Ok so I was always raised to never have sex before marriage. My parents really pounded that thought into me my whole life, they weren't even very religious but for some reason it was very important to them, and for a long time I planned on sticking to that. However, that not having sex before marriage thing eventually shifted to not having sex before falling in love or at least finding someone with that possibility and that's what I've been waiting for with not very much success to be honest. I'm still a virgin at 21, and it's because I've been waiting to for a relationship. Not so much for "the one" but for "a one" you know someone I could really care about. I've dated a few women but something's always gone wrong, one girl was actually falling for me but she was moving in a month so she broke it off with tears streaming down her cheeks a few days after our third date. It sort of seems like women in my age group aren't looking for the same things I am. It's not like I'm trying to get married or anything, but I would rather have a string of LTR's than a list of hookups. You learn more about people that way.

Anyway, lately I've been realizing how far off my approach to women in general has been; and after the latest "almost" I'm starting to wonder if I should just get it over with. I'm not horrible with women, but building a sexual frame has always been my biggest problem. I can be funny and charming and romantic and blah blah blah but I guess when it comes down to the physical stuff or the anticipation thereof I tend to lock it down and over think. I have lots of friends, I'm very motivated in my life, and I could probably get this done pretty quick if I really set my mind to it. However, one of my worst fears is the compromising of myself. I'm afraid that if I just have sex for the sake of experience, instead of waiting for what I really want, I'll lose part of myself. The truth is, I would rather find love than sex; but a part of me thinks it would be easier to find said female after I'm playing with a full deck so to speak. I'll keep working on picking up women regardless but I guess this decision could change my frame a bit. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

First of all, just relax about the whole matter. Interactions with women is a journey, not a destination. Don't be so darn goal focused ("I want to have a gf," "I have guilt issues about sex"). Just enjoy the women you're around and keep going out in the field. You probably aren't giving kino in the first few seconds of interacting with her either or escalating to poking her, slapping her hands or the claw.

And hate to tell you this bit bud but girls like having sex and they need a man that give that to them in a way they want. If they can't get that from you they will find it elsewhere, real fast.

And lastly erase the entire idea in your head that having sex will make you "lose something of yourself." That's lethal to your inner game and attraction. Instead use the mantra "I am an attractive man that women want to be around and sex is a natural way of expressing myself to a woman who I care about."

Don't get me wrong I want to have sex and when I meet a girl I connect with I don't hold back and I don't have a problem with girls liking sex that's awesome and I don't judge people for that. People should enjoy sex. I guess the point of the post is whether I should work on detaching the emotions from the action when it comes to that part of my game. I've been working on kino and having some relative success. I usually go with the arm to arm then challenge her to a thumb war. Haha I know it sounds stupid but it's sort of playful and I think woman go for it because it disengages their shield and brings them into that fun playful mood. Anyway, what I was saying is that there have been a few girls who I've been attracted to in just a physical sense and they've been into me but I haven't pushed forward because I'm not very open to having a fling. I know I'm thinking too much as usual lol I guess I'm just trying to talk this out of my system.

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"All the dragons in our lives are perhaps princesses expecting us to be handsome and brave, all the terrifying things are perhaps nothing but helpless things waiting for us to help them." Rilke

Looks like someone has some neative beliefs about sex. Trust me buddy, Im still there but feel wayyyy more open to sex than I did before. Heres what id recommend for you to check out to geting rid of these limiting beliefs about sex.

1. Get David D's Power Sexuality DVD'S
2. http://www.recreateyourlife.com/free/ (I just did this like 30 minutes ago and feel a difference in the way I feel. Ill just have to go in-field to see if their really is a difference)
3. http://www.4shared.com/file/105814686/e ... e.html?s=1
4. Id reccomend you consult an EMDR therapist. Ive heard alot of GREAT things about them and they really help you get rid of your netive beliefs and traumas ive heard. Actually, im seeing one this week so ill update all of you guys on how that went.

But besides that id suggest checking out some books about sex also. David Shade, Geoffrey miller, and David Deida have a SHITLOAD of great books on the topic.

Peace!

Hmm I guess it is possible I do have negative thoughts about sex. This side of my life is just odd for me to be honest, which is why I started into this community. I'm at the top of my game in all other aspects. I've got a 3.7 gpa, I'm starting to write part time for a local paper, and I have a truly awesome group of friends. Maybe it's just been easier to sit around and over romanticize everything instead of actually push myself out of the door and off of a book to go find what I need. I appreciate the links Msquared but unfortunately I'm far too broke to purchase any of that. Right now I'm in my last two years of undergrad and after that it's off to a pile of student loans for law school lol.

I guess I just have a problem opening myself up to people, especially regarding women who I am interested in. Not to get too serious but I figure this should be my getting everything off of my chest thread. Can't get too far into a community until people know your story right? Well this is complicated but something really bad happened in my past. My dad had an affair with the man who molested my little sister for four years after he was convicted. Needless to say there was a period in my life, mostly in highschool, where my life was hell. My mom drank a lot and I didn't have her to turn to, and my dad just generally didn't care I guess. But he acted like he did so I lived with him. During that time I realized that my father is bipolar, but he is completely unwilling to seek meaningful help. I also found out that he had been in constant contact with the man who started all of this for upwards of three years. This shook me to my core. To me my father was the last person who I could count on, but he betrayed his children without even a second thought. I ended up staying with him for a year and a half: bad idea. I guess I thought I could get through to him and figure out why he did what he did, to this day I still never have. Eventually, I left and moved in with my mom after she stabilized, I haven't talked with him since. I saw a counselor during all of this and it helped a lot, but afterwards I was left to reconstruct my social life.

