Sorry for the politically incorrect topic but it's deserving.

Guys,I've been sarging like a single newbie over the past week.

I'd #closed 2 girls,so let's get to it:

2 days ago,I street approached an HB9 from England who's down here visiting family.

She's walking my direction:

Me:"Dont you hate waiting on ppl"?

[She not knowing if I was addressing her so she had a puzzled look as she approaches]

Me:Yes you,Im talking to you".

HB9:"Oh,I didnt know".

Long story short,I didnt use any routines on her,but I did neg her about looking Italian[she's blacc but very light-skinned].

Basically,the pick up went exceptionally well.

Since her cell phone couldnt work down here,she'd borrowed her father's cell and didnt know the # by heart.

So I gave her mines and told her to call me from her father's borrowed mobile so the # shows up in mines.

She did,so it's all good.

I asked what she's doing later?

Said she's totally free & bored.

So I said,"cool,we should hang out later.I'll call you after 7 pm some time".

7:30 pm,I call her but no answer.

Re-called her 3 more times in a row:no answer.

Called her after 8pm;no friggin' answer!

She never called back.

Next day(yesterday)I called her in the afternoon from my LAN line phone.

She answers[perhaps because she didnt know it was me calling since she doesnt know my LAN line #-lol]

Me:"Hey Vina,thought I had the wrong # there after not being able to reach you last night(lol)".

HB9:"[Shocked]Oh,I'd totally fell asleep on my phone...".

After about 2 min.of chat,I set up another meet for that night.

Me:"Ok cool,what you doing tonight"?

HB9:"Nothing,Im free".

Me:"Ok cool.We're gonna hang out at the village pierre at 8:00 pm".

HB9:"No prob'.I'll have to wear long sleeves because of damn mosquitos".

Me:"No prob',come prepared.

I asked for her address in order for me to pick her up and walk to the piere since she doesnt know where it is.

7:30pm I sent her a confirmation text saying to remember to bring her insect repelent for mosquitos.

No reply.

I called her at 8:00 pm on the dot;the b**ch doesnt answer!

I re-called her few times between 8 & 8:45 pm.

Today now,I said fuck it,Im passing by her home(since she'd given me her address).

I fount her house and yelled out her name few times.

She answers but I got the vibe that she didnt want to answer.

The bitch didnt even had the courtesy to come out side,so she spoke through a darkened window.

Me:"Hey,whats goin on"?

HB9:"Just here talking to my father".

Me:"Sounds good.You coming out to talk"?

HB9:"I cant,Im talking with my father".

I just laughed and told her later with a smirky laugh.

Guys,Im friggin' puzzled!!?

I had no IOD's from her prior,besides the bullshit reasons she gave for not returning calls.

Guys,I have no time for flakey-ass girls.

Most women will flake-it's normal.

But this chicc's going over board.

I baically erased her # from my phone today.

But I sent her this text also:

Me:"You're about the strangest chicc I ever met.If you dont want to hang out-just say it.Im not gonna die(lol).Very immature".

As expected,she didnt respond.

Some guys may say that that text was showed that I was hurt.

I was pissed to be honest but Im moving on from this sought of hard-core flakery.

I know that most girls will flake at least once before actually meeting up.

But she flaked 2 nights in a row and disrespected by not facing me when I went to her house.

So Im moving from this.

Dont believe I went wrong any where.

So perhaps the probs' were on her end:secret bf,whatever.

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Dude, sometimes I think I get needy or insecure when a girl flakes out on me, but you're setting the standard. You called her a dozen times and walked to her house and yelled at her, all in one day? You're totally a stalker. She gave you her address, that was pretty good, that shows she trusted you and intended to meet you.

So this is what I do in your situation. Two weeks ago, I have plans to see this girl, I text her earlier in the day to make sure we're on. She texts back HOURS later saying she MIGHT make it, but is already making excuses. I tell her to let me know before our date so I can make other plans if need be. She doesn't text or call me by the deadline, which is just plain fucking rude. I call her, she doesn't answer. I leave an upbeat message saying we'll have to reschedule and hope she doesn't mind I made other plans. She texts me the next day and a week later we finally had our date (and now she's being flaky again, fucking waste of my life).

That was kind of long, but basically what I'm saying is if a girl flakes, you play it cool and you DON'T burn your bridges, because she might feel braver later on. That's why you don't show that you're hurt. I'm starting to think that once a flake always a flake, though, so it might not even be worth giving her the second chance.

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31 and still figuring it out.

@Minsok-From a fellow forum leader to another;I feel the pain(lol).

Should'nt it all be so simple if the girls just says no,"I wont be able to make it"?

Well,I guess women are'nt programmed that way.

Yea,she did trust me by enough by giving her address.

But what good is it if she's being a flake?

Only reason I went to her place was that I believe to keep calling & texting would be me being a pussy,when I had her address.

So that was a good move by me.

But I definitely get your point Minsok.

Im with you 100% on not burning bridges so soon,when the girl could eventualy committ(which I eluded to could happen).

Then again as you said Minsok,once a flake always a flake.

Exceptions to every rule but this one seem pretty stedfast.

I like the way you handled your flakey chicc too.

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Flakes are annoying, but having other girls that want to see you and good friends really takes all the edge off. Apparently there's a lot of girls that have to pop a Paxil just to be social, so I don't know what's going on with the world. I don't want to get into it, but going to a woman's house uninvited is ALWAYS a no-no. She flaked out, so you really did not have the invite.

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31 and still figuring it out.

@MinsoksAgreed totally that her flaking was she in essence not giving an invite.

But Im more amused than disappointed.

I kind of got a weird kick out of the way she brushed me off by saying she's talking with her father.

Rather than get upset and tell her to fuck off(which I would've done in my AFC days),I just giggled in amusement and said to her,"Ok then".

Im now amused at how irrational & illogical women are.

Opposed to years ago,I'd be totally bumbed out and crying for being flaked on.

But I always tell guys this(on the forum),"there's no flake-proof material".

Women will flake(most).

No matter how tight and awseome & comfort-filling your game is,the target may still flake.

So I get a bit puzzled when I see newbie post asking,"how to prevent flakes".

Flakes cannot be prevented.

In fact,it seem to me that the more powerful your connection,the more nervous the target becomes,thus flaking.

The social pressure on her to live up to the cool-guy's standards(PUA)would actually paralyze and scare her.

Seems counter-intuitive & contradictive.

What went wrong in my case,I believe is that the pick- up went so smooth,and my approach was so foreign to her,that it actually made her chicken out(flake).

She doesnt know how to cope with a potential meet-up with such a cool/different guy.

So that feeling of not thinking she can live up to the hype and be as social again made her flake.

Come on guys,it's called anxiety;and we men feel it a lot when it comes to approching HB's or making that 1st.phone call.

We say to ourelves,"would she like or hate my voice,would I freeze up"?

We're not sure if we can please this hot chicc.

Then we'd procrastinate and end up not calling at all that moment or day.

So in essence,we flaked on calling.

So,the same thing goes through womens' minds:

"Would I be able to please this cool guy,would he like me,maybe my standards are too low for him"?

So she flakes.

I strongly believe that's what happened in my case in many other flake cases.

The targets arent sure if they can be social enough[as Minsok eluded to],look good enough,etc.

What a realization on female psycology I just figured out.

Now I know why women flake on guys of perceived-higher social status.

My perceived-social status was higher than the HB9 I'd succefully gamed.

I made a crucial mistake on having too much value(via my game,negs,false diqulifiers,etc.).

Some where along the initial sarge,perhaps I negged her too hard,which lowered her value too much,which in turned raised my value too high...

I read about this PU concept years ago,where you should lower the target's social value simultaneously raising yours,then you must raise her value again so that both of yall are of equal value.

I never did that with this target.

My value was so friggin' high and hers so low that it became a mismatch.

If I'd raised her social val' again to make us equals,she would not have flaked(most likely).

So I did miscalibrate and screwed up in the initial approach.

I started off this thread saying,"I did nothing wrong;the problemsl all on her".

Now that I search deeply,I was the problem.

I caused this chicc to flake.

I lowered her value so much(however subtly)that she didnt know how to face me again.

I've read a lot of PU newsletters over the years which said that girl would never flake on Brad Pitt,celebs nor Rockstars.

Bull-friggin' shit!!

Those guys social values are so high that any ordinary girly(whether HB2 to HB15)would flake on them!

Brad Pitt would have major flake issues with trying to get an HB10 to meet up!

Why?

His value is so high that the girl would not know how to face him,please him nor live up to such a guy's expectations.

Plus,she'd be thinking,"Is my hairdo good enough,am I too fat,this dress makes my belly look big,I dont know what to wear,he wont like my teeth,he usually dates blonds and Im a read head so he wont like me".

So,she would flake on Brad Pitt faster than she'd flake on ordinary guys.

Brad wont stand a chance unless this chicc was some one of same class(fellow actor)or he went for the SNL.

So the relevance to my flake?

She seen me as a blacc- Brad Pitt(lol).

What a compliment!

An HB9 didnt think she was good enough to hang with me.

My solution is to not approach with having so much value.

This' a huge lesson for me & my game.

Tone down my social value to match hers,or raise her value if mines are too high so we become equal.

Then she wont have a reason to flake since she wont be concerned about living up to my high-PUA standards.

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K, she was a total flake, and this will be a regular thing, she's set the secenario, Probably why she's always bored and free as she says, because she has flaked so much nobody is interested any more.

In my opinion, you came off a bit needy with all the calls, but if you set up a meet, if cancelling etc, we all deserve the right of knowing what's going on, just some pricks and bitches find it a little too hard.

Move on, she's a waste bro!

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Been there, done it, oh and still doing it!

: Blog entries@ http://kennyspuathoughts.wordpress.com/

K-loc what r u on about??

the reason why she flaked is because she had zero fucking reason to hang out with you, and she didn't know anything about you, who you are and what you're capable of

you have to give girls reasons to hang out not just say lets hang out

all this talk about your value being high an hers being low is community bulllshit

it comes down to the simple fact that she didn't know shit about you and she had no reason too hang out with you, no comminalities

also you freaking the fuck out didn't help matters, I'm not saying this to be an asshole, its just dwelling on a girl you barely know is bad for you

next time, phone her up, talk to her for a while, find out about her and let her know about you, then invite her to a low key event like a few drinks with your friends

think about it you phoned her multiple times and ended up at her house... wtf! think of what you would be like if a girl you barely knew did that to you, how would that come across??

if she flakes, never give her a hard time, just be like "cool no probs, anyway me and my friends will be there tonight if you change your mind, later" then respect it, don't call her loads and if she doesn't pick up leave it, if she wants to hang out she'll get in contact, don't be so attacted, dude you got alot to learn

@Chel'-Thanks for the info Chel'.

Yea,no wonder why the chic's complaining of being bored;maybe she's a habitual flake.

@Ramlives-Good inights.

Reason I showed up at her house was because she did give me the address.

It would'v been weird & creepy if I'd googled it or me stalker stuff.

Plus I showed up in the day(comfortable timing).

So why waste time calling a girl who'd given you her address?

That's regressive & pussy.

It's like guys who prefer to text a girl and set up a meet rather than to call her on the phone and set it up.

So in such case,texting would be coward's/AFC's route.

She gave the address,so why call?

I did call initially,and that probably turned her off(lol).

She probably said to herelf,"I gave this asshole my address yet he's calling me via phone"!

So the move to go to her house wasnt the worst thing Ramlives 'cause he did give me the address opposed to me randomly acquiring it.

But the underline key to most flakes is what I'd pointed out above:it comes down to value(social).

Guys it's common sense.

Anxiety causes ppl to not act!!

So she didnt flake because I didnt give her a reason to hang out.

She flaked because she had too much anxiety floating in her mind.

No guy have approach anxiety in aproaching an HB2 or a girl he isnt attracted to.

You dont care about how you look nor sound to an ugly girl.

I would blatantly fart around ugly girls.

But imagine it's an HB10 you're attracted to?

The average guy will hold that fart for 10 hours in the presence of an HB10(lol).

Why?

Because he feels deep anxiety around her where he doesnt want to mess up.

The point?

Women are the same.

They dont want to be seen as non-sociable around a cool guy they're attracted to.

I couldl've given this chicc a million reasons to hang out,but as long as my social value is too much higher than hers,she will flake.

It's the main cause of flaking.

We're not compatible if Im an 10 and she's a 3 on the social -value scale.

Thus she has no reason to meet up with me since she sees the incompatibility,i.e.I came off as having high standards for her.

Would a guy go out with a chicc who views him as being lower standard?

Hell no-he'd flake.

Same thing-a girl will not meet up with a guy who she believe views her as having lower-social status.

That's why I said Brad Pitt would have major hard time trying to pull an HB3 for a follow-up meet.

Because his celeb' status DHV's him too high.

That's why in the community,it teaches us to not go overboard with DHV's because the girl will say to herself,"why is he into me when he's usually sleeping with models.Im no model".

The mere fact that she feels that she cannot compete with models will have her flake on you.

So it all comes down to perceived value.

Some where during the pick up,I DHV'd too high & too much and I might've dropped a neg which made her uncomfortable.

So great points Ramlives,Minsok & Chel'.

Some girls are just flakers as Chelios said.

But no amount of phone game nor a million reasons would've made her meet up as long as my value was so high.

If I'd lowered my values via telling her vulnerable things about me(perhaps in a phone convo' like Ramlives eluded to,then she probably wouldnt have flaked).

But she seen me as Mr.Untouchable,which is the impression I gave her from the pick up.

If I'd soften up my character via vulnerable story & perhaps negged myself,we would've been compatible(since she'd revealed vulnerabilities),thus she had no reason to flake.

She had problems with the currency differences here opposed to England.

So she told me how she felt she got duped at the supermarket here for not knowing exact money exchange.

That's her revealing a vulnerability or fault;not being savy to the currencies & being tricked or gullible.

I on the other hand,never revealed a vulnerability to her,so I was Mr.Perfect.

Who the hell wants to hang out with Mr.Perfect?

No one(lol)!!

So she flaked.

So it all comes down to values and how you potray yourself.

Make my mistake a lesson to all the guys reading this.

Never DHV yourself too high!

Never come off as Mr.Perfect!

Always soften up your character via vulnerabe stories.

Never over neg,or be more aware of how to neg.

I negged her on looking Italian.

She's not Italian so maybe my neg subcommunicated to her that I was into Italians thus she doesnt qualify.

I did tell her I was into Italian chiccs.

But I never soften up the neg by telling her,"You're cute even though you're not Italian".

So when it came time to meet,she had doubt whether I was into her or not.

She didnt feel she fits my ideals,thus she flaked twice.

My fault-not hers.

I take full responsibility for friggin up this.

So fellow PUA's,learn from this.

Thanks for the insight guys.

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I'm sorry but I have to respectfully disagree with you on a few points

first she will not think your a pussy for texting or calling, girls don't think like that, that wouldn't even have crossed her mind

and the other is value, value is bullshit I'm sorry to say, even Sinn who was one of the most dogmatic mystery lovers ever has broke away from that and has stated that value based game is bullshit and it fucks guys up

value turns guys in to over thinking balls of confusion, FUCK VALUE!

the next time you get a girls number from a direct street approach, phone her, spend time finding out about her, ask her about her social life and where she likes to go and what she likes to do, find comminalities, give her reasons why she should meet you, at least try it once and see what happens!

K-Loc man you can approach chicks on the street, you're half way there man!!! 90% of guys in the community never get that far, you have! now stop mentally jerken off and see things for what they are

watch this, I think you'll appreciate it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KA5IXqjdlc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5t3pOxZG ... re=related

@Ramlives-I think I did read or listened a podcast with Sinn on values.

Few other dating coached debunked the whole value thing(Speer formerly of MM did it also).

But I still believe value is relevant at least in this case.

Your totally right about many aspects in the community turn guys into over-thinkers.

Where as a natural who doesnt think would gets farther than the PUA who over think stuff.

I get the basics.

My main downfall are flakes;which unfortuntely are unavoidable.

Lol,I appreciate the pep talk Ramlives.

Nothing like a boost of confidence to keep the mental masturbation away(lol).

We tend to over complicate shit a lot in the community

Good insight Ramlives.

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Dude, why won't you listen to reason? She hid from you in a dark window and pretended her dad was home. Do you not get that you SCARED her? It's generally rude to drop by someone's house unannounced anyway, even a homie, don't be a retard.

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31 and still figuring it out.

@Minsok-I get that and I admitted that it wasnt the best move to drop by un announced.

I even went so far as to agree with you that she flaking was in essence being opposed to an invite.

I played that card wrong ans I accept that.

I did few things wrong and I accept that and will now learn from it and fine tune my game to iron out those things.

I do agree that I f'd this up.

Despite the "going by her was a bad over argument",I honestly believe that perceived value was what sunk the ship for me.

Me going by her was a last-ditch effort since I felt I had nothing else to lose.

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Yeah, but it was totally you who made it that you had nothing else to lose by getting obsessive to the point of pushing her away. You have to play it cool. But I'm not very good at that either, I told my flaky girl to take care of herself if I don't hear from her and deleted her number. It's sad how girls are so afraid of people these days.

_________________
31 and still figuring it out.

Wow just caught up on this.

Good advice Minsok.

K, good you know your mistake, you learn for next time man, so onwards and upwards I say .

A million more women out there to game, date, fuck and whatever you want!

Trust me, I'm in more drama! haha

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Been there, done it, oh and still doing it!

: Blog entries@ http://kennyspuathoughts.wordpress.com/

Yeah, that girl had amazing gray eyes and dark hair and other qualities, I really fucking wanted it. But I'm confident enough that there will always be more women that I'm not scared to make mistakes and lose any one. Fuck, and juggling two women is freaking hard, I don't know how people do it. It's not for me.

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31 and still figuring it out.