Imagine: you're gaming a girl very well. You kino her, you're sexual, you push&pull, you're alfa,not easy to get, etc according to how it should be. The girl starts showing more and more IOI's, but then on your first or second date, in the comfort stage during your pick up, she starts talking that since she had a bad boyfriend a year ago, she is not realy interested anymore in relationships and guys. She starts calling you mate or buddy, and starts talking about guys who hit on her and tried to do a move on her while she made them clear that they were friend zoned.
You see her some other times, and you keep on flirting with her. You see her as a challenge so you don't give up. You can't believe you're friend zoned because you're very confident about this. You even feel a sexual tension sometimes, you can even think she maybe even secretly likes you but yet, she still calls you mate or buddy all the time. She isn't very subtle with it.

What do you think? Is the fact that she calls you mate or buddy, while you keep on flirting non needy a fact that it's game over? Or would you think it's bullshit, you don't give a fuck about what she tells you about being friend zoned and would you think that that she actualy thinks something else than what she says?

Her calling you buddy, can it be part of her game? Can she use it so she can test you if you're persistent, and not the usual player? Is she just waiting and trying to get to know you better, so that she thinks that you won't hurt her in the future like others did?

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Hey shyler
From my point of view, its just her game. Girls can manipulate any man, they look for ways to achive this, they are naturals, we men have to study it

That line will make her have the control and have the frame its like when you tell a girl "You are beautiful, sorry you are not my type"..... its kind of a shit test, if you are reactive you lose, if you are not reactive you lose.... so WTF!!!

Yeah im pretty sure she feel also sexual tension, she knows that there is flirting but she also know that you are freezed in the friend zone and she will make the move whenever she wants or blow u out if you make some move!!!
This kind of girls are so manipulative, THEY PLAY WITH YOU.

So you have to play the same way. After thinking a little bit this is how i would deal it:

Start mirroing everything. If she say "guys always try to hit on me and do their move" you say "yeah I know what you mean, at work girls try to hit on me , and I´m just like cool we can be friends, Hey we are not meat!!! yeah i know what you mean!!" (I just amplyfied it and took her words from her mind, and her line will not have as so much effect as she wanted)

Now, you have to work in the "buddy", this is a way you to have a fresh idea everytime that you are in the FIREND ZONE. So you have to start to relationate BUDDY with Sex. Everytime that you start flirting or the temperature start to grow up, You will start calling her Buddy. It will be more powerful if its on the pike of the tension. Anchor the word buddy. hahaha this is devil but she started first. And whenever you can amplify that word doing it more sexual. So the next time she calls yo buddy she will think in sex.


So its bullshit!!!!!

good luck

Cheers

Notneedy

Jow notneedy,

thanks for this sick answer!

I already discussed this girl with a good friend of mine who also knows the game and stuff. I always told him that it's not over yet. I NEVER BELIEVED A SHIT FROM HER. I just can't believe to be friend zoned. I just refuse to accept it.

I can feel it's not over yet. It's over when i say it's so. I just keep on flirting and play games. I give a few examples:

- I give her a hand shake like she is a buddy. However, when giving a hand shake while saying hey or bey, I pretend to give a normal hand shake, but at the moment I hold her hand, I look seductivly at her and pull her towards me so she can give me a kiss on the cheeck and so that we can hug.
-When in a bar, I sometimes grab her, then say "hey see that guy over there! I think he likes you! No no no! Don't be shy, I'll wing you ", etc.
- I just keep on kinoing, like Gambler explains in his stealth seduction.
- When she says "I can get anyone if I realy want too", I just look sexualy towards her and say "realy?"
- She buys a bottle of wine for the two of us. When she aks me if I want more, I react with "hey, trying to seduce me with alcohol is not classy"
- I'm never reactive to her calling me buddy or mate. If she does so, I will overexagerate that fact so that I make it ridiculous. I make cheesy mate jokes so she is associated with guys. When she told me once that she realy didn't feel the need of having boyfriends, I joked that she is a spinster.
- I play hard to get. I call her, she doesn't picks up the phone, she doesn't call me back, I'm like fuck it, I'm not gonna call back. Result? No contact for 2 days. But then she texts back to meet at her place
- When she said indirectly thus that she is hard to get, I started morroring as well. I said "yeah I'm also completely like that! I'm very picky and altough I enjoy the company of a lot of girls, in the end I'm not realy interested in them. I want girls to proove and to qualify themselfs to me ... blablabla"

But indeed it never came up to my mind to anchor the word "buddy". How would you anchor it? I'm thinking of for example, to grab her neck lightly with my right hand while putting my left hand on her waist and that I whisper something like "hey buddy" in her ear. Looks pretty sexual. Or when she calls me mate or buddy, I could add "... with benefits!"


One last question though ... How do I know when it's too late? I've met her like 3 weeks ago. On the first date, she started with her bullshit about that she doesn't date guys and that she only wants guys as friends blablabla (although I cold readed her and told subtly that it's not true and told her about her true inner self). I heavily kinoed her but I didn't force a kiss. I see her sometimes on college, I've met her at her house and we were alone at her room but altough I did build sexual tension (again very subtle), I didn't force anything, because yeah I was afraid that she might blow me out. She already blew a guy out this week with an other guy who tried to kiss her and force somethings a few times at her room, because she didn't want anything of her. Currently I try to play hard to get while being sexual with her sometimes. I try to get her thinking "does he like me now or not?", and getting her confused, but now I wonder how much time I still have left, or does it not matter much as long as I keep on flirting, being sexual and being hard to get?

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Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler

hey

Now, Im pretty sure she is playing her game.
If you feel it , just go for it. You only know when its over but from what you have written you still are in the game.

Good one, from a simple hand shake you create tension.

hahahaha, cool, I also use that line when she still giving me some resistance


Yeah with this girl I think micro-escalation are the best. Have you ever used when you start talking in her ear and start to escalate until you are almost so close that your cheek are touching hers. When Im like this I just give her a kiss on the cheek or when I stop saying something to her I slide my lips throught her cheek and then look her at her eyes (she will feel the friction of your lips)


Damn, she provocating you, why should say something like this?

Yeah, dont be reactive, your okay

I would say... "But you know, you don´t, you only get the one´s they approach to you! .... ohhh how I told you, that guy is very much your type, you can get him for sure!!!"


hahaha... good. "You are trying to make me drunk so you can seduce me"
I also use this one "you are tying to seduce me"

"are u a player, who is next???, I have to be carful with you .... Hey your hands, where I see them!!!!


She is trying not to look interested!!!!, There is a fight between you both. Who is the best and who keep the frame.

In phone game its where you feel so vulnerable.... Here they can win win win....
Yeah, Thats okay.... "Hey because I´m sitting with two beautiful ladies it doesnt mean that Im going to have sex with them as much as they would like to have sex with me."


Man you are doing it great, but still missing some ingredient. You have to make her get so horny that she barely will stop.

You have to be willing to lose her. You cant go from nothing to start kissing her, thats for sure that she will blow you. Why you didnt have a pillow fight?. That would create so much tension maybe util you are on the top of her, breathing so heavely.... looking very deeply in her eyes, very close to her and just wait there, creating more tension... maybe she jumps into you. Or if you dont feel sure just say okay im going for a glass of water. she "hey can a have some" you say "no you have legs" and then see her again in the eyes.

Just a possibility.

There is no so much time. You have been playing hard but if you don´t escalte to the kiss she will get tired of that.



Yeah, its a possibility but if your body is being sexual like this, you have to say it not sexual.

Just when you feel there is alot of tension between you both while you are talking to her. Insted of saying her name say to her buddy "So thats what u think buddy" " Hey buddy, arent that feel good"

or just provoque it with some NLP.

So next time, try to close


Notneedy

ever read styles "the game"

the best way to respond to something like this (when a woman sees if you react, but if you dont you fail too) is just one simple word: "respect"

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Yes, but how should I escalate? In general I try to kino like Gambler's stealth seduction whenever possible, which means when we're not sitting in 2 different chairs, or when she is just not out of reach.
Or for example, in class, I sat next to her, and in a tongue and cheesy romance way I put my hand on her upper leg to stroke it. But then she goes like "don't touch me!" ( I answered with a "m'escusi" from the film eurotrip. She laughed out loud ).

I understand that I should force something soon, but I have 2 objections: 1) as I said, there was also an other guy gaming her, he wasn't doing bad at all, but when he was in her room, he was sexual as well and he tried to do his moves on her too but she pushed him of her and thus rejected him. What if she does the same? 2) She said that sometimes she feels like chasing a guy, and when she gets his target, she is not interested anymore after the kiss. How can I prevent this?
Yeah ... good question, I didn't think about it to be honest. Then again it's a bit cheesy and kind of obvious to her. But what I did do was that I started to tickle her. But she said stop. To which I stoped for one second and started again in a faked surprise attack. She had to laugh but started saying stop soon, to which I realy stoped after the third one. I know from experiences that some girls just get pissed off when they're tickled.

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Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler

Maybe the ingredient could be Jelousy... That she can feel she doesnt have the same amount of attention. You are in the same classroom!!!! So you see her quite a lot.

Jelousy is one of the more lethal weapons. I have use it always with very good results. Just be careful dont over exagerate, its okay by just talking to another women, its better if its beautiful. Once I just had for sure a girl in my hands but I did this jelousy thing and she just went with another guy trying to give me jelouse... ofcourse I gave jelouse with another women...(I still gaming her with very srtong iois)

If you know she is around in Uni. and can see you, take your balls and approach the first beautiful women you see. Just ask wathever any opener and start gaming, remeamber just to talk with her, very importante lock in and lean your body backwards.!!, and just talk with her as long as you can (so it look like she is gaming you). Make her laugh and having a good moment and ask for her number

I can tell you she will be staring at you.

Just then, continue talking with you target in a cool way not sexual. If you have the moment say that she was a friend of a cousin or if she ask.

This is risky, you can make her want you more and giving more to you as she know you can have another woman (and you are the prize) or she just get colder with you.
The error of this guy is that he becomed sexual in her room. She knew what the guy was trying to do. You have to become sexual before going to the room so her perception is you arenot forcing to fuck her.
Yeah, but you know that you MUST NOT SAY THAT YOU ARE ATTRACTED TO HER OR YOU LIKE HER , yeah this is complety true, after the kiss this guys start to demostrate interest and they could feel they have her for sure, so therefor she didnt felt anymore challenge. Is not the kiss that make her lose her interest (you have still sex) is the change of actitude of this guys. They start gaming her to fuck her.

And again She is playing her game, I can say she is alittle bit over exagerating, she wants to be the prize, she wants to be "i can have all men i want", she wants to be I have control of any guy, I decide when and how. Now you see here is the main problem of her, here is her weakness.

Jelousy could be the solution. She is your "firend"(as her point of view) isn´t it? why, should she get jelouse if another girl is gaming you.

Use the buddy when you become sexual, Use all ur artillery!!!

So good luck soldier

Cheers

Notneedy

Yes I am aware that the time is arrived to pull out the big guns.

Yesterday, I saw her again. We went to a pub along with 11 other girls ( I was the only guy) to eat there. It was a kind of reunion from a camp. I was surrounded by girls. She was sitting left of me. Left of her sat an other hot girl with whom I have some contact. On the right of me sat a girl of my working group of college. In the oppisite of me sat an other hot, but boring, girl who says almost nothing.

Again I used the same kino tactics as always, maybe even better this time, but very subtle as we were sitting with 12 people. I talked with her often, but I also tried to make her jealous. I sometimes talked with the girl left of her. I talked a lot with the girl on the right of me, but in a non sexual way. I acted very cocky funny in , I used absurd humour and I let many laugh there.

