I met a girl at a party last night, started to escalate kino, got her to change venues with me, to go to a pub nearby. We found two open stools at the bar, ordered drinks, and I continued to work on building rapport and kino. But I felt like I lost a little momentum. After we left, I kiss-closed; still, I think some of the energy dwindled while at the pub. Looking back, I suspect it was our body position while sitting at the bar. We were both facing forward, and I imagine it would have been much better if I had suggested we turn our stools so we'd be facing each other. That way, there would have been more eye contact, more leg-to-leg kino, etc. I'm curious to hear what other people think. Thanks.

You don't suggest, you do... you should have initiated the the face-to-face position early on while things were escalating to keep the momentum going. If you make a mistake, fix it fast.

Also, a good PUA knows when to leave. The moment you feel something going down hill, its time to close and leave if you can't fix it fast enough....If she suspects that things are going down-hill then she might not give you a second chance.

Remember, you are in control. Worst case scenario, its a lesson learned.

Best,

J-Dub

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J-Dub in DC

Its better to be the predator than the prey.

You need to be a good player if your gonna be successful at the game.

Thanks, J-Dub for confirming my suspicion that I should have initiated a face-to-face position at the bar. The thing is that I didn't think about this idea until afterward, when I was reviewing the night in my mind. So it wasn't a case of realizing then and there that I'd made a mistake and just not acting quickly enough to fix it. I didn't realize it was a mistake at all until the thought occurred to me later.

And it wasn't exactly that things began to go downhill at the pub. The conversation was flirty and lively; she revealed a lot about herself; and there was a decent amount of kino. I just think I could have built even more comfort and raised her BT still higher if I had been sitting face to face with her. I'm glad to have corroboration that that would have been the right move. Lesson learned!

One more thing... you said you went to another bar and had a few more drinks....

Keep in mind that drinking too much will cause you to stumble on your game.

I limit myself to not more than one drink PER HOUR while I am out. If you get drunk or even a little bit buzzed, you WILL start messing up your game...So to keep in control of the game you need to control your alcohol intake. Trust me on this one, I jinxed a lot of games because of alcohol...lesson learned the hard way.

Food for thought...

J-Dub

_________________
J-Dub in DC

Its better to be the predator than the prey.

You need to be a good player if your gonna be successful at the game.

I agree with this. If u jst start thinking about urself a bit u'll realize how much ur game will get better. If u feel like u dont like smthing change it. Dont start thinking about why is it like that
Ill disagree on this. Face to face isnt really that good. Ideal is side by side on low chairs/couch. When going face-to-face ur putting too much pressure on the both of you.

Dude, they were sitting at the bar on stools (that was the only thing available to them) and that he already had a good kino thing going on so face-to-face at the bar on bar stools would have been a good move...

But i do agree, the side-by-side on couch would be ideal.

J-Dub

_________________
J-Dub in DC

Its better to be the predator than the prey.

You need to be a good player if your gonna be successful at the game.

Your point is a great one, J-Dub; excessive drinking can definitely wreck your game. But I'm well in control of my intake; I consume alcohol only in moderation. Last night, for example, I had one drink at the party and one more at the pub. When I wrote that I "ordered drinks," I only meant that I'd ordered a round -- a glass for her and a glass for me. At any rate, I'm in complete agreement with you on the perils of heavy boozing.

Yeah, sitting side by side on a couch would've been ideal, but unfortunately it wasn't an option; stools along the bar were the only choice.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Hitman47.

hey everyone,

it seems that people are assuming there are only 2 positions face to face or side by side. What about at 90 degrees to each other?

Each time I've dated and I've sat opposite the girl there's always something in the way, usually a table. It also makes the conversation seem more like an interview. So face to face in *that* circumstance is pretty weak if not positively bad.

Sitting side by side is good as you can get in a lot of kino but the conversation can be awkward as eye contact is a pain in the butt.

Try the 90 degrees thing and you can get the best of both worlds

That's a great point, skypirate1965. And I particularly like the geometrical possibilities this idea raises: you can try 30 degrees with one girl, 45 degrees with another, and 60 degrees with a third. And I'm only half joking here. This could be a whole new branch of field reporting!

The point to be made is not really side-side vs -face-face vs 90... The most important lesson is more: If you feel something is wrong, fix it.

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Drink me, make me feel real
Wet your beak in the stream
Game we're playing is life
Love is a two way dream

Exactly what I think

I'll add to this by saying you should also prepare well. If you're in a place and already drinking prepare the environment so that your girl will be in your preferred position.

I recall a date I'd set and I was already sitting waiting for the girl. It was in a low 2 seater settee/sofa and opposite was the same. In between was a small table. I hate that opposite and barrier thing so I just put my coat on the opposite settee. When the girl arrived shel had little choice but to sit next to me. People usually take the easiest option. use this to your advantage

Thanks for your observation, TheJ, and for seconding or thirding it, Hitman47.
That's a really good comment, skypirate1965, about preparing the environment. I recently arrived for a date (a Day 4) ahead of the girl. There was a choice between two spots: one had two chairs separated by a fairly large table; the other was a place to stand at the end of the bar, tucked behind a little column and at a choke point where the wait staff was constantly moving to and from the kitchen. I chose the second spot because I knew it would feel cozy; the column provided a bit of intimacy and privacy, and the natural parameters established by the column and the bottleneck would mean we would have to stand close to each other. And since it was a Day 4, I knew the girl already felt very comfortable with me, so there was no risk of her feeling claustrophobic or uneasy. After the girl showed up, a few minutes later, the plan proved to work like a charm, and that spot was a great place to kick off the evening, because it helped to smoothly but quickly elevate the sexual temperature with a lot of direct and indirect kino.

This is what amazes me about people when they say that a traditional date doesn't allow opportunities. I like films so if I have a traditional date ie movie then a drink or two and it's considered bad. I don't think so. One it's getting the girl used to your physical proximity. I have a feeling in theory that if you get a girl next to you for 5 or 6 hours in total watching movies together she will be far more easy to seduce. Two You can get some talking and kino in. You can try to touch or hold hands, touch her nearby knee. You can even make out. It is awkward admittedly but can be done. I think you need some rapport and kino established earlier so maybe a thing for a day3 if you're that way inclined. Thirdly If you are stumped for conversation afterwards there is always the film to talk about. I may try actually negging the next film I see where i take a girl along to see if they will defend it. Could be a good compliance and/or qualification test. This could lead to a different topic - applying PUA techniques in the traditional dating frame/environment.