i know im only young, but i would have never let her think that 'IM' taking her out. like that dude said up there you shold have gone a coffie shop or summit, its far more casual and you would'nt give the impression of a so called date. with her every date shes been on has probily ended in a man paying, be diffrent but in a nice way. what makes you diffeent from every other man ever who has took her out. this is where you add value.

when im out i never buy girls a drink or pay for their meal unless i do actuly know them as good mates. its not that im cheap, its more on the lines of why should i pay for their company. by gettin a girl a drink payin for them, it gives me the impression that im paying for them to be with me. and il say that, as long as your nice about it and put a neg in there you'll be fine. i dont think picking up the check for the meals your problem, i think its what you've come accross as a person before you've gone out. never forget that your the prize, she should be happy to be in your life.

Listen guys, this is nothing more than a simple communication issue..

And the idea is to have as little miscommunication as possible..

Never ask a girl out to a place of your choosing and either not be willing to pay, or have some agreement with her beforehand about who's going to pay, or if she's going to pay, or it's to each his own.

Having misunderstandings with a girl about who's going to pay a few bucks for an inexpensive meal, etc.. is counterproductive and can lead to hard feelings. Feelings on her part that can have ramifications that night, and for many nights to come. And potentially with every girl she knows.

I mean it sends the wrong message. That either she should pay for your company, or that you're too cheap to pay for what you asked her to go do. Now if a chick asks you out, by all means expect her to pay. But bring a few bucks just in case you don't like washing dishes.

Fair is fair. And you can't completely discount social and cultural norms, just because you think it's in your interest to do so. If you do, it's a sign of DLV.

A similar analogy would be walking into a retail store, picking up some merchandise and attempting to walk out without paying. Then telling the cops or security you're an alpha male that's worth it so they shouldn't harass you.

This borders on the mindless. And is not what we're talking about when we say, don't try to buy a girls affection with your wallet. Unless you're in a whorehouse or something.

Again there's a fine line between being an alpha male, and just being a jerk. By being a jerk you might push certain women into doing what you want in the short term (especially those with some underlying psychological issue). But you wont impress quality women. You know, those women who now or in the future will be able to easily pay for you both and will be more than happy to do so.

I know.. I live with one daily, and don't pay for a thing.... anymore.

_________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

LMAO. I love that. Partially because that's such a good analogy, but also because it illustrates something else that a lot of guys are getting wrong. It's like Rye Lee said on a post . . . there's being a nice guy, and then there's being a "nice guy". One is AFC, the other is actually desirable. Even David D teaches that you need to take the alpha traits of the jerks and incorporate those traits into your personality WHILE KEEPING most of the nice guys traits as well. Meaning, you take the traits that are attractive to women and add them to you.

Most guys have the completely wrong impression of what being "ALPHA" is all about. It DOESN'T mean just shoving your way through a store saying "move out of my way". That's just being a jerk.

LOL, sorry, a bit off topic.

The analogy runs counter-point to the original question.

Paying for her meal is an IOI to her. It is a very strong one. Not paying for the meal is a DLV to you. It is also a very strong one.

The best option is not to get into this situation by asking someone out, e.g., Will you go out with me.

You do not want her to think that you are paying for her attention. That is directly AFC.

Instead, invite them to join you. It sets the expectations right up front. e.g., I am going to be here, you are welcome to join.
You can ask them to join you even if you are only going is because they are going to be there as well.....


Ask them to join you. If they decline for the time you specified (Always have a day), then find out their schedule. Create another event in which they do have time. You should have a prepared list of places to go (learn your community) before hand. (Special events are great. They have a built in time frame which puts an urgency for you two to meet)


The concept of being 'Alpha' has no correlation to the above. Being alpha mean that you are secure in yourself. You believe in yourself and all of your actions. Because of the belief, you control yourself and are comfortable in any environment..

_________________
Recommended reading list.

Double Your Dating by DD
(This will work on your inner game)

http://www.freewebs.com/xfman/
(This will work on your outer game)

Ok I'll buy into that..

If paying for her meal is an IOI, then so is the act of asking her out itself.

I've never had a problem with either action. And I've never had a problem getting laid either.

So what's the point again?

_________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

For the cheap seats...

Asking her out is an IOI. You want to use the lowest calibrated IOI you can and that is why you ask her to join you instead of asking her out....

