Hey J a lot of these responses have helped me a lot with opening. Although before I read this I had already opened with an HB7 and she is replying although it seems like we are stuck in this loop of common questions, and it is getting boring. All these simple pleasantries are making me come off very AFC and im having a difficult time creating attraction, more comfort. I was wondering what can I do to take it to the next level and eventually take it beyond OKC to a face to face interaction where I know I can create that attraction. I asked about her hopes, dreams, goals. she replied jokingly making it to 100, and her aspiration to be a translator, something she is currently working on. Any help would be very appreciated.

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Here to learn, improve, and contribute.

Hi J I'm sure this has been asked already but what's a good headline when creating an online profile on a dating site? (I'm doing POF)

and any tips on making the body of the profile interesting? Whenever I create those I feel like I stated myself well but it seems lame and I just know everyone else has the same thing going.

I usually do something like


"I'm Jeremy. I'm 24 years old and living on my own in Frederick,Maryland. I work for Life Technologies Monday through Friday and I chill and do whatever I want Saturday and Sunday.

My hobbies include doing magic tricks,playing tennis,chilling a bars and having a few drinks with friends and playing videogames.

Some of my goals are upgrading from my apartment to a house, learning to cook more foods and finding a women I can spend the rest of my life with.

What makes me unique is the fact that one of my hobbies is learning new magic tricks to show off. I enjoy showing children and adults my tricks because nothing is more priceless then the reactions I get when I preform a trick well.

I'm not picky on music I listen to it all from Country to Hip-Hop."

advice/help is very much welcome!

I have a very simple but difficult question...

What is a good method for gaming online on sites like Facebook or Myspace?

I'm 16 and getting tired of how many unattractive girls attend my school and want to expand outward.

Cheers Mate!

i've sent you a Pm but if you want me to post it here again i will..

i have some ideas being tossed around in me head, but would like your advice first

Much Obliged

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"J, I guess yer so amazing in bed you send the girls into a transcendent state where they realize their own mortality and are shaken by the realization that their presence bears little impact on the universe, or they just realized they hate you"
-DJ_Z

Ladies and Gentleman....boys and girls of all ages we are open for business again! That's right after some time away from the community to reflect, gain life experience, and just have fun I'm back! I am here to aid you in your online dating adventures. Everything from talking to the girl online to moving her to a seat in front of you.

There are some things you should be aware of as a poster. First and foremost I do not advocate meeting people on Facebook / MySpace or other social networking sites but I will help the best I can. You should also know that you can always private message me if you have a more personal matter. That being said let's get on to the rules.

For those that don't know me know that I am direct and to the point. I'm not some 16 year old spitting game for the first time... I'm 30 years old and seasoned at this. I won't beat around the bush and will get to the heart of the subject. I've been in the community for 4 years meeting and attracting women. I've written books on meeting women online. I have beed a moderator of this forum and other forums. It's pretty safe to say that I know my stuff. I may not be right 100% of the time but my life experiences guide me in the right direction.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twgArtVqMlM[/youtube]

1. Please do not post 20-30 minutes of Instant Messaging conversation. I will not read a page long of IM's back and forth. Please summarize your conversation, and if you must, then include a specific log of you two talking.

2. I love to write but I'm not you're personal writer. I will answer all kinds of "How do I..." questions, but please take my responses and put them in your own words. If you do not, when you meet the girl she will notice there are incongruencies very quickly. The way I say things might not work for you, so take the concept and then write your own response please.

3. Ask anything you want but let's make sure it's related.

4. If I don't immediately know the answer, I'll tell you and research some possible solutions and then get back to you. Don't be offended if I don't get right back to you. I am online typically more during the work week, and will make every effort to answer you in a timely manner.

5. If you have a private matter, I encourage you to post it on the thread so others can help, but if you don't want to post on the thread feel free to PM me!

6. If you ask a stupid question be prepared for a stupid answer.

7. Have fun & ask away!

THANKS EVERYONE!!!

J-Smooth!! I've been reading your replies on this thread and damnn you are smooth!!

I don't have any specific online dating questions at the moment, but I do want your opinion on certain things.

Related question:
What's your favorite online dating or social sites for finding chicks? (other than fb). I always feel like online dating sites are full of fat girls and fake profiles, but I haven't tried it so I could be wrong. What do you think, any suggestions?

Sort of unrelated question:
Do you think it's hopeless to get a girl to like you if you fall into the friendzone? There's a girl who used to show me tons of IOI's, cuddle with me and sleep over, and we used to flirt and be playful with each other. She loves hanging out w/ me and thinks I'm really fun and cool (according to her). When I'm gone for too long she always says that she misses me and is lonely without me, but I don't know if she really means it. Sometimes when we used to go out and get drunk, she would be all over me with her arms around, but when I go for a kiss on the lips she moves away.. she's always a tease. I've been cocky, funny, and flirty with her as I am naturally so she would see me sexually and not just as a friend. And I try to kino whenever I can and usually she lets me or kinos back... sometimes I can't because we're with mutual friends and it looks awkward in front of everyone. Even after all that though... I still think I'm in the friendzone with her. Her sister even told me that she would never date anyone in our friends circle as she sees all of us as best friends/brothers. It sucks because I find myself thinking about her a lot, and I have a feeling she's attracted to me in certain ways, but ultimately still sees me as a friend. If i'm in the friend zone should I just try to move on? Do you have any advice for me on how I can be less of a friend and make her want me? Don't some girls prefer being friends w/ a guy first before doing anything else? Fuck...

Also, if she says sweet things to me, like IMs me saying 'i miss you!' or 'i love you!'.. should i be sweet too? Sometimes I say 'i miss you more!' (cuz im a sweet guy lol), and sometimes i'm like... 'haha you're silly'. What do smooth players like you do?

Btw I'm 23, she's 21... and we've known about each other for like a year, but we became close and started hanging out in the last 4 months.

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Some people are like slinkys, not really good for anything but make you smile when you push them down the stairs.

I really enjoy using OKCupid. It ranked as the best free dating site for the past few years now. It's a lot like Match.com and has a lot of features of it but it's completely FREE. It has a free APP you can use for smartphones to keep tabs on who's viewing your profile, who's near you at the moment, and more stuff.

Outside of OKCupid... PlentyoFish and SingleNet I've also had good experiences with. Match.com is another one that I have had good luck with in the past even though there is a monthly fee for using their service.

I have noticed that on OKCupid and Match you have more women looking for relationships it seems than on PlentyOFish and Singlenet. I think it's just the mindset that the site brings on itself.
First of all, this is not related to my Online Thread but that being said I'll answer it because your my first post since I've come back. I fall don't really fall into that trap personally a lot. Basically, you have a few options as typically is the case with this.

1.) You can keep trying to physically escalate things and see if she stops you again. Based on your post it seems like she'll stop you again if you get too close to breaking that "friend" barrier.

2.) You can always try telling her how you feel about her. Likely, she'll give you the LJBF speech or she'll confess to having feels for you too. She could say she likes you too a lot but doesn't wanna ruin the friendship type of thing. This could either A. cause you to be in an awkward position killing the friendship or B. you'll be in the same place you've always been.

3.) You can just accept her as a friend and find someone else.

More or less those are you options. There is no real magic or super cool spell I can tell you to say that is going to make her fall in love with you and sleep with you. Knowing her that long I'd say you're firmly in the friends zone.

One of the things you need to do in order to avoid this problem in the future is setting the expectations for what you want in the relationship before it goes too far. Whatever those expectations are that you want "Relationship, Dating, Friends with Benefits" whatever just set them up front. Women may not always be down for it but will respect you for being honest about it.

The other thing is to really work on building up the attraction using push pull statements, ramping up the kino, and doing other things to push the attraction. When you met her you obviously gained comfort and trust with her which is good but you needed to get the attraction in at that time. It's difficult to go back and do this but not impossible.

Bottom line is you have to decide if this girl is worth going after for a relationship at the possible cost of your friendship.

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Been around the world twice, Talked to everyone once...

It's great to see this outstanding thread finally get unlocked. I asked these 2 questions on the Online board, but they didn't elicit much of a response. I actually wanted to ask them on Jon's excellent sticky instead, but it was locked at the time.

1) I know you said Jon in the previous reply, not to use social networking to meet women and I don't disagree. As we all know, MySpace is as dead as a dinosaur, Google Plus has been surprisingly very poorly marketed by Google and Twitter is mostly totally useless, in that it's used primarily for business marketing and networking purposes.

My question though, partially relates to Facebook, which I myself don't currently use and also relates a bit to avoiding flaking on online dating sites as well, which is pretty huge with hotter females, who tend to get heaps of messages.

I acknowledge that if one is pretty keen on expanding their social circle, they probably need to use Facebook, where even though it's not a dating site, it's feasible to possibly get dates from it, from friends of friends who may add you, if they're in the same city as you are, or possibly even if they're overseas and you're intending to go visit their country and want to arrange a face to face meet up.

A problem I sometimes notice, is that some females seem to be using Facebook as a much easier way to flake, when asked for a phone number. I'd be very grateful Jon, if you have any helpful suggestion/s on what tactic/s guys can use and/or say to female/s met or approached in the real world, irrespective whether a guy does, or doesn't use Facebook himself.

The same can apply to a lady met in person, or on a dating site, saying to a guy, to EMail her at an EMail address given, then when he does, she flakes and doesn't even respond back. After exchanging 1 or 2 messages on a dating site, I don't have a problem with a lady giving an EMail address to a guy, to message her outside of the dating site, but I'd prefer to press for a phone number in a fun and non demanding way, to arrange a meet up, since that's why you're both on the dating site for.

This is just based on a friend I saw doing a couple successful approaches, who was doing everything right, but a lady told him to Facebook add her and she'd give him her phone number on there, which she flaked on doing. What I want to ask is :

A) how do you maintain a fun vibe, while also saying that you're not looking for a penpal and that you're also uninterested in using Instant Messaging, but that you're looking to meet up in person, within about 4-5 messages maximum. It'd be foolish to expect to an in person meet up, after only 1 message exchanged, but I'm sure it sometimes happens.

B) If a guy does an approach in the real world, he starts conversing, then when he gets round to asking a lady for her phone number, if she says friend request her on Facebook instead, to start talking on there and then she'll give him her
phone number to him there. There may be cases where this is done and a lady actually does add a guy, then after talking a bit on Facebook to see he's normal, she may give her phone number, like she said, to arrange a date, or meet up somewhere.

I can understand a lady saying this, if a guy approaches her and either she, or the guy, mentions being under a time constraint, or both mention being under one, so the talk of Facebook adding comes up.

But when when a guy later does look her up on Facebook, she flakes on him and doesn't even add him like she said she would, so he can start messaging her on Facebook, that's what I want to avoid. As you know, if your Facebook friend request isn't accepted first, in most cases you can't message someone on there, as some people choose to make their Friends list totally private and not visible to anyone.

2) When messaging lady, how do you suggest guys successfully deal with what I'd call 'incongruence' in real female profiles on standard dating sites and not on adult dating ones. I mean ones where along side more standard profile photos,
a lady may have one, or maybe a couple photos, showing what impressive cleavage and figure she has, via her wearing a bikini, or revealing attire, to:
A) either get a rise out of guys, for attention seeking – validation purposes and she isn't actually up to meet in person for a date.
B) show that she knows she has a great figure, because she looks after herself and exercises, or she may like being photographically 'creative', in knowing she's in shape and is actually up for meeting and dating, but may be fussier, in seeking more better looking, or much fitter guys.

Some females in this 'category', also sometimes mention having been bombarded with mostly crap messages in their profile, may say to only contact once and not keep messaging repeatedly, plus not to contact if you're a player, or you're only a friend with benefits, yet she's showing what nice cleavage and what a hot figure she has in 1, or 2 pics.

I mention this, to ask if a guy could :
C) refer to a lady's specifc profile photo, in a humorously witty way and/or tease her for being an attention whore, without being a moronic AFC, by saying what nice boobs she has, or how hot she is. If so, how do you suggest a guy do that.
D) compliment her on having a great figure, then ask what she does to stay in shape in a witty way, either seriously or humorously.

E) ask if she's actually up for genuinely meeting in person, or is only on the site for attention - validation seeking reasons.
F) suggest another creatively witty photographic pose she'd look cooler in, in either the subject line or in the message body, to take of herself and/or of yourself in it as well. If you reckon that's a clever tactic, what type of witty subject line/s, or opening message comment, would you suggest using. This is something most AFC guys badly screw up, as using humorously witty teasing and watered down negs (as opposed to full on ones) is advanced online game.

This was a question and then someone's response, I saw on another forum, on this subject, that was only partially helpful.
- 'Why is it that on PoF, or any other similar standard dating site, do some women show on their profile, slutty pictures and maybe one showing nice cleavage, then always have at the bottom 'Must not be looking for Intimate Encounter'. It's like they're advertising sex, or being horny in a way, but when you bite, it's ha ha got ya, 'relationship'.

- Okay guys, I've seen a lot of these girl profiles around, so I know exactly what you mean by it and I've messaged a whole range of different women online, so I figure I can speak with a bit of authority on this matter. Never message a girl with anything relating to sex. Even if a girl has a picture of her bare ass and has sex listed in her interests, it just ain't time bro! Take a chill pill. Girls get freaked out when a guy propositions her for sex online. They don't like it, it's a massive turn off and think about it, you're lowering yourself for doing it. Why would you want sex with someone just from seeing a tit pic? Yeah I know the answer, but you got to think about it, as if you were a woman. You need to build that connection first, before you even think about sex.

Listen right, you're a guy, she already knows you want to fuck her, so why tell her? Even if this girl did just want a quick fuck and in all my time trying to find such a girl, I've only ever found one that actually just met up to fuck and nothing else, then she's going to want to go on a date first anyway. Focus on getting that date and nothing else. You need to impress her with your messages, DHV and all the rest. cocky & funny, whatever. All the old tricks. When you get her on the date and by date I mean 'let's grab a drink on Thursday', you have to do all the same again! Don't talk about sex! I met up with a woman advertising that she wanted sex, that she wanted to release her slutty inner child. Guess what, she bored me with when I met her, about her fucking job. I didn't give a fuck about her job. I wanted this girl to just come out and say some shit about fucking, but it never came and I was so nervous about the whole thing, I blew it before we ever got there.

I also met a girl who said shit about charity in her profile and our chats were about everything, but sex and sexuality. I took her out for a drink, we chatted about a whole range of stuff for 3 hours never once mentioning sex. You think this wasn't going to lead up to sex? Then you're a fool. On the first date, I had her on my car, fingers inside her, all initiated by her and not one mention of sex, came out of my mouth. This girl was wild too, I'd never met a girl so into sex that it scared me. If she was a little bit hotter and less toothy, I'd have kept her around for more than 3 dates. Sex and attraction is natural, you don't need to talk about it to get it. See any mentions of sex, of suggestive shots as the shit test that they are and don't take the bait, as it'll only mean more ladies for me.

Wow, I got confused in all that for one question so let me summarize to make sure I understand you question. You are asking what a guy can do in the real world to avoid getting an email address or a Facebook friend me thing so that you can avoid flaking? Does that pretty much summarize it?

If so then a few things need to happen in the interaction. First of all, you need to make sure you stay in set long enough to get a solid # close. Secondly, after you get the number you need to stay in set a little while longer to establish comfort is the short answer. Let me break that down for you and the readers a bit.

You can get a girls # based on attraction alone. She likes you and is attracted to you BAM you can get a #. However, she is going to flake on you the majority of the time if you leave the interaction after that. She thinks to herself later when her buying temperature comes down.... "Well he's a cute guy and all but I don't really know anything about him....It's going to be an akward date if we go out...I"ll avoid him."

This is why after you get the # you hang out in set for comfort for a good 15-20 minutes of about you and about her conversation.

