Exactly Starbuck.

Another example using that same fictional guy, "Brian."

Let's say Brian is at a house party with five attractive women.

Tanya, Linda, Janet, Michelle, and Brenda.

Let's say, Starbuck and I know ahead of time that Michelle is interested in dating Brian, and Brenda is interested in having kinky, casual sex with Brian.

Now if Brian was exhibiting Mode One Behavior, he would be able to identify within 5 - 10 minutes ... 15 minutes max ... that Tanya, Linda, and Janet were simply not interested in him. This would benefit Brian by giving him more time to converse with Michelle and/or Brenda.

But let's say Brian has read the book, "You can get ANY WOMAN to RESPOND FAVORABLY TO YOU in TEN EASY STEPS!!!" This book tells Brian that "All rejection can be overcome and conquered. You just have to be persistent and adhere to all of my principles!!!"

What does Brian do?

He wastes literally HOURS trying to convince Tanya, Linda, and/or Janet that they are really attracted to him. He keeps bugging them, boring them, and engaging them in endless annoying conversations. Why is he doing this? Because he doesn't believe that rejection is even an option.

Starbuck says, "Yo bro. Chill with those three. There are two other women in here that are digging you...." Brian says, "Yeah, I'll get to them in a little while. But I have to 'close' these three women first!!"

Starbuck and I just look at each other and shake our heads.

Trust me ... there are a lot of "Brians" out in society making fools of themselves.

Allow me to clarify my statements, as it seems you have interpretted them diffrenly then I intended.

If you don't believe then you cannot achieve... thats simple.

For instance as long as you maintain you belief that you would lose in a fight to a UFC champion there is absolutely no chance you could ever win.

So belief must be there in order for sucess to happen, that is not the only thing we require to suceed however. A common misunderstanding when interpreting belief systems and there effects is to assume that just by believing miracles will happen... not so.

Cost vs. Reward comes back... you have to be willing to do whats needed to beat the UFC champion... it may take years of training to do it... but if you believe and put in the required cost. You WILL gain the result.

On the flip side... you can put in the required cost... even more then the required cost and be far superior... however if you still held that belief that you cannot beat the UFC champion... you will never be able to do it.

Cleaning up a homeless man and having him read a few books may not be his required cost to be able to attract Jessica Alba... but it's the same thing... with belief if you put in the required cost you will achieve... without the belief it doesn't matter what cost you put it... because you will never be able to overcome your own belief system.

I'm not advocating to anyone that they should be lazy, and not put in the required cost.

I think what your doing is quantifying the required cost, deciding if you think it would be worth it (Cost vs. Reward) and calling the ones tha are not worth it impossible.

Now I agree, we should decide which women are worth it... and the one's that require exemption amounts of work will most likely not be worth it... but never impossible.

This may all seem like a big deal over the use of one simple word or concept... but having words like impossible or never in the vocabulary you use to desribe your belief system is the diffrence between being mundane or revolutionary... good or great.

I think it's all part of calibration of how direct you want to be but I also think its so necessary to express you true desires for a woman . As I've read some of the post on the forum about guys being stuck in the friend zone or working on a particular girl for long periods to no avail. It reminds me of some encounters with men in the past. It shows me "Oh so he's been plotting on how he's going to get sex from her eventually but he's beating around the bush big time and worried about rejection......"
one particular mode in Alan's book struck me big time and that was
mode 4(the revenge seekers the guys that are frustrated and go balistic on women. i had an experience with a few mode 4 personalities that I won't go in details about their behavior but they were similar to what Alan describes in his book about the the guy deep in friend zone who pretty much loses it with the woman as an act of revenge when he finds out other guys have had sex(rather quickly) with the same girl he's been after for quite awhile with no hope in sight.
think their are high points to a lot of PUA methods but some paint a happy fake reality of how things really are because they do appeal to the masses.

I also wanted to add type "LJBF" in the search function.

I see most of these situations could and should have been prevented simply by being more direct from the start

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I'm almost as sweet as lemon juice... almost

I understand Doc's point and it's also a good one, as long as it doesn't cause one a false sense of security, or cause them to overestimate their abilities. Overestimation that Mode 1 points out can sometimes have consequences beyond the obvious.

I still maintain there is a fine line between being positive beyond the evidence, or the reality that is staring you in the face, and being positive that you can achieve something tangible.

For instance many people believed that the earth was flat at one time, or that the Titanic was 'unsinkable'.

