Wow, you're actually not going to argue a point. Congratulations!

Yep. Probably because you didn't try to be their pal.
I have. and it's usually on social media, or running into them, and lastly, text or call. I'd split it at about 30% for each way.

That's not true.


I already explained what the seed planting is. It's excelling at fitness, being emotionally-centered, focusing on your career and hobbies, and going for what you want right away, not apologizing for it, and then moving on if you get rejected.

Being able to walk away from a woman can be intoxicating for them, even years later. Most guys simply are unable to do this.

_________________
Pickup coach. PM for direct, simple coaching.

why would I disagree? I've been saying this constantly since I've joined the forum. Please point to someone who does and experiences it as a regular thing.What you are explaining isn't seed planting. At best it's setting a good impression which just about all of us talk about. Clear this up because social media and running into someone are catalysts that allows two people to re-establish communication and not her just going along about her life and then suddenly wanting to contact the guy she rejected a year ago. But since you are throwing out percentages, what's the percentage of women that ghosted you the moment you asked her out end up contacting you months to years later?

_________________
mpuaforum.proboards.com

Some chicks will come back, but its not really due to seeds planted and being "mysterious" if a chick hits you up a year or months later. That's just attaching your ego to things. If a chick that was a complete stranger who ghosted you hits you up months or a while later, thats just her being bored and lacking options. It is what it is. Its not because she was "intoxicated" months later. You're a guy she was attracted to, her options arent good at the moment and she's seeing whats up. Happens to everyone, but I dont attach a bunch of stuff to it.

Now, a chick you run into, thats different. That has a high likelihood as she's SEEING you in person. But its not the fact that you moved on, just she's seeing you and its simple. Same with social media. You're popping up on her feed, she thinks oh let me message him. But its strange coming from Arch as adding chicks on social media you havent slept with he advises against that, so chicks coming back on social media is against the whole be direct and dont fuck around mindset.

For a complete stranger situation ie you meet a chick online or out youve never met before and will never see, she ghosts....yeah its not likely she'll hit back. Could happen and does, but its just the numbers playing out and the chick hitting up guys. For a chick you see...its a different game and more so how she sees you AFTER, not being intoxicated from when you were talking to her. Like really...there are so many orbiters out there that you'll stand out a year LATER, but she has so many other cool dominant guys that you dont stand out in the 1st place?! Thats like saying your resume wasnt good enough to get you an interview a year ago, but the company likes your resume so much a year later thats why they're emailing you now. Lol Arch, I dont know what situation you're in...so many orbiters and lame guys and then somehow so many dominant men that she's ghosting in the first place.

Yeah, there are girls that you just kind of talk to, things don't quite get anywhere for one reason or another so contact breaks and for whatever reason she shows back up again down the line. It's this specific situation that I've never seen happen...a girl gets asked out and instead of her agreeing to go out, she just drops off the map but after a few months she is into you like it didn't happen. In this situation, it isn't that things aren't getting anywhere...she's deliberately stopping things from happening.

Ok...I'll give it one time for a woman ghosting after after an invite, anything is possible. Two times, okay maybe. But when you are saying that it happens regularly like it's normal behavior for women to do this...it's starting to sound like a tall tale. Numerous occasions after a few months and numerous occasions of over a year and some of them lose their shit?

_________________
mpuaforum.proboards.com

Tbh, I think he's being truthful.
.

The majority of his experience with this ie 2 out of 3 with social media being the most common, implies he's talking about something different from a complete stranger scenario. The problem is telling a guy who is online dating to do "Netflix at my place 9 pm" with the caveat that she may ghost and hit you up, is bad because he has these chicks already on social media, he's already seeing these girls out in public.Arch is in a small town right, and hitting on bartenders and people he knows...so I could see him running into them again and they re initiate. But when he usually says this "they'll often come back" its misleading because he's actually advocating not getting to the point of adding chicks on social media, and to guys meeting a girl they'll never see again. Thats like me giving that advice because it happens to be consistently, but not including that I'm mostly dating chicks in my social circle which I'll see night after night anyway. I'm with you J, I dont know of this happening consistently or frequently enough...but yeah if Im dating a chick at work or a chick I see all the time or have on facebook, yeah it happens more. I live in a big city, smaller that yours Jack...come on you know that doesnt happen that frequently with chicks from online or at the bar or the grocery store. And the fact that it mostly happens from social media when Arch is for not fucking around with that stuff and gets to the point quickly...yeah its just some misleading shit with facts omitted. Wouldnt you advise guys to add chicks on social media if that was the case, instead of all the text for meetups stuff? He's prob being honest, I just think its revealing that all that its not as he describes everything else.

I believe that he is leaving stuff out too for his Netflix at 9 situations. I laid out the situation in a way that he always describes things and the only thing he says is "hardly say anything" is an exaggeration and throws in the avenues of improvement. Let's be honest, no woman knows that you're improving yourself unless she cans see it while it's happening. There is no reason for her to say a year later that this guy is more improved now and he was so dominant before (unless the small town thing is part of it).

I even went as far as asking him to write his approach to things to establish a foundation for guys to understand his advice. There is a huge piece of his advice that's missing. Dominant men go for what they want isn't an explanation of HOW dominant men go for what they want. He doesn't want to write that and it usually ends up with him going on the attack about how other guys don't get girls, get fat girls, haven't gotten girls in a long time, or girls that are old. It would be so easy just to explain.

_________________
mpuaforum.proboards.com

I don't mean to be a dick, but this shows a lack of experience. These are usually women with boyfriends, or women who are in early courtship with a man they see as potential bf material. Their availability fluctuates. Thus my comments about a year, months, etc. Of course, continuing to improve in all facets plays a role.






Yes. How are your approach numbers, Jack? Because when you really put in the numbers, you get women who do this, as long as you're a fit, playful, and emotionally centered guy.

To address Neo's points, my town is about 80k when university is in session, so not that small. Also, I don't usually add the women on social. They'll message me/add me and I'll oblige.

_________________
Pickup coach. PM for direct, simple coaching.

Or maybe it shows your weakness. You say that you are 90% dick...ever think that may be the problem if you can't get a girl that's in early courtship already? You ever think it's a problem that a girl that's willing to give you her phone number knowing that she has a boyfriend but after seeing what little you have to show her that she'd rather stick with the boyfriend. It sounds to me like the problem isn't with my experience and more to do with your ability with seduction.I do better than most guys but at the same time I don't think I'm special or have some big secret. I don't have to follow special rules for women to like me back. Like I said above, you must be pushing these girls to where you are not worth the risk or the time.

At some point you need to quit going on these petty attacks and just explain. Become clear so everyone can say, "oh, that's what he means," and shit won't go out of pocket. However, you go on the attack because you say something, refuse to clarify how you did it outside of be fit, playful, and emotionally centered. Arch, I'm fit, playful, and emotionally centered although I do express emotions. I have a great career. I read everything. After saying all of that, I get women and don't have them ghosting me when I ask them out and you're trying to say the reason I don't get ghosted in this type of situation is because of my lack of experience?

_________________
mpuaforum.proboards.com

Last few days she got colder while texting, but we are meeting for a practice and going bowling on wednesday. Anyway, I'm already tired of mixed signals, playing games with her, so I'm gonna try be professional, friendzone her and look for other girls.

I just really need to care less. And by mentally deciding I won't pursue her might even help get her down the road - or not! But at least that way I won't care and I'll get to cooperate with her professionally. At the moment I'm emtionally too tired to invest so much game into her. As long as I keep her as an option in my mind, I can't help but get invested. And I don't have a button to regulate how much I care. Yeah I know, it's an AFC mentality.

I get it, man. You like the girl's face, lol. It happens.

Pull back on all the god damn texting, and see how things go at the bowling alley.

You are flopping between both extremes right now, IE "I want her bad, how can I win her over?" to "I'm moving on entirely".

It's okay to be in the middle, to be chill, and see how things go. If the bowling goes well, kiss her in the parking lot. It's okay to go after what you want.

The key is to start seeing other women. Be good to yourself, and don't get hung up on a girl with a boyfriend. Treat her for what she is right now: a devious woman who is bored, not the love of your life.

_________________
Pickup coach. PM for direct, simple coaching.

Arch, dont you see how this is misleading though? I mean, from your style...I'd never guess you'd even entertain adding chicks on social media. You preach this get to the point style, and I'd think social media adds/invite accepts would be against that. In fact you said this:
Thats the style you portray and even say straight out. Now, if its that likely an occurrence that chicks re initiate on social media, you gotta be accepting invites often. But thats against what you portray and what youve actually said in the past you don't do. Its like when you would say you make chicks pay on dates....dig a little deeper and that just applies to dates not going well...thats a different situation and the original statements give an inaccurate portrayal. I'm not even calling you out...just reading something and thinking "Hmm...Arch doesnt sound like a guy accepting friend requests...maybe I'm wrong...oh he did say he doesnt." I just hope you can see how this character would actually hurt guys looking for advice, as you're not even doing what you say. You'd have these guys thinking a chick reinitiating is somewhat common, but they'd avoid accepting friend requests...to then wonder why chicks arent reinitiating at the level you describe.

I do accept them.

I do not initiate them.

I would not tell a guy to not accept a friend request or message request from a girl they want to sleep with, lol. My "don't use social" advice applies to guys who need to improve their fitness and look, and go outside and interact with women at bars and markets, etc.

_________________
Pickup coach. PM for direct, simple coaching.

You do understand that only one of those things can be true, right?

_________________
mpuaforum.proboards.com

Yeah Arch...I mean its pretty clear what you were saying.

Even the lead up: You're smart...you know how that sentence is structured its clearly talking about avoiding accepting friend requests. And yeah, youve said multiple times you dont oblige to friend requests. Youve said even with chicks you sleep with...you don't accept friend requests. I dont care if you do or don't but the truth is, it sounds like 2 different guys here; one who doesnt add or accept chicks on social media and the other who is fine with accepting invites on social media. It stands out to me, because the initial guy...thats me...I dont accept chicks on social media..I dont update it and probably has stupid stuff from college on there. Plus with dating, it becomes a chore to track who's who months or years after. So the first perspective I can see that. Its the other perspective, coming from thinking that I can agree with your previous style that made me say that doesnt make sense. If I'm avoiding accepting friend requests...I'm not accepting friend requests. I'm not "completely avoiding" them to then say I'm obliging Jack thinks you're an asshole...I think you're a regular guy. I think you accept friend requests, text chicks outside of meetups and flirting and pay for dates. All that other stuff may be you trying to help guys be mysterious but it doesnt sound authentic.

Do you two have jobs? I wonder how you have time for this.

If I'm accepting requests, I usually am no longer interested in fucking the girl. These are usually women who are chasing pretty hard, and not my type. However, if a girl with a bf ghosts me for a first date and then months later requests me, I'll oblige.

BUT what I won't do is friend request a woman in the process of early courtship, or before a first date. Which clarifies my previous comment about "completely avoiding facebook friends with I girl I'm fucking".

I'm off to the gym. And you two should be as well.

_________________
Pickup coach. PM for direct, simple coaching.