Alpha's are supposed to be dominant and lead where things go, but that doesn't mean that someone that isn't an Alpha archetype is incapable of directing things when neccessary.

Imagine for instance a man that is a Beta archetype. Now people tend to immediately thing beta embodies nothing but poor qualities and weakness of character, which is untrue, it is merely a different configuration of personality traits. He may walk into a place and not know anyone and instead of just walking up to any set he sees and opening, perhaps he goes to the smoke pit and walks into a group to ask for a smoke or a light. Now he's opened a set, but he didn't have to be dominant and hook the attention of the entire set to gain acceptance, because he has at least one person that he's interacting with to get a light/smoke from.

From there he can build some rapport if it's a guy, in order to pawn off into the rest of the set while remaining more of an outsider status, rather than becoming the center of their world. If it's a girl, he can go straight into building attraction and comfort, while remaining just a friendly guy and not dominating her frame, but just being interesting, funny and still flipping attraction switches, even though she's probably leading the conversation. Beta's are generally reluctant to create the paths, but if a girl opens one up through conversation, then he's able to switch topics and take a part in guiding the conversation, although not leading it.

Beta males are often very touchy feely people, but due to social programming they don't touch people unless they feel comfortable with them. If you are able to override the social programming however and understand that touching is perfectly alright, then a Beta personality has no problem with kino and that is really the key to attraction and opening things up to become sexual.

A Beta may not run direct game and be as forward with many approaches as an Alpha would, but when he has built attraction and comfort and there is rapport there, there's no reason why he isn't completely capable of asking for a girl's number, or kissing her, or taking her back to his place. Just because a Beta isn't as dominant as an Alpha, doesn't mean that in isolation with a girl, he won't be able to take an active role when the opportunity arises, just like an Alpha would regardless of the situation. In situations where there is no Alpha male around, Betas become much more functional and are able to do things that they generally wouldn't right next to an Alpha, so as long as he moves into isolation, then things continue to proceed fine.

The world is not made up of Alpha males. We are NOT all Alpha males waiting to be unleased, as some gurus and PUAs claim. There are many different human psychological archetypes and every one has it's own positives and negatives that have an impact on being a PUA, but I believe all archetypes CAN be PUAs, with a bit of custom tailoring and a creative approach. If your goal is to become an Alpha, then it IS possible, although it can be incredibly difficult to truly change yourself on those levels and often you end up with people that are fake Alphas, merely wearing a mask and pretending to be what they aren't. I'd prefer people to see the positives in who they are and use those aspects to their advantage, instead of trying to be something they aren't and most likely ending up unhappy, merely because of propaganda that says you must be an Alpha male in order to succeed as a PUA.

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"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

Now I have another newbie question to add to this thread because this is something that I still have not been able to grasp.

What does "dominant frame" mean?

That makes sense, but I guess that's just hard for me to grasp since I've always been kind of a leader, even when I was a little kid playing with other kids.

MY number one factor to success is leading frame, but perhaps the real universal number one factor to success is highlighting the positive characteristics that define you.
Whenever there's an interaction between or amongst people, one person's going to have the dominant frame. He's the one leading and influencing the other people's perspectives the most. The other people will be more reactive to him, and he will be less reactive to the others.

That is one of the best pieces of information that I have read on this subject in all the years I have been aware of it.

Becoming a little more Alpha is in my eyes not a bad thing, but I am simply not Alpha by default. I think that I need to manipulate situations and work in a slightly more under the radar kind of way.

I have the stylelife book and that is good in all, but basically trains you to become Alpha. Mystery is the same with the Mystery Method, and the latter owners of Mystery Method who printed Magic Bullets also develop an alpha frame.

The challenge now is finding an approach that works for the Beta PUA.

Any ideas??

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Keep it kicking!!

Osprey

Hey, I'm new...so what I say may or well hell probably won't make any sense. But if your looking to try to become the Alpha, do it at work. I know this is gonna sound crazy but before I ended up in my sub level thoughts about myself and began to search for the new me, which I'm currently doing. Thanx in part to this forum and a few people. Ok back on track, you work at a GYM, you ARE the alpha male already. Just because you see all these meat heads walking around doing the grunt and grind, there only trying to out do the guy next to him, if you ever watch what they do they look around to see who's watching them. See what ladies are looking at them or looking around. Problem is, when you pay attention you give them what they are looking for. But here's the trick, Since you work there you control everything, who stays, who goes and what goes on. Even tho they are muscle bound what nots, you control the world they live in. If there's someone there you target, ask her what she's there for cardio, weight, blah blah blah. You can go up to random women, talk to them as if your only there to show them how to exercise, show them how to do every thing they want correctly. I believe you can get your Open, Neg, pos, keno, attract, and comfert from showing a girl one exercise...
Like I said im freaking new, I used to try this when i worked at my old gym, my boss was great at it...

Flame me, where im wrong....because I to am learning..

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" Just trying to be as good as jSmooth, right now I'm like chunky peanut butter ya digg..."

Again, good points!!

Thanks

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Keep it kicking!!

Osprey

no problem..again any one else wanna point out anything I may have said or would have done wrong....I wanna learn..

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" Just trying to be as good as jSmooth, right now I'm like chunky peanut butter ya digg..."

Oh people are gonna hate me now...

Ross Jefferies and David DeAngelo have some good stuff about inner game that helped me. Try that. These guys are not well thought of in the field since the Game came out but for inner game, they are just fine.

What do you mean? David D is one of the most respected names in the community, and was not portrayed in a negative light in Style's book.

Maybe it was just me but didnt Style more or less say something bad about all other PUA gurus? He even wrote bad stuff about Mystery, the psychological problems etc etc.

Ross Jefferies, Papa and TD was the bad gus definately... But I thought he wrote bad stuff about all of them. I got the feeling that he thought they were pathetic for combatting over the students. David DeAngelo is mentined as a marketer trying to milk the PUA community for money but yes you are right he is not really portrayed as one of the bad guys. I stand corrected.

He was trying to emphasize the fact that these "gurus" were just human beings with vices like you and me, not perfect gods. Imperfections by themselves does not make a person bad.

You want to have alpha male qualities, but not necessarily be an alpha male. Stand up for yourself at all times, but know when to back down. Glorify your achievements, acknowledge your mistakes. As a smart young woman said to me recently, "you want to be comfortable in your own skin".

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afc-challenge-to-the-masters-social-anx ... 10108.html

It is important to remember that there are many human psychological archetypes and not just Alphas and Betas, they are merely the most commonly discussed and tend to stand out the most from the crowd I guess. I don't know all the varioud psychological profiles there are out there, so I'm not gonna guess, it could be 4 or it could be 1054, but I'm betting there's more than a handful.

Just because you aren't an Alpha, doesn't neccessarily mean you're a Beta, hence my suggestion to think outside the box and discover who you are and how to make it work best for you. Now you may come across someone that has a large number of traits in common with you, so you can model yourself after them, but if not, I'd suggest learning as much from as many sources as possible and use what you can. This is just like learning PUA skills, you will take a bit from one guru and a bit from another and make a bit up for yourself.

I'd say that regardless of what personality you are though, one of the most imporant traits to possess, is confidence.

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"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye