouble is that AFCs jump right in and do it off the bad, which is very sad and desperate. But when a girl wants you, and wants to feel safe with you, she needs to see all those things in you before she'll feel safe enough to commit to you.

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I agree with all the guys above.

Really reread the quotes of your post. Keeping you on a leash, having it her way.
You are selling yourself short and she is not chasing you at all.
Forget that she has a BF, What is she embarassed by you? Seems like she feels ashamed to be around you.


I can understand she has everything you want in a woman and that is fine. You have told her you want to be with her, and she knows exactly how you feel for her. Now if she wanted or seriously wanted to be with you, she would drop the LDR BF and be with you. You need to tell her straight out that you enjoy her company and would like to be in a relationship with her but not unless it is only you and her. Drop her at least til she comes chasing you, just to keep your dignity. GO OUT WITH FRIENDS AND TALK TO OTHER GIRLS.

Thanks for all the advice! I totally get where you all are coming from and I should already know all this. This is going to be LONG as I'm trying to address all your points, and to give you all a little more info and insight.

I apologize for the length of my reply in advance, but I sincerely appreciate those who will take the time to read this and reply.

First off, I'm 35 and she's 31. She was previously in an emotionally abusive/neglected relationship for a few years before meeting her current BF. Compared to her ex-BF, this new guy was the exact opposite in the way her ex-BF treated her so I can see why she is still emotionally attached to him after going out for a year and a half. She does have emotional issues, but through no fault of her own. This may sound like I'm defending her, but I'm just giving you her history. She says she feels completely safe and comfortable around me, even more so than when she was with her BF (so she says).

In regards to the "if she cheats with you, she will cheat on you" mentality, I understand that reasoning but I have to agree with Riri's statement:

"cheating can be an anomaly or something that happened with various circumstances, maybe not necessarily with malicious intent"

I've cheated and been cheated on by other girls, but I know firsthand that there are trustworthy girls who have cheated and stayed loyal after the fact. Many many years ago, I met this girl who had a LDR BF. We clicked so I told her to pick me or him. She broke it off with him and we started dating exclusively. After a few months she went back to her home country, we did a LDR for 4 years, she moved back, we got married and stayed together for 9 years. We unfortunately ended up getting divorced as we just wanted different things. Throughout the LDR and our marriage, I know for a fact that she never once cheated or even looked at another guy. So I can see the "Once a cheater, always a cheater" issue may not apply to everyone, so that's what I'm hoping for this girl.

I hear what you guys are saying about the whole 80/20 issue. It's not 50/50, so I should be winning and she should be leaving her BF, right? All she knows about my PUA past/status is that I've picked girls and fooled around lots but not committng to one girl. Trying to DHV, I told her basically I can get any girl I want and I even showed her a list of girls' numbers on my phone that I could call and fuck if I wanted to. But, I also said that she's the only one right now as I'm serious about dating her.

We went out last night on a double date with her cousin and my buddy (they're FWB). I acted distant at first and she was all touchy feely. During dinner, she acted like any affectionate GF would. We then went to the beach and had some alone time. Dropped her cousin and my buddy off at his place, and we went back to my place. Had great sex, went to sleep and dropped her off in the morning.

At no point did I mention anything about our relationship, feelings, or her BF. I just kept it light, funny, and sexual. I actually read your replies before going to bed last night and it gave me a lot to think about, after the sex of course!

So here's my plan: I go MIA for while, go out and sarge. Ignore her calls/texts (if she does). Then when we finally do meet up, drop the "It's him or me routine." She picks me, go with the flow. She picks him, next her and move on.

Thoughts?

Thanks,

K

_________________
In a world of compromise, some men don't.

^Lots of rationalization going on here. Also, women who were in abusive relationships tend to have issues of their own. Generally a woman that's level headed will leave a relationship at the earlier stages of abuse., before it gets bad. When a woman tolerates abuse and stays, it usually means there's something wrong with her, very often fallout from childhood trauma. I hate to sound like a dick, but I avoid girls with history of abuse, because it tends to be what they're looking for (its not a conscious decision, its a pathology. It's also not bullshit speculation on my part. Listen to Dr. Drew Pinsky's opinions on the matter). If you don't become the abuser, they'll get bored and leave (just like she's about to leave her bf, though I'm surprised he lasted this long). Again, these are doctors speaking, not me.

Once a cheater always a cheater: I don't know any girls (or guys) that only cheated once. Think of it like losing your virginity. Once you do it the first time, it becomes much easier, and much more tempting afterward. Aside from that, you just saw how "loyal" this girl was. She's sucking your dick while telling her bf how much she loves him. So far, nothing you said about her tells me that this situation is unique, and that she won't do the same to you.

Honestly, I feel horrible for the boyfriend here. He doesn't deserve this, and she needs to let him go already, and stop using him as an emotional plan B.
As for advice for you, I strongly suggest you keep this relationship FB only. If you let your oneitis get the best of you, I'll be expecting you back on the relationship board not too long from now.

I’m with ZMB here for the most part.

It would be hard to pass judgement on the girls in question because we don’t really know the extent of her situation, BUT there are still tons of red flags popping up left and right. These red flags will be indicators (those red flags also identified by people like Dr. Drew etc.) for whats to come, lots of instability.

Now, some people gravitate towards this (per ZMB’s point). Do you?

I think you are starting to “get it” and I thought that after reading one of your last paragraphs. At this point, the situation will be dictated by what she does (or what she doesn’t do) so have a good time, keep it light and see where it goes.

Personally, she's looking like more harm than good.

BUT, even if she decides on settling down with you, be cautious man. The last thing you want is to be caught up in her current BFs position. What’s worse, you only have yourself to blame.

Good luck.

I agree with the poster who said she MAY be concerned about your past. Missed that perspective. But she could just be trying to have control over you.

But concerning the cheating thing, sounds like the new bf is a good guy. Sure, a girl can be in an abusive relationship and cheat but it doesn't define her. But she's cheating on a GOOD guy. Whether she has lost attraction or not for him, she is showing that when she is unsatisfied she will cheat. Different from cheating because youre being abused. Ask yourself, if she goes long distance, what's to stop her from doing you the same? It sounds like her bf is treating her well. And how would you know if she is cheating? I bet her bf is just like you were in your LDR and thinking she's not looking at anyone else.

No such thing as a "BF destroyer"

Move on, don't be a loser.