Up front that is the best way to handle it, is to avoid falling into this trap in the first place. BUT let's say you did everything right and she still wants you to Facebook her. I'd probably tell her that I don't Facebook random people cause I have my family on there and some young cousins and stuff. Then I'd take out my phone and say what's your number. Not ask..."What's your number?" Not may I have your number or could I have your number but Tell me your number.

Honestly, if that still doesn't work I'd just blow her off anyways. I really really really hate digressing to getting an email or Facebook and going backwards in the process. It's better I blow her off and go meet someone else that I can get a solid # from. It's just a waste of time at that point from my perspective.

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Been around the world twice, Talked to everyone once...

I wouldn't try to be witty or anything about her photos. There is WAY WAY TOO MUCH that can be misinterpreted through online messages and we're more likely to upset her than be witty or cocky funny.

Yes there are some girls online that have no intentions of meeting people it seems however they could just be super picky or they could be on there for validation reasons as you mentioned. Either way I just leave these girls alone. I don't call them on their shit or anything else. It's not worth my time to do when I can meet someone better.

There are a lot of women online that say they are only looking for a "relationship" and not for intimate encounters or sex at first. The bottom line with this is it's bullshit in most every case I have encountered. Just like women you meet in real life they will tell you that they won't have sex with someone they just met. But as you and I know if the "right person" came along they would. It's just about following through the game as you normally would.

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Been around the world twice, Talked to everyone once...

JSmooth

I've been trying online dating for over 3 years now and have only had one date to show for it, which was really shittty date btw.

In the past I used to try and write thoughtful messages with items picked out from their profile but that yielded terrible results. I recently switched to openers such as "Hey, I would remove that picture for you profile" and "The Mirror Opener" but with very little success. Out of the 20+ girls I messaged only two responded and one was a total bi*ch. I wish I were more creative to think of a direct opener since you said those work best, but thats probably why I am still an AFC. Any suggestions on how to write a creative one?

I have another question as well. On match some of the options for what a girl would like in a match include an age bracket, ethnic background, and height. How much does this really matter? In past I've disqualified myself because I wasnt in the age bracket or if it said "White/Caucasian" under race. (I am of mixed race) I also run into minimum height issues as well as I am only 5'7"

Any advice/help?

Hey man, first of all I totally dig the dark wing duck avatar! Direct tends to work well but I have experimented with stuff that is indirect as well and it can work as well. The important thing is your opener needs to be congruent with your profile. Meaning if you have a profile that is all about how you want to be in a long term relationship I'd go direct. Where as if you have a profile that is a little more cocky you can go after some different types of openers.

Since you are interested in going direct I usually say something that I'd normally say in person. "I saw your profile and thought you were adorable, and figured I'd be kicking myself if I didn't message you." This as just being an example. If I can reference something specific in her profile I will.

Don't worry too much about the whole age brackets and list when girls have specifics about height, weight, etc. Every girl I know says if it was the right guy none of it would matter.

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Been around the world twice, Talked to everyone once...

ok, so i got opened by this girl (good) then after a couple negs and some chatting she gives me her number without me asking!

BUT

after i text her for a bit, start sorting out a meet up date. i stop texting her whilst I am at work and then realise my colleague is also texting her and has sorted a date for this sat!

(Midway through convo)

[b]Me: Are you sure your not just trying to impress me? xx

HB8 : Haha i will do anything to impress you as you know xx

Me: I would be impressed if we were to meet up sometime soon xx

HB8: We can definetely meet up soon xx

(Blah blah blah, next morning I realise my colleague is seeing her on saturday)

Me: What you doing this weekend xx (trying to see if she says shes meeting my colleague on sat)

HB8 : Uhhh seeing a few people on sat and then not sure sunday, maybe working, you? xx

Me : Not too sure, but if your lucky enough you might get to see me

HB8: If im lucky? xxxx

Me : many girls consider themselves lucky to meet up with me :p and to answer your next question, yours xxx

HB8: whats my next question xxxx

Me : My house or yours xxxx

HB8 : Haha im busy on sat xxxx

Me: what about sunday? x

HB8: Dunno x

Me: well maybe you can lucky some other time x[/b]

Did i get her when shes not in her comfort zone or what?? and is there any way i can get her to blow off my colleague?? or is it too late?