Although most rationale minds of the day knew these beliefs were unlikely if not all together impossible based upon the evidence they could observe. And no amount of positive thinking could make them true.

Another example would be me, at 46 challenging Chuck Liddel or Rampage Jackson to a UFC fight. No matter how much I positively believed I could win (which would be unlikely, maybe even impossible), the ultimate outcome would be simply that I had a hard lesson to learn probably by getting my face bashed in. That's certainly not a lesson I need to learn the hard way.

This is simple philosophical disagreement, and perhaps one of experience.

It sort of reminds me of a young man that thinks he's indestructible. Then survives long enough to learn that he isn't after all. Or doesn't and hence never learns.

We can believe whatever we choose. But our beliefs by themselves doesn't make something true or false. And when these beliefs conflict with physics or reality we have to make adjustments to our beliefs based upon experience or education.

Of course the problem with some people is they never make such adjustments, and cling to their irrational beliefs regardless of the reality that is staring them in the face, and the feedback they are getting from others. Then they tend to look outside themselves for something to blame for this lack of congruence. Often it's somebody else.

Ok, enough of the philosophy lesson.

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

I have read enough off the ancillary information about your book to get the just of it.

When you approach a woman, there is already a pre-conceived notion if they are attracted to you or not (or discovered very quickly in the beginning of the interaction). Discard the ones that are not attracted. Even if they are attracted, this does not mean that you can 'get' them. Using 'Mode One' communication techniques, you can 'get' the rest.

Is this a correct synopsis of your 'method'?

I read your 'Verbal Seduction' anecdotal evidence of proof of the worthiness of your material. It carries a striking resemblance to DeAngelos material, including the funny portion. If you read my signature line, it is a compliment comparing it to DD.

Beyond that, it is only the beginning of becoming a PUA. Everywhere I read your material it all came down to one thing. The woman has the choice. You only get to work within her choice.

I do not ascribe to this theory. It has always been my choice and it always will be. (Before I get any other silly non-related analogies, I do not mean physically forcing them, or following them around like a puppy dog, or stalking them where they are going to be at, or peeking through their windows, or berating them into liking me, nor can I fly)

Depending on how much effort (Ditto Doc) I am willing to put in, determines my options(choices).

What I do not understand is, how does a self proclaimed 'Interpersonal Communications Expert' not understand the value (or so it seems, even the concept) of seducing anyone beyond just getting in their pants?

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Recommended reading list.

Double Your Dating by DD
(This will work on your inner game)

http://www.freewebs.com/xfman/
(This will work on your outer game)

Valences

It's more so this situation case: Did YOU place the girl in the friend zone for your own reasons being she doesn't meet your standards? Or Did you unwillingly fall in the girl's friend zone category while you continue to secretly lust after her?

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I'm almost as sweet as lemon juice... almost

Who are you talking about Claire?
What does this mean?

Which friend? I do not 'pine' after girls while pretending to be their friend.... It is counter-productive.

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Recommended reading list.

Double Your Dating by DD
(This will work on your inner game)

http://www.freewebs.com/xfman/
(This will work on your outer game)

When the Wright Brothers decided to break the age old wisdom that a man cannot fly, it is simply not possible.

They didn't just jump off a bridge and hope for the best... the first believed it could be done which set them apart from all the people who couldn't do it in the past... then they set out to make it happen.

Going back to the world is flat comment... the people who believed the world was flat and no other way are the exact opposite of what I'm saying here... they blindly believed that it was impossible to go past the horizon because the had been told that there whole lifes and it was part of there belief system.

Columbus believed that it was not impossible... and we all know how the story go's after that.

I also like to bring up case studies that have been done on people with multiple personality disorders... Did you know often that these people will have drastic changes when they switch personalitys? Eye color, complection... why? How? Isn't that imposible? To actually change our genetics? It's because they truely 100% believe they are this other person.

The mind is the most powerfull intrument in the world... and it values congruency over all else... what the mind can see and believe... you can achieve.

As I said before... transformational vocabulary may not be needed if you want to be good, or average... but to be great, it is a must. Everyone who's ever changed an opinion that was once held as impossible, had to truely believe in order to do it.

I dont know your particular situations Valence I'm just saying thats a typical case. And it can be seen all over this forum

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I'm almost as sweet as lemon juice... almost

Jessica Simpson there are millions of guys who would give there left testicle for a night with her. There are also thousands guys who wouldn't want to touch her in this lifetime for whatever reason.

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I'm almost as sweet as lemon juice... almost

I'd have to pre-qualify her first..

What do you think? I'm easy or something..

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

wait WTF is the point of that post?


Also Alan, I went and read your history of mode1 from your site.

It reminds me alot of the "GM style" ... which I have always used (naturally before I learned they had a name for it)

I definatly agree that direct game can be usefull when done properly... the tricky part for someone just starting out is getting your confidence and bodylanguage strong enough.

Kind of reminds me of Cavemaning... quick and effective if you have the balls and bodylanguage to pull it off.

Only down side is you leave gapping holes in your full attraction... so I would never try to have an actual relationship with a girl I direct game (maybe I should say I'd never try again to, lol)... because it just works out poorly.

I'll take this one Claire.

It simply means that even if you looked like Jessica Simpson, it still doesn't mean you can seduce or pick up 'any' guy you want.

Oh heavens no. Some of us have standards.

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

Yes

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I'm almost as sweet as lemon juice... almost

Here are my basics:

When there is a woman you meet who you happen to be interested in, there are generally 3-4 ways you can about expressing your interests...

1) Express your romantic and/or sexual desires, interests, and intentions in an upfront and straightforwardly honest manner. This is what I refer to as Mode One Behavior.

2) Engaging that woman in pleasant, entertaining, and flattering "small talk" and "chit chat" first ... then ... at some point later on ... you finally acknowledge what your true desires, interests, and intentions are. This is what I refer to as Mode Two Behavior.

3a) Avoiding approaching a woman at all. You might stare at her ... fantasize about her ... but you never make an attempt to approach her. This would be what I refer to in my book as a Mode Three "Timid."

3b) You approach a woman, but you almost immediately "pretend" as though you want nothing more than a good, long-lasting 'platonic' friendship. Deep-down though, you have a strong romantic and/or sexual interest in this woman. You play the role of the "listening ear", and you do various things to try to "impress her." This is what I refer to in my book as a Mode Four "Target."

When #2, #3a, and/or #3b causes you disappointment, frustration, and/or bitterness, this is when you tend to exhibit Mode Four Behavior.


Doctor: I'm all about increasing your confidence to the highest level. In that area, we agree.

But here is where I differ from you, and/or others:

It's one thing for me to step out on the basketball court, and firmly believe that I can hit every shot I take. Consequently, once the game ends, my stats are 29 for 47 (roughly 62%). Given that most basketball players have a Field Goal percentage of 45-50% or less, I'm pleased.

But it would be another thing for me to play that same game ... take the same number of shots .... but instead of being pleased with my performance, I say to myself (and others), "Damnit! I can't believe I missed eighteen shots!!! That's horrible. I have to get back in the gym and modify my shot. Something is wrong. I'm doing something wrong. When eighteen of my shots are not falling, I must be doing something wrong!!!"

See the difference Doctor? In both situations, I believed that I would hit every shot I took, otherwise I wouldn't have attempted 47 shots.

But in the latter scenario, I unrealistically believe that I should have hit 95-100% of my shots.

This is how some men are when it comes to attracting and/or seducing women. I know some guys that literally believe that every single woman they talk to should reciprocate their interests. And I'm saying, that is never, never, ever, ever going to happen.

Mode One guy: Approaches the ten hottest women at a social event; Six of those women reject him, two express an interest in a dating relationship, one expresses interest in long-term casual sex, and another simply wants a one-night stand or a weekend fling.

This guy is cool with those results.

Mr. "Unrealistically Confident": Approaches the ten most beautiful women at a social event; The first four or five women he talks to reject him, and he cannot accept this. In his mind, he believes, "I know I can attract these women. I know I can. I just need to modify my game a bit, and be more persistent." Instead of concentrating on the three or four women who might be interested in him, he keeps going back to talk to the women who have already rejected him.

Then, once he leaves the event, his confidence is low because he feels like he's done "something wrong." So he goes out and buys his 25th new and different book on "Attraction & Seduction Made Easy!! You can seduce ANY WOMAN YOU WANT TO in one week or less!!"

I'm saying, that is bullshit. That second guy is never going to have success with every woman he meets. NEVER. The quicker he realizes that, the better off he will be.

But if he keeps being "unrealistically confident," he's going to keep modifying and changing his approach and "techniques," end up even more frustrated and bitter in the long-run.

My thoughts.