Hey Guys,

I have a quick question, because I feel like I lost two sets last weekend because I made a mistake... I'd like to get ya'lls thoughts on it, and see if you've reached the same conclusion I have.

Ex 1
4 girls, sitting on stools lined up at a bar. I see 4 HB8s essentially, they are all one set, it is obvious, but they are all lined up: 4 in a row. So, they are all pretty 'spaced out' or far away from each other.

I see them, walk up, make eye contact w/ girl #3 (in the row) and make a comment about if she is from Greece. (There were flags above their seats nailed to the bar, she was under the Greek flag). Then I say: "Oh, you must be the American Girl" (while turning to girl #4, and pointing to the flag above her). They get the joke/reference that I am making now. I have the attention of the whole set. I start ragging on Girl #3, saying something about how she doesn't look Greek.

Girl 3 and 4 were the ones I wanted, the hottest and funnest looking ones. But, I have attention of the whole set, I realize I am ignoring girls 1&2, so I walk down the line towards them, and say something to them about their flags.

I was in w/ girls 3&4, they were enjoying themselves, it was fun. But, I felt compelled to engage the whole set, and when I did engage 1&2, I kept it brief, and came then came back to 3&4, but it had 'puttered out'. I ran out of shit to say, and when I tried to reengage on the same topic, the momentum was just kind of dead. And, I just sort of turned my back on them, started talking to my buddy and left.

If I had not left to engage 1&2, I could have taken girls 3&4 interaction a lot farther. Sure, I still could have recovered, but I am not a master and am trying to make things easier on me.


Ex 2
3 set sitting at a high top bar, I walk up engaging all of them, no clue what I said. They are circled around the table, and I am essentially right in front of them all w/ Boss like body language saying: "I am here now, so you better be nice or it will be awkward for you".
Ok, we'll start w/ my left to the right again. I talk to them all for a 20 seconds, doesn't really go anywhere amazing, girls 1 and 2 (to my left and directly in front) sort of continue on w/ their own private conversation. Girl 3 opens me, seems into it, and is the hottest one in that set anyway, so definitely was my target.

I talk to her, it is going fine, we chat for a couple of minutes. And then my PUA mind kicks in, and I'm like: 'maybe I should reengage her friends' or I start thinking it is awkward that I am only talking to her. So, I turn and reengage girls 1 & 2, and it is the same vibe where they aren't rude, but it doesn't go anywhere. Blah.

I turn back to girl 3, and it's dead. I guess it is dead because she saw me 'strike out' w/ her friends. Either way, I ejected and felt like it didn't really go anywhere.


Everything I have read says to engage the group, and win over the friends. But, in both the previous examples, I feel like I took a step backwards. I feel like I was already closer to isolation and being able to go into comfort, and then I messed it up.

My conclusion: I'm going to stop trying to engage the whole group when it is too big. Next time I find a spot where I am closer to isolation, I am just going to go w/ it. And worry about the friends and obstacles later.

Ya'lls thoughts?

3 set is tough if you aren't very good reading social cues, directing attention, and controlling the flow of the conversation. Next time, try to get a wingman or something. Or better yet, you can isolate the girl you want but you have to let the girls know that you will be talking to her over where you guys can be seen. You can still work a 3 set but working a 4 set is overkill, in my opinion.

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Yea, I really think I should have just stuck w/ working 2 of the girls out of that 4 set.

I was just thinking, that same night I led a like 6 set later. Because, my conversation flow and reading social ques have actually gotten 100X better do to working at this stuff every weekend for 4 months now.

But, the difference w/ leading that 6 set was, I started off w/ one girl, talking to her before realizing who all she was w/. Then she introduced me to her friend, then I am talking to two of them. Then the rest of the group kind of starts meandering over, then before I know it, there is me, my wing, and about 6 girls around us. Sometimes I am "orating", sometimes we are all having 'side conversations'. But that set actually went really well.

The difference tho, was being able to start w/ one, then two, then eventually the whole set. I could have started w/ the 2 in the 4 set, talked to them for a couple minutes, then worried about meeting their friends. But, only worry about meeting their friends once I was truly "in" w/ the first 2.

I hate to give you this answer, but it's all about calibration.

There are even 2 sets in which you can just engage one girl and isolate her without speaking to the 2nd girl. (Just an example to make my point clear)

Now the real advice I want to tell you is: someone in the set will give you a cue if you need to include the others. This is something fantastic, if you approach a 3 set and you start talking to two girls, the third one will be all alone, but you don't need to include her unless a)The two girls you are chatting turn around to check on her. b) The 3rd girl starts giving negative body language or do something to gain attention.

In my experience the most effective thing is to approach a girl and start talking only to her, if she needs validation she will turn to her friends, otherwise continue and isolate as quickly as possible; during the isolation process the friends will get involved and you just have to apply the cat-door technique on the friends and you are ON.

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Just wanted to say thanks, this advice helped. Especially about the 'calibration' and social cues if you need to engage someone. I had read this the other day, then went out last night. And now I was sitting here journaling some things, and I remembered a set where I did exactly what you did.

Another big 5-6 set of girls or so. I opened one of the girls, started talking, blah blah. Her friends are all huddled, I ask who the bad one and good ones are, blah blah. One of her friends sees me and starts giving us body language. My girl gives me the 'social cues' to include her friend, so I do. Now I'm talking to two of the girls, and this process essentially repeats until I met all of them. Ended up becoming a 'home base' set for us last night.

I guess, subconsciously, I just new how to handle the situation better last night because of ur advice. So thanks, it worked. It was good advice

Engaging the group in a natural way is hard. The best way is go and talk to the group during a right moment when everyone welcomes it. You have to see whether there is a girl you like. Go to the set and make a remark everyone welcomes, then sit down, knowing the eyesight of the girls in the set, now make a remark that leads in a conversation. See the reaction of the girl and kino-escalate. Now hold the tension and go away with the girl or girls. You have to be brave enough to say almost directly that you want the girls to your place. Think out some way that does not kill the attraction and comfort.

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You should know exactly where the girl is and reaction of the girl. When the reaction is positive, then you should talk and approach immediately. Women value strength and similarity. If you wait then it changes the relationship even in the future.