You said when you get her horny, they'll do just about anything you say. There is no reason to offer her dinner if you've made her horny unless you are hungrier than you are horny. Why would she do this if she's horny and will do just about anything?No, you've stopped seducing her and offered to take her to dinner. You have actually given her an out when she was already in.No, you've offered her more options than you needed to when you didn't need to make more options.You just said that Neo and I were being unrealistic...now there's no right or wrong way.This makes no sense. You wanting to spend time with her doesn't equal her doing things for you. An equal exchange would both of you enjoying spending time together.

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Just chiming in here.

Cristos I just read your first post. If I were you I'd go back and re-read that again just too see how you sound.

To me it comes across as a guy who has been whining about girls all of his life and now is finally trying to grow some balls by... telling girls to suck his dick after a date as a repayment.

I have nothing wrong with telling girls too suck my dick. I've actually found it to be quite an effective technique when pulled off properly. I say things like that all the time half jokingly with girls and a lot of the time it creates a bit more of a sexual frame between the two of us.

But nothing as you describe. All of your comments in this thread have been mixed up and contradicting. I find it hard to actually get your point but it seems to be more along the lines of "If I buy something for a girl she should suck my dick in return and if she doesn't then I give her an ultimatum"... But... You've already bought her something and after that, unless she's signed some sort of legal contact she really isn't under any obligation to go through with your demands to suck your dick. In terms of the ultimatum, what are go going to do, kick her out of your car or something? She's already got what she wants and I'm sure she'd be happy too leave

You are not entitled to have your dick sucked if you buy a girl dinner. There is an exception to this where you sort out the sex as some sort of business deal upfront. They are called hookers. Doesn't sound like you're dating those. And the real players that do, don't pay for shit with them.

It doesn't matter what the date is. Whether you're just inviting a girl around your place for a movie or you're going on a night out for some drinks together. If the girl has a good time with you and she is attracted to you then she will suck your dick at the end of it whether you ask for it verbally or not. Now if she likes dirty talk then that's another story

You shouldn't be trying too sell books yet mate.

I'm confused more than anything else.

Nobody is answer my question. Why are you taking her out on a date in the first place? Would you just take any random girl? Did she do something nice for you? Do you just take random women out to dinner for no reason? If you do, that's fine, I have nothing against that.

If you're okay with the possibility of that woman telling you she will never have sex with you, bringing your food that you paid for home to her ex-boyfriend who buys her nothing, and fucking him immediately after she leaves dinner with you, and you were just taking her out with no expectations, and spending money on her to be nice, that's fine.

I just can't see any guy doing something like that spending his hard-earned money on a woman with no-strings attached while she (possibly) fucks another guy just because he wants to be "nice".

It doesn't compute.

If she said, "let's have sex right now", would you say, "no I'd rather go to dinner first, that was my whole intention to pay for your dinner, then you you can go have sex with your ex-boyfriend, or whatever you were planning to do. I don't care because I wasn't looking for anything in return"?

Fill in the blank...

I'm taking this woman out to dinner because ________.

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I'll simplify this, you want to take her out to dinner, spend your hard-earned money on her, and not set up the expectation of anything in return, that's fine. If that works for you, and you're happy doing that, I'm not out to judge you.

I just don't understand why a man would burn through his money, take a woman out to dinner, and not expect that she return the favor in some way, because there's many women out there who will just use guys and won't even give a shit.

But, again, if a guy is fine with the arrangement of just giving a woman things without wanting anything in return, it's not my place to judge.

I'm just expressing how I feel about the whole situation, and my confusion that I couldn't understand why a guy would just give away money and dinners with the possibility that a woman is just to use him and give him nothing in return.

I'm not saying that will happen, but I don't understand why a guy would set himself up in that position.

If you said as an equal exchange we discussed beforehand that we would both pay for dinner,I would have no complaints about that, because I know she genuinely wants things to be equal, but why would you take her out just to be nice, with no expectations, and just let her expect you to pay?

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You're confused because you have a belief that you should say you expect "something nice" because you're taking a girl to dinner. A guy that's good with women knows that he doesn't have to say anything about expectations and still get what they both want.

Here's what I think. If you offer to take a girl out, you take her out to do something you can afford to do without the expectation of her paying or owing you anything for doing so. If a girl offers to take you out, she should be thinking the same way. If you're stupid enough to ask a girl out without making sure she's attracted to you, you'll probably end up burning through your hard earned money and getting absolutely nothing out of it.

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I can't speak for anyone but the way I see it.. I'm not doing anything in return for something. If I'm spending my money in return for sex I'd just get a prostitute. If I'm taking a girl to dinner it's to have a good time. Sex can come after or before or never... If my reason for dinner is to have her sleep with me I'd just save my money.

I think you like many guys can't just enjoy a moment without getting something from it. Say I'm in jack zeros town.. I hit him up to hang out.. I get a round of drinks... Tbh man I'm not even thinking as you are about the money. I'm not thinking on whether jack gives me something in return. I'm not thinking about him controlling me or whether he likes me afterwards. I'm not buying him a drink to gain his friendship. I'm just hanging out. If he decides to pay for mine fine. If we split fine. I may just get it because it doesn't matter like that. He could take my drink and come back on the forum and talk shit about me. I'm not gonna think wow I wasted my money on this guy.. Ironically, if I were paying for his shit to ensure he wasn't manipulating me.. I'm manipulating him.

I don't go throwing a date for any chick. If I'm inviting a chick out I've gotten a good idea of what kind of chick she is. I have no hesitation to grab a bill because I already can confidently say she thinks along those lines and is not interested in free meals. And if she were to fuck her ex that night with my food in her stomach.. Well she was not interested in me. I don't feel any hit to my ego if she wasn't interested nor do I even think about the money I spent. If I did I'd just split the bill or won't do dinner. And if I thought a chick was only seeing me for a free meal... I'd have to question the type of chick I was dating and neeting.

There are instances, many times, where a woman is GENUINELY interested in multiple guys at the same time, and is trying to figure out who she likes "best".

I knew one girl who was crazy. She used to work with us, and was hitting on my friend. I later found out from her sister, who I am good friends with, seeing her messages, that she was also trying to get back together with her kids' father who used to beat her and broke her nose, at the same time as hanging on my friend at work, while also messaging this guy she used to be roomates with telling her "I don't think I'll ever find a guy like you", and she was ACTUALLY into all of them, while telling none of them about each other.

Women can play these games, and would you be okay thinking you're her only guy, when you're really just a drop in a puddle? You need to be prepared for this shit.

If people are okay with that, I'm not judging, but this girl these guys all thought was "wholesome" was actually basically a hooker running around with all different guys, which, in this case, it's not a matter of being stupid, it's a matter of being manipulated and misled by a woman who was still genuinely interested in the guy, and a very competent liar, and there are a LOT of them.

This is based on the premise you and the woman have a straightforward relationship, where if she appears attracted it's as simple as that, you do the dance, and she isn't lying, playing games, or hiding anything.

In regards to a woman you've done this with personally, has she done anything for YOU, even so much as bought you a coffee, considered your feelings in any meaningful way to be deserving of having something nice done for her, or do you just take her out for a dinner?

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I'm just confused about the whole idea of taking a woman out to dinner just to "be nice", like why a guy would do it.

I can't see a guy buying a girl food, paying for it to be nice, her bringing it home to some other guy, fucking him, and the guy being okay with it (hypothetically), just because he did everything for no other reason than to "be nice".
We should just leave the whole question at that. He just answered it lol.

I have a close woman friend, who has been with a guy like 10 years, and she has always looked out for me, never hesitated to do something nice for me, and I trust her with my life, but that's an exception to someone I've known a LONG time. I have one other friend I've known 7 years who is a woman that I look at like this.

But I've just seen how manipulative and viscous many women can be, and I operate on the belief you can never be too careful, so I won't let them have an inch, and I respect her right to do the same, because she's probably had a lot of bad experiences too.

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Welcome to the real world. I always assume that there is another guy in the picture when I first meet a girl. If I find her attractive, there is absolutely some other guy that does too. The thing is, when I'm with a woman I'm the only one that matters at that point. Learn how to get women to be in the moment with YOU without thinking about another guy in the picture. I've had sex with girls who would tell me that they were in relationships afterwards but still keep coming around. I've found out about other guys that women were dating and none of that matters when she's in the moment.

If you think making a food for sex arrangement makes sure that other guys aren't in the picture, you're naive.I've had a woman fly me to Thailand, put me up in her Villa for two months. I have another girl that put me on as her +1 for a trip to Aruba next month. I have meals cooked for me, I get gifts, my FB is always cleaning my house. The thing is I don't expect someone to give me something to show appreciation. People show appreciation in different ways.

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I have no idea where you keep getting this "to be nice" thing from. No one on this thread has even made the claim that you should be nice to women. No one is going around proclaiming "Pay for dinners, you need to me nice" or "its the nice thing to do." I dont even think I've seen or written the word nice in this thread except for your posts.
This says alot. You really find it so impossible that you could take a woman to dinner and without telling her, she would get the bill next time, or do something special for you? You ask this question like its a special feat or some great thing, but its just normal. Yes, there are women who would take your food and just hve you keep paying for shit. But I cant say thats the norm. In all my years of dating, I've never once had a woman not do things for me unasked. Ive never once had a woman act like it was my role to just pay for her food so she could fuck her ex. And thats been true for the older women, younger women, students, professionals, different races of women. I may get drinks the first night, the girl gets dinner the second. Or I wake up to breakfast in bed. And that's no big feat..I'd say most women arent that selfish, unless you're finding women at brothels. If the majority of the women you meet are trying to leech off you, I gotta ask where you're meeting these women?

Yes, women can be interested in different dudes. And they can sleep with different dudes if they're single. The money you spend on dinner, doesnt entitle you to her pussy, nor does it lock her pussy down from other dicks. And ultimatums like this, cant realistically be protecting you. A woman can just agree to dinner for sex and leave after the date. If you fuck a woman for a dinner, and she leaves your place to fuck a guy who didnt buy her dinner, by your rules, she's still gotten over on you. If you fuck for a dinner and as an exchange, if she leaves or cheats, does the fact that you fucked her give you some solace?

You're operating from pain and fear and trying to control things that cant and shouldnt be controlled. You're trying to make sex an exchange for dinner. Which is going to make you retain the women who fuck for money/dinner. You're trying to control that she has sex with you. You're trying to control that you arent played. Thats just life man. A chick can always play you, lie to you, cheat on you. But if the way you protect yourself is to use a line that would ensure you get a gold-digger, thats a bad move. If you're example of a "hooker" is a chick trying to fuck 3 different guys...thats not a hooker. She's misleading them, sure. But as you said she was into all of them. Thats not manipulative, its dishonest...and a far stretch from a hooker. Closer to a hooker is a chick who agrees to dinner for sexual favors.

You really need to assess where and what kind of woman you're attracting/meeting. Because when you act like a woman doing something for you is some extraordinary thing, I cant agree with that. There are some fucked up people in the world, but in most of my experiences, people (men and women) are largely giving or at least appreciative. I've bought strangers drinks at the bar, I've had drinks bought for me by strangers. Ive paid for first dates, and have had first dates payed for. I've gotten gifts and given them. All without uttering a word about repayment or making it a big deal. Most of my experiences with men and women, have been positive.

We have to emphasize here that women are human beings just like you and me. They are not simply vaginal life support systems. This I-pay-for-dinner-you-give-me-a-blowjob-and-your-pussy paradigm gives off a vibe that kills off any attraction from a woman; unless she's a hooker who'll negotiate for an extra $100 that will go with your dinner.

Dudes, date women who have more to offer you other than their beauty and/or pussy; like them as persons-- as human beings. Do you find her smart? Well, fucking tell her this instead of telling her she's beautiful; dozens of guys are already telling her she's beautiful. Is she ambitious and hardworking? Let her know you appreciate this drive which you find rarely in women. Does she have a good sense of humor? Well, let her know you're having so much fun because of her personality.

Once she feels that she's earned your attention and attraction, isolating her becomes easier. The pussy isn't the goal. The quality woman is. If you have money, you can get pussy anywhere. But what makes this woman special enough that will make you spend your time and money with her, pound her pussy really good, slap your cock on her face, and jizz your high quality semen inside her mouth?

It isn't enough that a woman is pretty and has a pussy. For me, a woman who deserves my time, money and cock is a special kind of human being; someone who's street smart, hardworking, and has a good sense of humor. Fuck. Qualify the women that you want to isolate beyond "Oh, she's hot," "She's got big boobs," "She has nice ass," or "Her crotch is just so huge and puffy."

Next time, don't just aim for a woman's pussy; aim for the whole package and women will put a gold standard on your cock as long as you fuck them good. The money and time you spend on her becomes moot and academic at this point because she'll happily give you more than what you're giving her.

Ignore this advice if you just want one night stands.

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That moment when your late to the party and Jack & Neo are already owning it up.

I completely agree with their points. OP, you seem to have a strong sense of entitlement based on nothing even remotely realistic.

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