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I didn't necessarily mean I was giving up on her. I was just thinking out loud when responding to poodogr who told me to just give it up and start off fresh with another girl.
I'll still give it a shot when I see her again and see what I can do
As far as the kissing on the first date trust me; have a first date at a lounge where you're on a couch. That's way better than staring across a boring dinner table at each other.
Have you ever escalated? Make an excuse to play with her hands; use a routine; there're so many.
A girl who'll kiss you on the first date isn't a slut for that; now sleeping with you, that's debatable, but a lot of guys I know are with "keeper" girls they had sex with on night 1. In the very least, get to the comfort level where you can lean in and give her a kiss on the lips at the goodbye part of the date.
Being afraid of this is more of a high school/Bible Belt/1940's mentality. Don't sweat it dude; we were taught it from are parents, especially mothers because they simply thought it was how to teach us how to be nice guys and gentlemen. Then they're regretting it when they have a 30 year old son who can't give them grand kids! Lol
I was there; and the guys who always got the drop on me and won the girls from me, even the ones I was dating, were the ones who jettisoned this mentality as early on as possible.
So what you're going to find, especially if she's reasonably attractive; if you haven't made an effort to be physical, she's going to get bored with you and the next guy you see her with will be a guy who was already friends with her, probably isn't much better looking than you, but they're walking holding hands! And he's kissing her.
I've been there and it took me years after college to realize this. The longest I ever got without being physical was about 3 weeks, and then she traded up.
As for the "not giving up on her", it took me years before I saw the light, in one case with the same girl! Girlfriends of hers would tell me "I just don't want you to waste your time." And I'd respond "I find your lack of faith disturbing."
Only a very slim segment of girls will be alienated that you kissed them/tried to on a first date, and you don't want those anyway! They're the prudes and shy girls with such a shell/wall to get past it won't even be worth it; and you probably won't be the guy who does it anyway.
Your batting average is so much better when you get physical on the first date. Like I said; a real man's problems / good problems to have.
As for the girls in bars; there will be those, but you have to just keep going out and being social. If you're with at least one other person at a bar, you're socially acceptable. Some guys can pull off rolling to a bar solo, but it's just not for some guys; more advances game in my opinion.
For instance, I was off my game last weekend/ had an off night, and my friend was scooping up the numbers! He was being dragged into bachelorette parties to do stuff with/touch the bride!
About the girls being with their friends and you won't be accepted, I'm gonna bet you've never even approached a girl with her friends to know. The example you gave of talking to that one girl was a sample of one. What do they tell you in stats about a sample of one? What you're seeing is a facade, mostly created in your own head.
You need tons of reference experience and experience to back up that's it's okay to talk to girls when you're out anywhere, even if they're with their friends.
What worked for me, to prove that I was right/okay in taking to girls when at bars, was to mock that mindset.
I'd think to myself. "How dare I try to talk to a girl! I'm at a social place, in a social setting, where girls come out to be social and have a good time. How dare I?!" If these girls all wanted to be cliquey and not meet you, they'd have stayed at home with "drinks with he girls".
But hey, what do I know...
CHAT