Thankfully, even though I was awkward and had some major trust issues a good friend I've known since I was two or so introduced me to another friend, and that guy's one of the most popular people I've ever met. Life has been a constant upward climb since then, and I have very few complaints. One great thing about seeing the bottom is that you gain a great sense of self. For the most part, I know exactly who I am and I know that no matter what I can and will always push forward. Now I'm back to who I was before all of that started, well for the most part. Somehow I still turned out to be an optimist: something I'm eternally grateful for. However, while I have tons of friends who see the real me and tell me it's kickass; for some reason I still have walls up. I'm working on tearing them down but it's a work in progress. My trust issues have gone way down, and the awkward stage is dead. Now I'm the life of the party, it's awesome. But about the negative views on sex I may have, what's the best way to correct this? I figure I'll keep pushing in the field (well I'm still getting started with that but my party game is getting pretty solid) and once I start developing more physical experiences with women it will iron itself out. Sometimes I guess I just have doubts, killing the AFC can be a bitch you know?

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"All the dragons in our lives are perhaps princesses expecting us to be handsome and brave, all the terrifying things are perhaps nothing but helpless things waiting for us to help them." Rilke

Man, I feel for you. Thats some crazy shit though that the person you loved so much would do those kinds of things to his children. I too, have major trust issues with people. There was a point in my life where I lost all of my friends completely because well I just lived another lifestyle I guess. That hit me really hard to the core man. I havent been the same since. But as time progresses im getting better and better at opening myself up to people.

Maybe one of the reasons you have a hard time opening up to people is of the things your father did. You loved someone so much so dearly and you felt like he betrayed you in a way. If I went through that shit man I dont know what id do. Your really strong for being where you are right now. Most people would just give up on life. Also, your trust issues might come from your mother also. I guess you kind of felt abandoned because you had noone to turn too. Your mother you said drank heavily and your father did something very bad. Id be thinking to myself that if I cant even trust my own parents then who can I trust.

Same for me man. Im getting back to the stage in my life before my situation of losing my friends happened. Im also kind of the life of the party you can say. I go out to clubs and parties and just have a great time. At the same time I think this kind of had a good effect to you. From the looks of it im guessing you really dont give a shit about what others think. But at the same time it really would suck to go through what youve been through.

Dude, so you said your a virgin right? Well, man I think you really dont have any negtive beliefs about sex. Its just that you LACK EXPERIENCE. Honestly, I think once you have sex you just wont give a shit really. Its that just not knowing is whats holding you back. For you I think experience should seal the deal. If not then theres a belief somewhere in there.

But dude I really respect you for opening up like this on the forum. Not many guys would have the balls to relive that story and tell everyone about it.

P.S. Links 1 & 2 are for free and dont cost anything. Make sure to check them out.

P.P.S Check your inbox

Peace!

Dude like I always say, fuck the balls. If you have something to say you should say it. Holding back, especially in a society like this, is pointless. I'm just working on who I want myself to be, and I know that one day it's going to happen. Letting the struggles of your life fall into a weakness instead of a strength is a misjudging of one's character. I know I'm of strong character and I know anybody who views this forum is the same way. Everybody in this world is the same in essence. Yes, sometimes we hold ourselves back, and sometimes the odds seem insurmountable; but in the end life is a collection of choices. Having the balls to confront your fears and shortcomings with women is only the first step, learning to push forward no matter what, is the end game. I've seen that end game at face value and I know damn well we can all achieve this. For me, I possess the double-edged sword of over-romanticizing everything. It's great for passion and will, but it's shit for closing and escalation, well at least in my stage. For me my end game is this: I want to be able to show who I am in all aspects of life; I'm strong, intelligent, charming, funny, passionate, and determined. I can accomplish anything I set my mind onto and I honestly believe that. What I want out of pickup is a few good lines and the outer game to match my inner game. I want to have options and I want women to see me for who I am, if they don't fall for that then they aren't worthy. I guess I'm just looking for the security to be who I am mixed with the tips and ideas I've been looking for. Fuck it though right? Time cures the ills of the present: stagnation is nought but the frame by which purpose is driven. Let us who are poets be poets and let those of us who are standard be standard: but all of WE will be spectacular, because life has allowed us such recompense.

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"All the dragons in our lives are perhaps princesses expecting us to be handsome and brave, all the terrifying things are perhaps nothing but helpless things waiting for us to help them." Rilke

Damn that was good

the reason I am responding is because you mention the trap of romanticizing/emotionalizing everything. I have the same problem. If you have any specific strategies for dealing with this i would really like to hear them, its a big problem.

I wish I did man, I'm still dealing with that right now. Still though, I'm not quite sure if it is a bad thing or a trap; I believe if you can channel that energy great things can happen. I'll let you know when I work that process out though, still working at it.

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"All the dragons in our lives are perhaps princesses expecting us to be handsome and brave, all the terrifying things are perhaps nothing but helpless things waiting for us to help them." Rilke