Ok, so in another thread someone was trying to get out of the friend zone and someone recommended making sure she knows he feels, then pretty much dropping all contact with her.

I asked a couple questions in that thread, but got no replies so figured I'd start a new thread...

Basically there are a couple differences in my situation:
1) She has a boyfriend
2) I run a social club she's a member of, and we're both assistants in another club... meaning that it would be almost impossible to subtly avoid her

Now, first of all I haven't said anything explicit to her about my feelings. However I almost kissed her several times when we were out one night, so I don't think she's unaware of my feelings. Still wondering if I should say something explicit though? My therapist thinks if I do that I'm giving her power over the relationship, but it seems like by avoiding her I might still be the one in control?

Second, what are the chances of a freeze out just sending her back into her boyfriend's arms? I mean, right now I just don't feel like she's really into him or I wouldn't be bothering...

EDIT: One thing I should have mentioned, we already dated and she expressed an interest in me... to the point of asking me out because she was afraid I wasn't going to. It was a couple days after our "first date" that she decided to become serious about her now-boyfriend. Also, a couple days after the one night of barhopping where I felt like I could have kissed her several times she wanted to get together for a drink.

Hi Onoma

Tricky situation you've got yourself in to and my first piece of advice would be to move on as it sounds like you've got one-itis. Now I appreciate that doesn't help you much so I'll give you my thoughts on what to do to actually get this one.

Firstly, disregard the boyfriend and take the lead. The boyfriend won't be an issue if you don't let it be an issue. If she brings him up when you're running tight game just take it as an IOI, she's just putting the blame on you. This implies that she envisages the blame being necessary i.e. she wants to do things with you that will make her feel guilty.

Secondly, you can't avoid her but in my experience, you can't game girls you're not in contact with. Re-frame this as a positive. This way, you can meet her because you have to but be completely dis-interested.

On whether or not you should explicity convey your feelings for her, don't do it! Demonstrate that you are a man of a sexual nature but don't make this specific to her. Subtly make it apparent that she is not of a high enough quality for you through negs. Combine this with an array of DHVs demonstarting how smart and valuable you are while being fun and interesting to be with. When done correctly, she will be attracted to you at which point it is far safer to let her know you're attracted to her. On this point, bare in mind Mystery's quallities of an alpha male. Look these up and demonstrate them.

It should be borne in mind that it's okay to let her know you are attracted to her but only after you are sure that she's attracted to you otherwise she has the higher value. Do not get attraction confused with feelings. You can't let her know that you have feelings for her until much later and it needs to be proportional. Going in with an 'I love you' just before you have sex will almost certainly blow you out however, letting her know that you were thinking about her/enjoy spending time with her/think she's cool will make her feel secure with you i.e. you're not going to sleep with her and leave. Just remember, keep this for end game when it's actually justified, not after 20 minutes of talking.

Hope this helps!

Panache

Thanks Pan@che, I edited in a bit more detail. I've talked about this girl in a few different threads, and wanted to keep it a bit simpler... but among other things I'm pretty sure she is interested in me. I wouldn't go so far as to say she's a one-itis though...

It's interesting you say bringing up the boyfriend is an IoI, because when we were out for drinks the other night she kept bringing him up. Not constantly, just a few times. I wasn't doing any game on her... partly because I really don't know any of this well and partly because at the time I felt like just avoiding her and telling her we couldn't be friends. But we got as far as we did by just talking and hanging out, so I was probably doing the same things that led her to ask me out in the first place.

A corollary on this: Should I be around when her boyfriend is? Again, all part of the same club so we're bound to run into each other. I just backed out of a thing right now, partly because I know her boyfriend will be there.

But really, am I better off showing up in these cases... kind of showing her that the guy is no threat to me?

*bump*

Really? No one has anything on this?

Hi Onoma

Notice how when you don't run game she's still interested? You're obviously doing the right things already. Dare I say that it's on and you're merely not taking the lead/initiative and making her make-out with you?

It's not about her giving permission, it's about you taking her by the hand and making out with her without her saying 'No'. Notice the difference, you're in charge remember so everything is a 'Yes' until she says 'No'. Just grab her and make-out and see what happens then either way at least you'll have closure but I'm confident that it'll work just fine.

On your second point, you should absolutely be around when the boyfriend's around. By avoiding him you demonstrate fear. By meeting him you can out-alpha him which is arguably the best way to get a girl less interested in her boyfriend and more interested in you. For example, I'm friends with this couple and when the girl gets a couple of drinks down her, it's me she sits next to and flirts with, not her boyfriend. She can't control it because sub-conciously she knows that I'm the alpha male of my group. So, look up some AMOG techniques and just use one or two in her presence to demonstarte that you are more alpha than him.

Panache

Thanks for the advice! Just wish you'd told me that before I asked the quesiton...