@Dilaks: I have moved past routines and stuff, but I thing I didn't have was manipulation or mind games. On my roommate's suggestion, I am trying that out now, and in fact it works like a charm. Because the women have no idea what i am thinking or upto.

If anyone still has doubts, check out PUA BradP Interviews with Naturals series. You will see they do stuff which are totally unnatural. I mean how natural is the opener "do u know some place where I can go touch myself'? And Pheromone kid, the greatest natural BradP ever met, describes his mentor, a phenomenal natural who behaved like a homosexual to 'disqualify' himself as a suitor to women he approaches. Sounds mysteriously familiar..

So to conclude this post, I can say only thing..manipulation is not bad..u decide where u draw the line..Disqualification, amog, jealousy, negs are actually used by real naturals..I encourage everyone to use some of this in your game..and see ur results skyrocket...Don't hate the player, hate the game.

cheers

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One Smile, One joke, One tease, One touch & She's Mine..

All this books, whatever, all you need is some basic understanding of game, in my opinion david dangelo double your dating, and then go out and approach and fail, get some level of success and keep doing whatever, other than that there is no magic pill... Just like working out there is not magic pill you got a go out and do the work, and the right system, and try and fail different systems till you know what works. I am a natural it boils down to experience and what works for YOU, with that being said experience is the best teacher, but yes manipulation is king!!!!!

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Learn the proper way to maximize your results in a dancefloor/club environment, check out my blog and youtube channel:
http://www.dancefloorseduction.com

Dancefloor/Club game youtube channel:
http://www.youtube.com/dancefloorseduction

I get the feeling that game is constantly evolving. Becoming more 'to the point' and more effective.

First you had Ross Jeffries with his long NLP routines, next was Mistery who ditched the NLP for DHVing and added some extra 'stages' (A1, A2, etc). Natural game is basically Mistery method without the routines and with a few stages removed.

I'm now basically doing a simplified version of natural game. It bowls down to:
Being fully self expressed in any social situation
Having good body language
Opening
Having great conversation (I use a bunch of different conversation techniques)
Constant kino escalation
Getting very close in a few intermediate steps (until you can smell her)
Switching from normal to seductive eye contact (can happen early on in the interaction)
Isolate
Closing

I don't bother with anything else as it is not needed. Attraction is such a basic emotions that you are basically talking to the lower parts of your brain. Not the newly evolved frontal cortex. Not the parts of your brain that deal with speech. It's much more primal than that. That is why body language and being dominant by not holding back and being fully self expressed is so attractive.

I treat conversation techniques merely as a tool to keep the interaction going which gives me time to physically escalate and transfer my 'I think you are sexy and I want you' state to her by being very expressive (body language, facial expression, eyes, etc).

The guys that feel they have to say something good, smart or interesting are shooting themselves in the foot. They are busy thinking not being with the women fully. Women notice when a guy is inside his head and being needy by trying to say 'great stuff'.

Once you get laid from gaming you will think that certain aspects of game you have been running are the things that got you laid but it might just be the thing that gets you laid is you becoming more relaxed and more at easy with women.

Very basic game is all you need. Just my 2 cents.

There's no way you can bowl in there with old school MM these days... i've met way too many chicks that know of the game...

shit even saw one with some pua material on her phone (really should have opened her, she would have been a great fb/pivot, but i was alot more of a vag back then)

I've also seen the thread about 'the game' movie, and people are concerned about methods being exposed... well i really don't care about any of those methods being exposed, because most of them are outdated...

Anyways, to comment on the original thread, there is no ways that PUA methods are dead, every one who has ever picked up a woman uses some kind of method, some are taught and some are learned through experience... what i am getting to is there is actually no such thing as entirely natural, even 'naturals' use some repeated methods...

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everything i say is in my humble opinion...
"the more i practice the luckier i get"
gary player
"the more i practice the fuckier i get"
smashy

LMAO

Well, I still use Speed Seduction as the foundation for my game, while I mix concepts from other gurus too.
IMHO, natural game can't really me taught by a PU school. You're either a natural or you're not.
You can however develop a naturalized game, and that means you get the idea how things work and you develop your own material and use it over and over again. Yes, naturals have their routines too, they just don't call it routines.

I enjoy the old school methods. Do you remember Maniac High, TokyoPUA? The good ol' days.

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"Their compliance is,
'Does she grab your hand?' F*ck you! I want to grab her mind. If I can
grab her mind, she'll be grabbing whatever I want, any way I want her to." - Ross Jeffries