Hi,

little introduction. Im charlie, 19, living in cambridge and go out every weekend gaming with my friend, we are both relatively new, it has changed alot of things about me, the way i conduct myself, hold myself, everything, i feel like im getting body language right and things.

Me and my friend always challenge each other to see who can do most openers and number closes. The both of us are very good at openers, the first one i do i normally get AA, but after that im just fine, i can go into a club/bar and open up 8-10 sets with sheer ease. My problem is what next???

I have 3 or 4 Really good openers, they get the girls to interact with me, and a fair few times i get IOI's from them. the problem is i dont know what to do next, sometimes i try neg's, others i try DHV's and story's. my problem is where to go from a Neg, and DHV stories dont feel at all natural....

is this a common thing, do i need to DHV or story, even though it feels false and almost forced, and see what they do? is there any way to escalate?

any ideas would be very much welcomed!

Hi, why dont you try telling them how good a person your wing is. if you are rolling with a cool guy then that means you must be a relly cool guy as well. try playing a game with them like drawing a word on the poalm of the hand and say what did i write or tell her to tell you 4 good qulities about herself. this is what i was taught and it is working well for me. i hope you can use it as well.

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So there we have it!

so your saying as soon as the opener is done and they are finished go straight into a game or something that gets them to interact, like neil strauss's 5 questions? something like that?

what would you then follow it up with, DHV or NEG?

thanks

I think in my opinion you seem to have read a lot of theory and want to try out everything. In my opinion start slow, free flow the stories and generate interest from the HBs by doing DHVs. Over time, your stories and your DHVs will become smoother as you had tell it over and over again , you would know when is the punchline and hooks etc etc. Your stories wouldn't feel at all unnatural anymore.

Once you maybe get better at telling stories maybe then you might want to include negs in your arsenal and improve your game and slowly overtime include more and more techniques. Results aren't important dont rush things through.

I believe being a pua is like learning a craft, take it slow and you can get basics right.

So does this mean i should make up a DHV story before i go out and set to tell it, the DHV story's im telling are off the top of my head, not really thought about....

if the story's are made up and thought about before hand, what kinda content should there be?

IMO if you aren't a good liar try not make up stories if you can, sometimes the specifics would give you away, what happens if the HB got real interested and ask you questions? You would have to lie more, body language can easily tell you away.

You can plan your script and routines before hand but if you think you make a good speaker, you can think of things on the spot! Try what works best for ya man.

You can always work on the weaknesses and flesh out those DHVs - just remember women have a very keen BS detector so unless you are completely congruent and comfortable with what you are saying (which you're not at the minute, given you feel it is forced) it'll be a harder sell.

What are you like as a person? You guys are good at opening, that is your forte - i would assume you've got a little bit of C&F going on, some balls to approach them.

Perhaps you could dispense with the learning of routines of indirect game and just use your natural C&F and work some direct game?

I too am fairly new to all this, but there is NOTHING that beats the pre-approach work such as:

1. Rolling in with your wing like you are having the greatest fucking time in the world. Not clowning, just smiling, and generally giving off an aura 'shit, those guys know how to have a good time'. Say hi to the bouncers, ask them about their day.

2.Where are you going? Bars with dancefloors? if so, stop, look around - shit theres a load of HBs dancing! And whats that? loads of guys huddled around the dance floor looking on 'playing it cool' - get a drink if the bar is fairly free (say Hi to the barstaff), then HIT that dancefloor!
Dont be pawing all other the girls, dont even look at em for the first five minutes, just bust some moves. Pretty soon, IOIs will be flying your way - you've just had the balls to hit the floor, not stand around like a pussy, but not be a horndog freak either.

3. You may find now that you've opened the flood gates and other guys start piling in - too late for them, you've established the ballsiest winning position, you led the charge - DHV. Start with the playful looks and flirting on some girls.

4. WHen the other guys inevitably start to paw the girls, the girls will gravitate in your direction, you've DLV'd everyone else there. Maybe have a dance with some; some will have positioned themselves in such a way that this is doable. Have a dance, dont grab their arse straight away.

5. Other girls see you dancing with other girls and having some self control, this will kick in their jealousy switches. Social Proof and further DHV.

6. Inevitably, you may start getting some male attention (could be pissy AFCs, could be AMOGS trying to resnatch the frame), more likely you may get some high fives being slapped, hands being shook. DHV, more social proof.

7. You now hold all the aces in this venue. You've DHV'd. You've got Social Proof. You'll be feeling confident and good - start hitting them openers and you wont have to worry about inventing any DHV stories - you're already there.

8. If your feeling paticularly ballsy - try an Apocalypse Opener, or some Shock & Awe - you will find that shit around the forums here!

All of this assumes dancing skills - trust me, I'm no Jacko, it'll help if you got some rhythm and a few moves - women will unconsciously associate that shit with sex ahahhaha

S'pose the crux of my admittedly long winded post is this: Gain social proof and approaching, escalating and closing becomes a damn sight easier.

I'm sure some of the guys on here who would totally kick my ass in the Game sense have some other ideas!

Nice one!