Ive read dozens of posts on here about "natural game" and most of what ive read isnt what id say is actual natural game, i see plenty of routines and pick up lines , but really thats not the solution but rather the problem, natural game is more into techniques of mindset and body language, everyone is a natural they just dont see it in themselves, and lines and canned material definatly dont help, ive heard people say there the "training wheels" of pick up but if you think about it did you need "training wheels" to learn how to be happy or feel emotions, id say not, those emotions were already programmed into your subconsious and its the same thing with being "natural" if we as people feel were of less value then our body (subconsious) will fall into that state of self deprication and it will display we are low value and thats what gets us rejected, when the solution is all in how we precive ourself and what our body language says about how we feel and that becomes understood then we can change our self image physicly and mentaly to ourself and the people around us and become that attractive man we strive to be and that is the definition of natural game.

_________________
if actions speak louder than words then imagine what your intentions are screaming

to succeed you must learn, to learn you must first fail

Id rather be the one in a relationship instead of some guy id pretend to be...

"I like your take on Inner Game. How someone should simply be confident rather then relying on canned lines and routines, which later on, become crutches that hold you back."

_________________
"Let women figure out why they won’t screw you, don’t do it for them.”

actionable exercises enforced with new beliefs is an effect way to becoming a natural.

I agree that we are all natural deep down.

But in order to become a natural you need to reprogram your thoughts.

You need to untrain all the social mimes that don't serve you!

So take actions, and push your boundries.

_________________
http://www.attractiondefined.com/2011/09/14/my-journey/ - Meet and Attract Women Naturally.

I agree with some of the mentality here bu there is something you don't understand. You say, just be confident, its not as easy as saying, "ok i'll be confident now" it takes a lot more than that. Sucess breeds confidence, and failure can degrade it if you let it get to you. I never saw the appeal of canned lines, but i can see why they would be useful, to help get a bit of sucess to build up that confidence.

_________________

Exactly what Florg says - canned material can be a way to test a new way of thinking, so take disqualification for instance. That is not something that comes natural to people, especially towards members of the opposite sex. Also, canned stuff, and all this advice here gives you a network to rely on, and in a way to blame - if you do a canned line, and it fails, you didn't say it right, or whatever, but at least its not because you're ugly, or she hates you or anything - its a way to save your confidence and the more gains you have with it, the more you can use and be flexible later on. They are a good thing for sure!

yes Florg your right, you wouldnt just say ok lets be confident, that is ridiculous but if you use affirmations and body language then all the sudden you feel better and more confident on a subconscious and a conscious level without having to use any canned material and in that you are a natural, another thing it seems to me is that if you need success to be confident then youl eventually fall into an approval seeking state of mind beacuse you have to have that success where as a nautral could care less about success or failure, again this is where body language comes in.. whenever you make tweaks to stuff such as the way you sit stand and walk then your subconscious falls into a confident state of mind and you dont need approval or worry about failure dragging you down

stateofarrest it comes across like your saying canned material is there to blame when you fail that way it doesnt hurt your ego, when really canned material will work most of the time its just how you deliver it so in turn it would be your fault and your just ignoring the problem by blaming the line... if you were to use a naturals technique like mindsets and non verbal stuff then you wouldnt have alot of those problems, its just that why go through all the trouble to remember a bunch of junk that might not work beacuse your focused on lines instead of deliverance and keep adding to your social persona when instead you could be subtracting all the problems and become a better PERSON instead of masking your problems with lines and gimmicks in hope to become a better LADIES MAN

_________________
if actions speak louder than words then imagine what your intentions are screaming

to succeed you must learn, to learn you must first fail

Id rather be the one in a relationship instead of some guy id pretend to be...

If you want more material on the Natural way, go check out Real Social Dynamics! Tyler Durden talks about all that stuff you are ranting about!

Happiness is our default state, we just got social condition to seek happiness from our surrounding instead from within - Tyler Durden of RSDN

Sincerely,

Donston!

I just picked up this book, it's very interesting in this book that happiness brings success. It is based and rooted in psychology and by going over studies.

This is very interesting info, the key to success in anything is being content with what you already have. Being gracious about what you have is a key to happiness.

You will not be a success at anything including pick up until you are happy. Confidence has a direct correlation to happiness. Our confidence is based on our happiness with ourselves and our life.

The foundation of natural game is happiness and confidence. I would add Natural game is a broad spectrum that covers a lot of things. It starts there and ends so much further. If you want to build a great big building you start with the foundation but the greater the building the better the foundation. That said the bigger and greater you want the building, the more you need to add to it. If you want a complete building it needs walls and a roof too.

You need a complete structure, you need to become more attractive for yourself and them, you need to understand women(physically, emotionally, and mentally), read them(body language), sexual confidence, a personal philosophy, understand the courtship process, E-game(FB, Text, Email, etc.), and know and understand relationships(knowing how to avoid them or be in them are both important).

I've noticed so many people learn one thing and don't broaden their knowledge to make them more complete. Natural game is multifaceted. At least that is my take on natural game, more then just confidence, self affirmations, and self image.

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

OKAY,

I think everyone is over-analyzing this just a LITTLE bit (a whole lot).

If you think NATURAL GAME what do you immediately think of? To me it's a jock type guy that doesn't need to THINK about getting girls because it has become SECOND NATURE. Or a high value guy who has created success in his life first and now the whole getting laid or a getting a girlfriend thing has become something of an AFTERTHOUGHT.

Truthfully, natural game is the only form of game there is. There is no such dichotomy between 'canned', or 'natural', it simply IS game, it comes from the same fundamental source, both are just different paths which help point you to the ultimate destination.

I'll agree that if you are that socially anxious and if you simply can't leave the house without something planned to say then canned game CAN be of use, but OVERALL I believe that canned, linear, tactical game will hurt you in the long run. You're like a salesman relying on a script, or a musician that can only play the notes he's given. You are LIMITING your growth and inhibiting your own potential.

Natural game is a journey of rewiring your mind to association approaching with success, and learning that you had everything you ever needed from the start. Instead of looking to add routines, tactics, 'tricks', INTO your personality, natural game focuses on CHISELING DOWN your excuses, rationalizations and projections to reveal that you had everything you needed to seduce a 10 to begin with.

It's more about 'revealing', than adding. And it's much easier and enjoyable learning to improvise and having fun in the field than going thru your 'routine stack', of memorized lines and pick up structures.

_________________
www.blitzkriegdating.com

Learning has more then one stage to it. A natural isn't just confident he gets to a point of unconscious competence with the opposite sex.
A natural has merely learned enough that he has unconscious competence in dealing with girls. That is it. It may not be about adding to your personality but it is about adding information, skills, and tools to your social tool cabinet.

I think your post is awesome, but I just think a lot of people would do well to take into consideration how wide of a topic "natural" game is. How much you have to do to become a complete person it isn't enough to just be confident reveal your personality. It isn't about just confidence, pulling down your layers of insecurities, to reveal yourself, that is the basis of inner game, which is the foundation of "Natural" game but "Natural" game or uncanned style or however we want to put it is also about adding social skills, experience, and knowledge so that you can adjust in each situation.

Don't act as if you can just work on inner game and Natural game is easy. It isn't, even after you have a solid foundation for your confidence if it is thinner then you think one girl or situation can break it right in half. It is very difficult to be able to go talk to someone and be comfortable and fluent. To make them smile, have the right body language, etc. Inner game is different then natural game.

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Great post to poeticlyskuac and BlitzkriegDating! I believe you guys are both right. If you combine both of your post together, I believe you get the essence of Natural game. When I say combine both of your ideas, I speak of that natural game consists of applying your inner game (BlitzkriegDating) and outer game(poeticlyskuac)! I would like to give you guys reference points, but I am unable because my current points are below 1 :p.

To me the significant difference between Natural Game and canned material is getting good of picking up girls either in the long run (natural) or get immediate results(canned materials). When you want to become a natural, studying and learning "game" is a journey, while canned material is almost a magical pill that will make girls instantly attracted to you.

When I talk about inner game I mean inner game will be represent your self acceptance. Where you believe that you are entitled to attract a girl, and know that the girl will like you for who you are ^_^. Outer game is the self improvement portion, of areas where you have to improve yourself. Example of this to jump at the opportunity of approaching a girl with out hesitation or going in your head and making excuses or leer at them. Another example of self improvement is asking or taking girls home, knowing through experience and cultivation that this do able. That through experience you are able to believe that you can do this. For even though you've self accepted yourself doesn't mean you will do the above example.

I believe it's like 80% self acceptance (inner game) and 20% self improvement (outer game). Part of "being the shit", is seeing reality for what it is! Were you accept yourself and think that you are awesome. But, at the same time you also have to take action, and learn through repetition to how to take those actions.

Great post everyone!

Sincerely,

Donston

I agree with everything you've said except for your estimation.

You build inner game and confidence thru natural game and experience. This is the rewriring process I was talking about earlier. Your outer game is merely the vehicle or the payload for your inner game and personality to travel thru. If you have great outer game but no inner game you will be a shallow, uninteresting person in the long run.

You find out who you are (inner game), by facing adversity and pushing your pain barriers. Inner game is absolutely everything and in my opinion should be the goal. Because let's face it, I can teach a guy to be a good conversationalist and get good 'reactions', from women in less than three months. It's not hard. But in order to gain that sense of entitlement and conviction you see in guys can take a lifetime, especially if it conflicts with what a guy is conditioned to think (which I think is 90% of guy's problems). You need to ASK for what you want and feel like you are WORTH it and you deserve it in order for it to even be realistic to the other person.

Yeah of course social skills and outer game intuition is important. But it's only a mechanism to display your personality and to let her know that you cognizant of who you are, what you value and that you truly UNDERSTAND that you deserve the best of everything in life. If guys came into the community with that kind of feverent conviction there would not be a community at all.

_________________
www.blitzkriegdating.com

This sentence explains it the best, really!
We are all programmed by society to feel unhappy, unconfident ( as men ) - or in general - anything that is considered as a problem.
If you do not get my point, you better watch the film " Matrix ", this might help you

If everyones happy with their ( love ) life , who would buy products to attract girls ( jewelry, nice cars,clothes whatever ) or even participate at dating workshops to upgrade their skills?

No one, we would be bad costumers, that is the point.
Ofcourse this sounds ridicolous but I´ve seen so many guys acting like a Casanova just because they have all the money and nice things to attract girls - snobs who act like pussys when it comes to girls and how to treat them - thats the truth about today´s manhood.

Blitz,

I'm not trying to put down inner game, I'm merely trying to point out that it is the beginning of a journey not the end of it. I am a huge supporter of inner game, and am always making sure that I am building my confidence. I hope that you don't perceive me as a mainly exterior guy, I'm not. I had all the skills to build the attraction early on in my journey, lots of young woman were attracted to me. My problem was inner game and ignorance, I didn't know what I needed to know about courtship, people, and attraction. Otherwise I would have been far more successful with women my first year in college.

Inner game is the foundation, I don't know how else to put it. You can have a great foundation but you don't have shelter without the building on top. Or you can have a building(social skills) with no foundation and the building just collapses because it wasn't built on anything.

Inner game is the most important part of "natural" game but it by no means stops there is all I'm saying.

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

I somewhat disagree with these SPAM, i agree on the fact that inner game is a foundation....

but it takes your hypothetical building as you put it to establish that foundation, with slight tweaks inthings like standing up straight and improved eye contact smiling the mind will follow the body and you will naturally feel and come across as more confident, so by working on your outter game you improve you inner game,the main point i make in my post is that your subconsious is what ? ... YOUR BODY LANGUAGE , thats it, when you can understand the correlation between bodylanguage and your thoughts, and that there directly linked to one another than you truely understand the point of natural game, which is why people comletely ignorant of pua can pick up girls beacuse they have the correct body language, to best put it its like the water cycle, water evaporates then it rains... you feel good your bodylanguage comes off as positive vise versa... your body language is positive you feel good. its as simple as that![/b]

_________________
if actions speak louder than words then imagine what your intentions are screaming

to succeed you must learn, to learn you must first fail

Id rather be the one in a relationship instead of some guy id pretend to be...