I sometimes ignored her in order to talk to other girls, and to show her that she is not very important and that I'm not that easy. I wasn't that all the time though. I tried to push and pull her, so basicly most of the time I was talking to other girls and showing interest in them, sometimes with game, sometimes not. And some other times I was talking to her with a lot of kino and being very sexual.

She might have noticed or she might have not what I was doing and when i spoke to other girls (and when other girls kinoed me).

A good friend of mine says that I should accept and give up, and just keep her as a good friend and a winggirl, and that I shouldn't ruin it by making a move on her. I am not gonna use my move on her, but basicly I'm trying to get her to the point that she is begging me to kiss and to fuck her. Only then I will try my move on her.

Oh yeah, some other things I maybe should say. She said some important things to me, that might be a hint.

She told me when we just met (we were sitting in the opposite of each other at a table), that she then has never had a conversation like that with anyone else she just met before with me. She said it was very funny and didn't make any sense (I played role playing games with her. she was my wife and we divorced when she did something bad and married again when she did something good. I also talked about our honey moon, in a tongue and cheeck romance way).
She also told me that she couldn't read me, and that she was wondering all the time if I liked her or not. She just couldn't know.

And yesterday she said also something like that. She said I was like an actor, who can act very good (in a non sarcastic way. again she actualy says the same thing. If I lie I can put my frame so well that people will almost believe, even if I put on an incredible bullshit story).

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I know this will sound sexist, but I don't think any one girl is worth that amount of effort. She's either not that into you or got some issues preventing her from opening up to you.

You were surrounded by 11 girls and somehow you didn't find one that you could get along better with than this one?

Nah, I used game on some of them, but most were boring grenades lower than a 7.

I understand that you say that she isn't worth the effort, but believe me, I game on automatic pilote. I game her on automatic pilot, so it's not a real "effort" or what I just love gaming and playing games.


I'm new at college in a new city in a new country. Most people in my freshman year still don't live in this town so they are not easy to meet and I have the bad luck that most girls I coincidentally meet are grenades. Honestly, my club game is not good, so I have to do with my pretty good day game. I'm in a difficult position. I have to go from zero to hero. It will still take a while before I have met many other hot babes who I can game again because It takes intensive socialing (which is a real effort) and I already gamed with most doable and hot girls who I've met
She however does live in town, we already get very good along and hang out often, and she is an 8, and she told me she likes giving blowjobs and having sex, so I can at least give it a shot.
If she won't be begging me to kiss her in the end, I can still use game on her with the intention of her keeping as one of my best female friends/ winggirls. Pethaps she'll introduce me to her friends, or her hot younger sister

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Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler

You are not specially disadvantaged with the situation you described. You've got precisely the same chance as everyone else.

I've never gamed at a night club. The only "gaming" I've done, and the only results I've had, are from day game or parties.

I meant to also add - to me, the list of excuses you just gave sounds pretty typical of that negative inner voice. Ignore it.

What you just said, that reminds me of something. By surfing on the forums here a few days ago, I came to a thread you made, where someone posted this link: http://www.attractioninstitute.org/what ... inner-game, including 3 films of 1 seminar about inner game. It reminded me of the guy saying "just accept it".

I know I think pretty analyticaly and criticaly, I also kind of like to see game analyticaly, as I'm also very into psychology and sociology (which is kind of my study now, and many inner game theories comes back in it). But the guys says you should go with the flow, and stop thinking analyticaly. He also mentions that verbal game is only 7%. Altough I learned much of it, I do not agree with that. I think that verbal game and things like C&F, push&pull, kino, (dis)qualification are pretty important in PU.

I wanted to know, what do you think of what the guy says? Are you enthousiastic about it? Did it improve your game?

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You WANT to make a change.
You CAN make a change.
You WILL make a change.

Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler