There have been a lot of chats, discussions, arguments, and point of views on variations of the 'inner game' topic lately but the end results have always seemed less than satisfactory. This shouldn't be too surprising as:

1. None of us are inner game experts.
2. The closest thing that this community has to "experts" are a bunch of one night stand seeking former closet head cases turned overtly extroverted self appointed gurus.
3. ^You want this guy to rewire your brain? The guy who scored a D on his social psych class because all he did was flip to "attraction" and read it over and over and over again?

Here's the logic: If you have legal issues, seek a lawyer. If your pipes burst, call a decent plumber. If you want to pick up a few pointers on pick up, go find the pick up gurus! But if you want to figure out your BRAIN and the way your BRAIN functions, this is the type of resource you ought to seek:

http://powerupyourbrain.com/

Have fun! . . . and let's discuss . . .

Talk about straight edge to the point Kasabi. But you do have a point tho - we're basing a lot on the value of these 'guru's' while actually - it's you in the end that still has to do it.

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I get the whole go to a car mechanic to get your car fixed
and go learn seduction from gurus
.... basically this isn't the right place to fix your internal problems

But I would say that a fair amount of people on this website ( me included) have came a long way and may have lifestyle and inner game advice to offer people in a bad place. I mean most of the gurus out there introduce themselves as some nerdy kid who was useless and most guys relate themselves to this and associate the community to fixing this.

However I find all that books do is a) help you to understand a problem or b) motivate you to do something about it.

The true way of fixing inner game is getting out of your comfort zone and picking up a lot of hobbies , writing a diary log on what you have learned and writing "I am **** , I will do ****** , no one thinks im a ***** speeches"and saying them outloud to yourself in your sleep. And Alot of sleep !

However , I haven't read the book you have advised and therefore cannot comment on its usefulness .

I know this seems contradictory to what Ive just posted above but I actually agree with this. Their are alot of external factors which play a part in anyone's life and can cause inner game problems. Identifying one of these factors which we can relate to ourselves past experiences may not be the solution as other factors can contribute to the problem.

However I still stress the importance of picking up hobbies and writing a diary.

Hobbies give you more experience and opportunity's to learn more about yourself and gain skills whilst writing a diary allows you to function your thoughts and work out solutions to your own problems.It also allows you to reflect back on past experiences and see in ways of how you have dealt with them successfully and to realize just how far you have gone.

I'm not sure if you understood my point. The stuff that comes out of the mouth of 'PU gurus' in regards to anything having to do with brain health, behavior, emotions, and spirituality is usually absurd. Especially so when their idea of a spiritual journey / education system is hanging around a cheesy lounge all night long telling anybody willing to listen, "Do I look like a drug dealer to you?" - This is comedy. I'd rather learn physics from a donkey.

You're correct. "You still have to do it." But whatever it is that you set out to do, wouldn't you rather arm yourself with the correct tools?

No matter what to tools are, if you do not practise them - you'll get no-where. Wether it is material provided by the guru's of this scene or by an acknowled Phd. guy, the outcome stays the same if you do not apply it.
But - yeah, having the 'correct' tools for my availability would be great. However - define correct tools, because eventually it's you who choses to handle or address them in a proper way.

≠ LD

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Of course, but this is normal. Because we are being placed in that spectrum of blind following examples of people with a high status. A lot of people are inadequete revolving around thinking by themselves. I found this to be the mainly problem, not only in PUA, but pretty much everywhere.

When a person does actually learn to think for themselves - they would become so much stronger, cause they would be able to adapt to a variety of situations. Be able to develop strong characters because of the experience they have gotten from their past. Now if you only "copy/paste" everything from a specific guru - where would that lead you too? Maybe to some degree a bit stronger - but never to reach your full potential.

≠ LD

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For Inner Game and "Fixing" your brain you can also read John Kehoe - Mind Power

These are good recommendations. I also agree that 'getting out of your comfort zone' can be a path towards progress. However, I feel we are working with two different definitions of inner game. Based on what you wrote, it seems you think 'inner game' = positive attitude, outlook, and confidence that allow us to break out of our comfort zones. - This is probably the accepted definition of 'inner game'.

I prefer this definition instead: 'inner game' = peace and comprehension. . . an understanding of the self and those around him and the acceptance of it all.

Here's how I see the difference between the two. The first definition of inner game is a state arrived from an egotistical view of the self. "I am this. I am that, I am, I am, I am." - With enough fortitude, you might lead yourself to believe all the "I am's" but what will this do for you? This might break you out of a 'comfort zone' but:

1. Any animal that is broken out of comfort zones without 'understanding' relies on the most primal instincts. Unfortunately, "fight or flight" kinda sucks for pu.
2. A harmonious interaction with others is a crapshoot.
3. This adrenalized state isn't conducive to feel and accept a full spectrum of emotions.
4. Because of #3, creativity is hampered. Ever wonder why so many people seem as if they're conversing with themselves?

The second view of 'inner game' urges for a self- state that comes from understanding. What makes some people SO COMFORTABLE, content, and happy in every situation? What allows them to interact with others in harmony? This is an existence of being ultra sensitive and mindful of the here and now as opposed to the popular PU recommendation to 'F whatever anybody says or even how YOU FEEL . . Just go in and aplomb that set!!' Seriously, if attainable, what would you rather do?

How? This is the fun part.

This is another disconnect.

Most self help books are 'knowledge base' books. They offer insights into the way the author views the World and makes recommendations based on that view. - Following these steps of course is a 'copy/paste'.

What Eastern philosophies have been more concerned with is, "How can an individual gain insights for himself?" And perhaps even more importantly, how can he gain 'correct insights'. Psychology has already identified many ways we incorrectly perceive the World visually, emotionally, auditorily, etc . . . How can we get ourselves to a state that allows us to see things as they are? That's the idea.

Looks awesome. Finally used my Amazon voucher. Thanks Rich!

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Aaaaaa ok Understood
Your definition defiantly makes sense If I understand it correctly my view is "Fake it till you make it" From breaking comfort Ive always thought "I dont care what happens or what they think" which may not be the healthiest way of doing it repressing and ignoring issues but as long as your moving forward in life and seeing results then you seem to forget about them until one day you meet them again and the cycle starts again. Rinse and repeat

and your view if im right is being at peace with yourself , accepting who you are , who everyone else is and understanding that its ok to be the person you are.
Which would make sense as if you can accept who you are and can be completely comfortable with yourself then you can move forward and would be more healthier in the long run but slower to attain this state . Being at peace with your mind

If I'm right and I really hope I am at this as this has helped me to understand what I would need to do before I ever attempt another LTR

The way I see it. Rinse and repeating allows you to p.u. Women but your basically a ticking time bomb so its not preferd for a relationship

and if you were to look for a LTR being at peace with yourself and mind would be more favorable as you could be completely comfortable

I'm excited

Cool, my copy arrives early next week. I didn't get a chance to read this book yet as the launch date was Feb 3. However, I didn't just blindly recommend a book; I know Dr. Perlmutter and his history. The guy's a genius and he has saved many lives . . .(literally)

There are plenty of books on enlightenment, meditation, and spirituality. And there are even more resources on subjective interpretations of the topic. But how does one truly come to understand such things as "I am you, you are me."? How does one practice "emptiness" and "mindfulness" at the same time? And why?

For long, ^these practices were explained through tales and experiences. (Nonsensical gibberish, right?) Personally, I think it's pretty cool that an attempt is being made to bridge science with philosophy; tangible, logical methods with ambiguous, culturally specific exercises. . .

LOL . . . just as while I was writing this, I spoke with a zen-teacher-guru-type guy and explained the book to him. He says "Once you explain it, it no longer exists." - geeze . . .but my logical mind is still curious enough to try the plan that is outlined in the book. It might be a fun idea to get on this puaf 'journal' bandwagon and try this program out as a group. Pick a start date and share experiences. Bonus points for working on a pu plan at the same time. You in blondguy?

I like this idea. My copy should arrive in 7-10 business days.


-Roz

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This is an interesting topic worthy of a six pack and a afternoon of debate. ^This phenomenon occurs in every sector of human life from a group of 5 kindergartners in a playground to the inner workings of the UN. Wild stuff . . .
So are you in on the group journal or what? This will be a fun exercise.