Ok, I just got dumped on my ass because I f-d up with my #2 girl. Was planning on never seeing my #3 girl again, but she started texting my best friend last night and got me on the phone.

Here's the deal. I've been out with her 3 times and I haven't been able to get past her LMR. I tried the freeze out last week. Not getting there.

I engaged her logically about it Saturday morning. (I know, probably a big mistake, but at that point I was pretty much planning on not seeing her again anyway.) I asked her what she was so afraid of. She said she gets emotionally involved with sex and she wants a an exclusive relationship with a man before sex. She's telling me she hasn't had sex in 11 months, so I know she's gotta be wanting it.

Ok, so I was gonna not see her again. I didn't call her for 5 days and then she started chasing me by having her friend send text messages to my best friend. My best friend was over here watching TiVo with me last night when this all went down.

Anyway, she got me on the phone and we're supposed to go out Friday night. The problem is, I think she's using me for free dates. I'm the AFC guy who's paying for all the shit and not getting any. Honestly, I don't mind spending the money, but I think she'll lose all respect for me if I keep paying for all her shit and not getting any.

Should I just call and cancel the date for Friday and never see her again? Any advice??? Is there any chance that she's just gonna fold her hand and fuck me at some point??? I honestly believe that if I don't get past her LMR soon, she'll end up friending me anyway.

_________________
Later,
Alphagame

Ah the hardships of being a PUA.

I don't blame her for not having sex with you (smart girl).

She sounds like she's looking for more than just sex, and doesn't define herself with men as just a sex object. But then I think you should seriously reconsider your financial contributions as well, or limit her to cheap dates. If she really likes you it wont matter.

I can respect that. And if she aint enough for you to wait, then you should shake her hand, wish her luck, and look for some easier pussy to bang and spend your money on.

Tell her you're not ready to settle down with one girl, or get too serious at this point in your life. Because she sounds like she's husband shopping.

She's probably just testing you. And she sounds fairly smart, which is a good thing. I'd stick with it for a while, but hold onto my wallet. Female friends are never a bad thing and this girl may make a good wife at some point in the future.

And if you catch her messing with other guys in the meantime, dump the living shyt out of her.

Something to think about.

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

That's actually one of the qualities I like about this woman. She's not a slut.

But...is it possible to date a woman, not get any and stay out of LJBF??? Somehow, I was thinking no sex with a woman was a non-stop path to LJBF'ville. Not true???

_________________
Later,
Alphagame

Not always.

Different girls are different ways. Sounds like a communication problem to me. You're thinking things work one way, and she's gently telling you it doesn't work that way with her. That's not always a bad thing.

High quality women often don't jump in the sack with a guy immediately, even after 3 dates. Especially if they're young and haven't had sex much. It just depends upon the girl, how much she values herself and her upbringing.

You know anything about her upbringing? Was her family religious? Maybe she wants to know you better first. That's probably what she's saying.

Do you want a steady girlfriend? Are you willing to have one before you get sex?

You know I used to be amazed when I was younger and came back to my hometown. I always established a relationship then had sex. Around here everybody wanted to have sex, then establish a relationship.

Like test driving a car or something. I suppose I was always a little more careful than the average guys about diseases, etc.. and about where I stuck my tongue and my dick. I mean if I didn't get any it wasn't the end of my life or the world, I was a fairly well rounded human being.

What does she do when you kiss her, etc..? Where does she stop you? Or are you just asking?

Let me say that the smarter and younger the women, typically the harder it's going to be to get her into bed. If you like easy women, then that's fine to judge them this way. But if you like quality women you gotta be willing to play the game. Sometimes that means waiting for sex without emptying your wallet in the meantime.

Sounds to me like you want to try the car before you buy it, and she's saying you aint driving this thing before I know I can depend upon you as relationship material. Have you tried alcohol? Just kidding.

If you not looking for something that serious, check her later. The friend thing may not be a bad idea though. She may be good wife material at some point.

However, she may have a secret life behind your back, and enjoys your money, your attention and wants you hanging on the wings just in case. I've seen that before too. But I'd bet my money on the first scenario.

Tough call. It always is. So I suppose the question is, do you think she's worth it and are you looking for a steady relationship? That used to be a prerequisite for sex with a quality women, isn't anymore I suppose. If you wait, and work hard to get some and she aint your cup of tea you're going to hurt her. You gotta be careful with girls like that.

So to wrap it all up, if you just looking for sex or a tryout, this probably isn't the girl. I you're looking for something more including sex, maybe. Talk to her about it. She maybe honest about what she wants, she may not be.

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

Absolutely possible... only with certain women though. In fact I have a girl right now who I've been hanging out with cute little mormon girl... who has made it very clear to me that she intends to stay a virgin until she's married... now you and I both know that'll never happen hanging out with a guy like me... but for now I honestly haven't even tried, and don't intend to at least for awhile.

So is whe trying to pull some chick voodoo on you to try and pin you into a LTR, probably. Is it AFCish to not go alpha a knock that shit-test aside, yes. Should you be paying for her shit? I wouldn't

"Quality women" are easy enough to get into the sack too, if you really want to. If you want in her pants I suggest you do some research on Role-Reversal... and on the GM style, it'll bring out her inner slut when the time is right. :-p

hey dude. what she's saying is that she doesn't have sex outside of monogamous relationships which is also testing your interest in a relationship with her. The test is she wants to see if you're more interested in just having sex or actually dating her. It's really up to you man as she put the ball in your court.

The only way you're going to get her to give in without a relationship is to build up so much tension she can't stand it and just jumps you... this can be quite difficult though as she seem to have her mind set.

Huh? After this?
This is directly AFC. Paying for her shit and not getting any. That is not PUA....

Go back to reading...

As a first step though, tell he that she has to take you out on Friday. I would even make her pick you up. If she complains, walk away.

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Recommended reading list.

Double Your Dating by DD
(This will work on your inner game)

http://www.freewebs.com/xfman/
(This will work on your outer game)

Valence,

That is what I was thinking. If I keep paying for everything, which I honestly don't mind doing, but if I do without getting any, I think she'll eventually lose respect.

I like the idea of making her drive over her and take me out. I might try that out.

_________________
Later,
Alphagame

Look man, if being a pick up artist is nothing more than about sex, why don't we call it a sex artist instead?

I know alot of the guys here are young and maybe that's part of the problem.

One day you're gonna want a decent woman who doesn't bend over for every legend in their own mind that happens along.

If all you know or want are chicks who in my friend the Doctor's words freely give in to their;

"inner slut..."

Then I think more than likely that's the only kind of woman you'll attract. For a while anyway.

As for the money thing I agree. Take her on a cheap date and see what she does. If she's just as happy hanging out in the park with you, as she is going to a fancy restaurant then she may have potential.

And like pokernumen points out, if you're not looking for a monogamous or a serious relationship then tell her. Maybe she wants to be Herpes free for her first husband.

I can't fault any girl for this. Or a guy for that matter. Although I understand it has the potential to step on a few PUA's toes that get confused when everything doesn't follow their 12 step plan..

I didn't get to be 46 y.o., disease free and with a successful professional woman that's more than 5 years my junior paying my bills by being stupid or by using hijacked terms and labels to try and rationalize my abhorrent and inconsiderate behavior towards the opposite sex.

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

This one's really got HUGE LMR. I tried the freeze out...went in the living room to watch The Office on TiVo. She was kino'ing me within 60 seconds. Put my hand on breast. She pulled it away. Went back to The Office. She starts kino'ing me again. Pause. Put my hand on her breast. She doesn't remove it. Turn off TiVo, walk her back to my bed again, turn out the lights, start kissing her ears. No. No. Fine...I'm gonna end up being accused of date rape. I walk into my daughers bedroom and pass out on her bed. An hour later, I'm waking up with water on my back wondering WTF I'm doing here. I walk back towards my bedroom and she's in the hall way. I mean, you don't do a freeze out any better than that and I STILL couldn't lay this woman.

You gotta think, if she's your one and only, she's not gonna be cheating around. She's probably a darn good girl. She had every opportunity to spread her legs and blame it all on me and she didn't.

_________________
Later,
Alphagame

You got a daughter?

Maybe she's trying to tell you something, that's as clear as day to her.

That she might be a keeper.

Because she can obviously resist your charms, skills or whatever if she chooses.

Sounds like you may have run into a fellow PUA. Of the female persuasion.

You'd better think hard about this one. They don't come around that often.

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

Some girls won't give it up no matter how much tension you build in fact girls can go for years without sex this includes even touching themselves.
Also if she can get you pay for stuff without having sex with you that even better for her because she can get what she wants with no effort so stop paying for stuff
She may want u to be her man before she gives it up even then she might still make you wait. Its frustrating not getting sex from a girl your seeing you may want to cut this off soon. Because if she's the type like I think you're going to become even more frustrated with her.

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So u think you can handle this?

I agree. If you keep giving her what she wants, how does that give her incentive to give you what you want? I have no idea why anyone could think this women is a keeper. If you not getting what you want out of the relationship what the point of getting into it in the first place? I understand wanting a good girl but that shouldn't mean practically begging for sex (not saying you are or anything). This is the kind of thing we are trying to avoid by being PUA's in the first place. Why would you throw that away cause she is a "good" girl? Dont you think she might be DHVing back at YOU.

<rant> And by all account it is very possible she isnt good at all. It's possible that she could totally be yanking your chain for some free shit. Imagine when you start actually having sex... infrequent sex... and evey time you want to have sex you need to take her out on increasingly extravigant evenings to... get here in the mood. ahhhhh.</rant>

Just be carful if this "good" girl dosnt have these dilusional ideas that she and her "purity" are more valuable then you are. You deserve every bit of her attention. Sexually and otherwise.

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"Responsibility for our lives is something we never lose but which we often deny... You can blame whomever you wish, but you’re the one who must experience (or endure) the results." -Steve Pavlina (http://www.stevepavlina.com)

Starbuck I'm sorry but I have to say... This is a PUA forum... not a lets go off and get married forum. Thats great that your happy with your situation, and I understand that you believe it's best to settle down with a girl who won't sleep with you outside of a relationship... I'd guess you probably did something similiar and it worked out well for you, and thats why your so adamant that it's the best thing to do.

However I believe he was asking for advice on how to overcome LMR... and he did state she's his third option...

Also I'm hoping a few of the things you posted there were not intended as jabs, because I could se how a more judgemental type could think that...

So if not then "cool", or if so then "lol".

Some girls are plain old fashioned. It wasn't much more than 100 years ago that it was common for people not to have sex at all before the wedding night.

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"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye