Hey Guys,

I have been trying some material that i've been reading up on at my fraternity, and i've come to a bit of a roadblock when it comes to opening with girls. If I use anything remotely like an opener, they detect it as a line immediately, and defuse you. I went to a girl casually(with a few beers in me), and said "Hey your not starting things off with me too well", she'd ask why and I would say, "Because you've been too shy to come say hello to me and introduce yourself". I thought this was a fairly good opener, but through the grape vine it came back to me that girls knew I was using a line on them.
Was it my opener, or is this just apart of the game?

Second, pretty much everytime I go sarging, its at college parties. The whole "bar" game doesn't seem to really apply as easily, just because some of these girls pickup on guys hitting on them very easily. They want guys to hit on them ofcourse, but they don't want it to be obvious.

Usually is what I do, is walk up to a girl, use an opener like the one above, and start building comfort. I ask her about her major, give her a few negs when I can, maybe ask her what she enjoys doing, etc etc. From there, it just seems like a hit a bump. Theres always dancing, and i'll go dance with her, and she'll be very into it, but than says she has to go back to her friends. If it was my guess, i'd blame that on a lack of Kino escalation, however with some of these girls I do makeout with them*though they are drunk* so i'm not sure what really to do here.

I am still unsure of exactly what "the natural game" is, but would it be better for situations like this, when these girls I hit on I will have to be around for the next 4 years(all of them are basically in the Greek System)

_________________
~Kevin~

That opener telegraphs a lot of interest. Your basically saying you're into to me I know it!

The subject(of conversation) should never be about you being into her or her being into you unless it's a neg.

At parties, have the best time, by that I mean a more enjoyable experience then any other person their, this will DHV. You are the party.

Parties are usually easier, people are almost expected to talk to each other, try this...

Go up to a girl with a beer bottle, have one in your hands that's almost empty, point at her bottle then say "race yah!" then drink. Follow that with "You lose! better luck next time" you've opened, you can either walk off and go talk to people you know, or stack to your next routine, either way, your foots through the door,

i usually walk away and DHV with another group, then ill later rejoin and play another game

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Locked eyes from across the room, make my way as the rhythms boom

One thing I always try to do, is in games of beer pong or flip cup, assuming she's cute, i'll introduce myself, and I pulled this one last week, tell me how it is,

" Hey, whats your name, I don't believe i've met you before"
Her: : My name is blank... whats yours?
"Mines Kevin, its nice to meet you, you ready to play, your going to have to bring your A game"
Her: Alright well we'll see what happens(or something close)
"I heard you aren't very good"
Her: What do you mean, who'd you hear that from?
"Oh not you especially, i've just heard that *her sorority* aren't
very good at this game"
(To a sorority girl, this gets her eager to win)

Or something along those lines, how is that? Did the one I post earlier come off as too strong then?

I probably just haven't totally gotten over my AA, but it'd still feel weird going up to a girl i've never talked to and say that, maybe its just me

_________________
~Kevin~

definitely better, execution/delivery is everything

I would change a couple things.....

Don't say "I don't believe i've met you before"
You don't need to give her reason's to know her name, you're the AMOG.

you could also say,
"prove me wrong" at the end, then she's playing for you and herself.

Think this...
You're a player now, otherwise you wouldn't be here. And what does a Player do, they play games. Why? Because games are fun and no matter how negative the stereotype is PEOPLE ENJOY GAMES(even the losers momentarily).
There's the BIG GAME which is ultimately getting the girl.
Then there's the small games, which come in the form of gambits and routines. Play little games with her like egging her on about her serority, they like it.

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Locked eyes from across the room, make my way as the rhythms boom

I think a big problem with me, is that i'm getting mixed signals from different people on "their personal game". I may want to run for Fraterntiy president eventually, which means I can't just be sleeping around all the time, because I do need to legitimately meet girls, and not ALWAYS hit on them*I know god forbid*.

So are asking questions such as her major, where she's from etc not okay at any point to use? In my perfect world, I would have a suddle opener in which doesn't come off any way as a line, start negging, build comfort through normal conversation while not lowering my DHV, and then Kino escalation, usually if I can get a girl to dance with me, then its only a matter of time.

Alot of times I can go to girls dancing with friends, sometimes I ask, sometimes not, and dance with them, and they get into it most of the time. This is good, and I can get laid this way, HOWEVER, this does not fix my problems wtih AA...or I guess I should call it Approach Excitement, so this is why I am here.

For me, I can get laid, and have frequently, but I know that I am not having to work super hard as they are probably 6s or so, so my goal is to get girls that are in a bit harder demand, the hottest ones at the party.

From what I have seen with my brothers in the fraternity, they can pickup these girls with a normal AFC way in regards of how they do things i.e Walk up and introduce themselves, they ask questions about themselves, and ask for their number etc, and somehow it works... I know its based on looks, as with the greek systems when hookups happen, everyone knows, so its all about status, and status isn't something easy to build.

Ontop of that, I want to have a game to also find a potential girl friend, and my philosophy is that I will not have sex with a girl who I want to potentially date, before we are dating. I think with my own morals etc it will hurt the relationship, but "the game", doesn't seem conducive to really finding a girlfriend. I've read posts from Sean Messengers which somewhat shows this. Any thoughts?

_________________
~Kevin~

Hullo.
First off the first thing you say to a girl you don't know is a opener. And get rid of that mind set that they detect it as a line and they will defuse you. If you deliver your opener with confidence most girls will not defuse you. And if they do its most probably their bitch shield at work. The line you used needs a bit of C&F in it for it to work and a lot of confidence because other wise you can come off as weird.
College parties are not bars. You need to adapt your game to your environment.
Your interviewing them. Which is a no no. You need to always kino and maybe throw in a DHV story or two.
Natural game is when it comes to you naturally as you don't have to think about it as you just do it. A lot of people can not do it and it takes a lot of practice to get to this point.

Grow up.

"Philosophy?"

"Morals?"

Sounds more like a retarded socially programmed view of sex to me... or perhaps a reflection of deeply seeded sexual hangups in the form of the illusion of "morals" to justify your inner demons? Hmm?

I recommend the ebook "College Dating Domination" by Mark Redman.

By the way, which Fraternity are you in? I'm a Sigma Chi.

So you want to approach, coming across as NOT approaching? Do you pay something without actually giving the money same thing.

Let me ask you something: are you embarrassed of being a man?

If men wouldn't approach women and vice versa, humankind would simply become extinct..and since it's VERY socially accepted ( I prefer saying socially PROGRAMMED) for the man to make the first move - it's your NATURE as a man to approach.

So why are you trying to apologize to yourself for being a man? Go to the mirror right now and say - sorry dude, you're a man..and you can't approach women because it's approaching women. It's BS. It's your NATURE to approach, so never ever feel ashamed about it no matter what outcome, whenever. You are doing what you were born to do - frankly, to make sure humankind survives, lol..but you were invented for it remember

99% of the men tell a woman they're sorry for approaching her: oh sorry! I didnt know you had a boyfriend/bad night/blabla...or "I just want to have a drink with you, nothing else." Show some guts, look her straight in the eyes and tell her: "you have a bf? I understand. Now lets go grab ourselves a drink, come on! It'll be fun" or...if you REALLY have some balls on ya: "you have a boyfriend huh? Well congratulations! That must be a major accomplishment for you but where I'm coming from? Ït's quite common." It's ridiculing her objections...but it's to prove my point: NEVER apologize for being a man, go out there and APPROACH...who cares that they know?

It's that they SEE and SENSE that what you're saying is far from friggin' genuine, that you're faking something, that you FEAR they'll "expose" you...for what? For being a man? Now go out there and approach with confidence, fearless, indifferent to the outcome...you were born to do it, so NEVER apologize for it in your own mind!

I even go as far as when she asks if I approached her I said nahh...you know how I usually approach women? Then I walk away, come back and act all stutterish, exaggerate nervousness, Im fidgeting around, talking about how I invented Microsoft - the whole acting scene will make her laugh out loud, and it immediately lets her know that you're NOT a wussy.

That's your sticking point: you fear how you will be perceived if you approach, which is approval seeking onto itself..be indifferent and never apologize - realize you are SUPPOSED to do it.

Dirty D,

That was very inspirational, thank you. I definatly know approaching women is what men are built to do, but I guess because I have to also be in a mode of being very kind and welcoming to girls(because I do need to meet girls on a friend basis for the fraternity), so i'm needing to be able to switch my mindsets.

It's weird, i'm not sure how common this is, but I have no problem talking with women. I don't feel nervous or scared, because it always seems I get lucky and have something to say to keep the conversation flowing etc. Its actually aproaching that gets me a bit on my toes.

Chief, i've gotten more than enough sex, and so this is just something within myself. I don't expect you to understand, which is why I didn't ask you to understand. I'm a Delta Sig

_________________
~Kevin~

Don't forget that openers are only conversation starters. If you can connect with a girl then the only thing you need to say is "hi".

Also, if your at a fraternity event with a sorority, like a mixer or theme party, the guys and girls don't stand on opposite sides of the room, they mingle. Be yourself and just meet the people at the party, there's no need just to focus on HBs.