_________________
Recommended reading list.

Double Your Dating by DD
(This will work on your inner game)

http://www.freewebs.com/xfman/
(This will work on your outer game)

"Asking" to begin with is usually trouble. Not with all girls, but with alot. Inviting them to tag along with you wherever you may be going already or doing already sends the message of your doing it with or w/o her and having fun with or w/o her, so why shouldn't she tag along and have fun with you? You're a fun person. An interesting person. So why shouldn't she want to hang out with you?

It's okay to pay for dinner and drinks, if you don't she will think you are cheap. If your broke take her to get a hot dog and for a walk in the park or pear.

Money is meant to be spent, she will not think your a nice guy if your intentions are there from the start, make sure you Kino her all the way through the date. (nice guys are too scared to kino on the first date).

Paying for dinner shows her a DHV cause she will see that you have the funds to take of her needs.

Now on future dates before going out let her know that you would love to take her out to dinner and hang out but that you had to pay a expensive bill or lend your sister or brother money so you can't, she will get the point across and I bet that she will take you out and pay for everything, cause she likes you by then, good luck.

_________________
TheMoneyMan1

-RISK- "Only those who will risk going far can find out how far one can go"

What I do the times I pay for a girl:

The check comes. I pull out my wallet and credit card while I am still
talking to the girl and maintaining eye contact. Put the card out on the
check. Continue talking normally.

I don't even bring it up. Most times I don't even look at the check unless
I lost track of what we ordered. It's just this understood, non-verbal thing.

The instant you make a big deal of it = the instant you DLV yourself, IMHO


If you took the right preventative measures when you invited her to
"tag along", she probably won't make it a big deal if she pays.

If she tries to get you to pay then... then you can bust her balls.

One thing that works is:

-Have a casual "drinks" meet-up. (coffee, beer, cocktail)
-Show up late (or after her)
-If she get's there first, maybe she will have already ordered
her own drink(to me = a sign of independence in a woman).

This almost always works when you do it for coffee "meets".

You need to spend more time reading the posts on the site and less time offering advice.

_________________
Recommended reading list.

Double Your Dating by DD
(This will work on your inner game)

http://www.freewebs.com/xfman/
(This will work on your outer game)

Second.

_________________
"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

Wait a second.. There's more than one way to skin a cat.

The MoneyMan1 makes a decent point. Men have been buying the panties off of women for thousands of years, and I would suspect that to continue..

If you've got the wad, then by all means spend it if it makes you happy and gets you what you want.

I know.... I really dig it when chicks spend money on me. Happens everyday..

_________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

It's only OK if you asked to take her to dinner/drinks. And only if you didn't use the "join me for..." line others mentioned. Trust me bro, whenever I've paid in the past I never even got a good night kiss from the HB5-6's, just too fucking AFC.
Agree on the kino, disagree on everything else. Paying is supplication, which is DLV. Again, this is from experience. The point is, YOU'RE THE MAN, she should be so lucky to join your harem. I know, I'm working on this too---I just need better stamina on my alpha-image projection so to speak.
W-T-F?!?! So now you're saying you're so broke that lending some money to your sister means you can't take her on a $40 date. 1) She'll detect bullshit, huge DLV to you. 2) She'll detect cheapskate, DLV as you mentioned in the previous paragraph. 3) She might think you're making excuses to call off the next "date", and given the AFC context in which it is given, will probably call it off herself.

Now look, I've been there, done that. Women just don't respond to what you're suggesting, in fact it drives them away like bad BO---unless they already absolutely love you, in which case fuck the game and go with your instincts. Back in highschool I did just about everything wrong with a girl and she still liked me for some inexplicable reason. But that's rare, and we/I want to be good with the vast majority of women we encounter.

So read up bro!

_________________
afc-challenge-to-the-masters-social-anx ... 10108.html

The point is to be a PUA though, not some guy with enough money to buy what he wants.

Also, the part about lying that you lent your sister money, or had an expensive bill, seriously? C'mon? Why are we lowering ourselves to this level? Next I'm going to tell her that she should come with me to my 5 million dollar mansion in the carribian, or come heli-boarding with me in the Alps, but for tonight, we should go to her place instead, because my penthouse suite is being fumigated for cockroaches. Also, don't forget to let her know that you have to take a cab, or transit, because the Ferrari is in the shop getting a better engine put in. Point made?

_________________
"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

Hey a $5 million dollar mansion and a Ferrari never hurts.. Neither does a rich daddy..

I say if you've got it, more power to you. But maybe your daddy should have to pay his employees instead.

What's great about all this?

Even us poor boys now have a chance, using simple psychology instead of our wallets...

My feeling is Rye, that you and Valence wouldn't have a single problem if you found a woman willing to pay for everything..

_________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM