Boyfriend Destroyers
by Harmless, originally posted in the FastSeduction.com Archives

First of all, it's important to notice how she brings up her BF:

If it's early in the sarge and she says, "I have a BF," this does NOT mean that it's time to do BF destroyers. This means that you did NOT attract her and that she could even be LYING to you because she doesn't want to talk to you. So... if you get this too soon, then you need to deal with more fundamental game issues first.

If she waits until later in the sarge and brings it up reluctantly, like, "Oh, I'm kinda seeing someone," then you know you're IN.


THE ULTIMATE BF DESTROYER:

Ignore it. Don't make an issue of it. The first time she brings up her BF, don't say anything more than, "That's cute." Just keep gaming her. You can break this rule later when you learn to calibrate.

If she brings it up again, there are a few techniques I have that work REALLY well to make take her BF out of her mind and put YOU in his place. (Well, at least make her forget about him for long enough to go home with you.)

They're all based on a few basic principles. Basically, you want to create a VOID in her life by letting her see that her BF is not fulfilling her needs. Then you show her that you are precisely her-void-shaped and fucking you would make everything alright.


Remember these principles:

First, if you BASH her boyfriend, she will get DEFENSIVE and support him. You've just anchored good feelings towards her BF and BAD feelings towards you. Bad idea. This even happens if SHE starts bashing her BF and you AGREE with her.

Second, if you try to convince her that you are better than her BF, the same thing will happen.

Third, if you talk about how awesome her BF is and exaggerate it to impossible proportions and talk about how they are destined to be together forever, this will cause her to re-evaluate her BF in YOUR TERMS... and be disappointed.

Fourth, if you talk about how horrible a BF YOU would be, and why she would never want to date you, she will start to relate that to HER experience with HER boyfriend. It's sometimes also effective if you do this ironically, telling her how WONDERFUL you would be and then describing all your horrible traits as if they were ideal.

Fifth, use future adventures projection to have her imagining the two of you together. Use this HEAVILY. I cannot stress this enough.

Sixth, fractionate between a joking, tongue-in-cheek, "I'm just kidding" tone and serious, "Is he kidding?" tone depending on how into you she is and how attached she still is to her BF.

Seventh, use false disqualifiers a LOT. Make excuses for why you can't be with her, especially ones that disqualify yourself. It helps if they are blatantly weak excuses. My favorite is that my other girls take up too much of my time as it is. Use these right after Future Adventures Projection too.

Eighth, just pretend that the words "I have a boyfriend" have NO MEANING at all to you. Continue as if she never said it.

Ninth, she is destined to be yours and you both know it. There is no element of NEEDINESS here.


Combine these principles (and others that I've forgotten, and anything IN10SE would care to add) and you can create your own BF Destroying material on the fly. Here are some routines that I've created while talking to girls:

(This is from a sarge with a SHB who is "kinda seeing" the manager of a trendy downtown club)

Me: "You're a lesbian, aren't you!"
Her: "I'm not a lesbian! But... er... I am kinda seeing someone. He's about this tall, dark hair [starts describing the manager, who I had seen her eating dinner with after the clubs closed the previous night]"
Me: "Well, it's a good thing that I like him."
Her: "Why?"
Me: "Well, because otherwise I'd just steal you from him, take you to a desert island, and spend a week drinking rum, sun-bathing, and skinny-dipping with you. [I could have gone on with the future adventures projection, but I decided not to.] But that will never happen. So, tell me, how long have you been 'kinda seeing' him?"
Her: "Oh, just a few weeks now."
Me: "Wow, you know, just from the way your eyes are all bright and your skin is glowing, I can tell that you are totally in love with this guy. In fact, I predict that a year from now, you will be happily married with 1.5 kids and a white picket fence." [said very tongue in cheek]
Her: "I don't want to get married, and I certainly don't want kids right now! I'm an independent woman!"
Me: "Of course you are. But he's just so perfect for you! I bet he buys you flowers every day you see him. I'm sure that he is always a perfect gentleman and never even LOOKS at another girl while the two of you are together." [note: I had been blatantly gaming girls all night, right in front of her, and getting #s.]

Other stuff to do and a general structure:

She mentions her BF and starts qualifying him somehow ("Oh, he's so X. I love him so much"). You use this when you start a FUTURE ADVENTURES PROJECTION:

"So I suppose that since I like him and I don't want to hurt his feelings and everything, we will have to conduct our moonlit tryst secretly. He must never know of our clandestine meetings."

Then you build up her BF with:

"You know what? It sounds like you guys are totally in love. I can totally tell that he's the PERFECT guy for you and you will ALWAYS be together. In fact, I bet he'll propose to you soon and you'll get married and have kids and live in a nice house with a white picket fence. And you know, I just couldn't live with myself if I ruined the rest of your life with him because he is your PERFECT BOYFRIEND."

Then she starts bashing her own boyfriend ("Well, sometimes he's mean to me. Blah blah blah") and you say,

"Well, if I was your boyfriend, I wouldn't be like that at all. I would call you three times a day JUST to find out where you were and what you were doing and who you were with. I would get mad if you didn't call me EVERY day because I would love you SOOOOO much. I would go out drinking with the guys every weekend so you could have your personal space to do whatever it is that girls do... I don't know, cooking and cleaning and such. Oh, and I would forget all our anniversaries and break up with you on valentines day."

So, the idea is:

She mentions the BF,

You ignore it.

She mentions him again,

You start three threads going:

One is future adventures projections of you and her having sex. But you use imagery that she can fantasize about (If you don't know, go read a romance novel) and disqualify yourself. ("Yeah, but that will never happen.") This raises buying temp.

The second is a thread that describes him as the ideal boyfriend so his faults are amplified. This is a DHV.

The third is a thread that describes you as a horrible boyfriend. You can do it ironically if you want. Basically, it's a DLV and a false-disqualifier.


In fact, these anti-BF techniques work so well that I use them all the time on girls that are single too. I just start talking about past relationships or the ideal guy, etc, etc. Or I start future adventures projections about our illicit meetings, running away from the paparazzi in LA, getting pictures of us kissing in the National Enquirer, etc, etc.

Harmless

Boyfriend Destroyers
Author: Tyler Durden

Background - a few things to remember
1) When BFdestroying you walk a tightrope between evoking too many bad feelings and having them anchoured to you, and getting the chick to want to dump her BF. Don't forget that your end goal is to f-close, not to break her up for some other dude to enjoy.

2) It is preferable that you don't make it appear that you want her to dump her boyfriend. Rather, make the idea appear to be something from within her (more of a Socratic thing, than a direct thing).

3) While BFdestroying, you must direct the convo. to make her prompt you to tell her how you would treat a woman. Make her work it out of you, because she's worked up, and wants to know if she's got a fair deal or not.

4) You must REFRAME all behaviour to appear like insecure nice guy behaviour.

Even behaviour that -WE- as ASFers would use on girls (such as not agreeing to LTR) is to be REFRAMED as being nice guy behaviour, as someone who is too afraid to be decisive and go for what they really want, since they are too afraid that they will lose it once they've been emotionally vulnerable (as will be explained below). All behaviour can be REFRAMED.

5) By making the guy look like a "NICE GUY", you are making him the most sexually unappealing guy conceivable. Once you've done this, there is NOTHING that he can do to get back into her good books, as you've put him into a predicament where anything that he does will be interpreted by his GF as being insecure. So, if he's too distant, and he makes up for it by buying her flowers -> he's insecure. If he's too needy, and he makes up for it by getting a life -> he's insecure. You are trying to DIFFUSE his outer glossy shell, and give the girl a window into his inner workings, so that he no longer appears "mysterious" in any way. You make her understand him so well, that she likes him more as a person, but no longer has any sexual desire for him.

6) Rather than re-explaining EVing, I'll just quote some MrSEX4uNYC archive, to give the basic frame that you're working with WHILE you are using the stuff that I'm mentioning. Without using this at the same time, my shit is USELESS:
"A major point though is that if her relationship to her boyfriend was so good, what is she doing sitting out for coffee with you? This does not need to be stated by you. It is obvious. Your job is to find out what SHE wants from you and how you plan to demonstrate that you can provide it to her through your stories about yourself. Of course you need lots of stories about yourself dealing with women in the same fashion that she likes to be handles herself. This stuff seeps in and makes her think of you as "her type" without you even complimenting her once." (MrSEX4uNYC)

The Tactic
What you're looking to do here is tear the guy down to a NICE GUY, while making it look like you're actually STICKING UP FOR HIM! Your goal is to make him one of those guys that a girl would go out on a date with, like as a person, and feel bad for having to LJBF at the end of the night when he tries to kiss her at the door.

So how do you do that? Almost invariably, LTRs have certain problems (which any of you who've had LTRs are morbidly familiar with):

-jealousy related spats (KEY)

-neediness

-failure to commit or being too distant

-abusive behaviour (be it physical or mental)

-psychological withdrawal, to gain certainty in the relationship (ie: in LTRs each party will withdraw to see if the other will pursue periodically, to assure themselves that the LTR is solid.. this is dimestore psychology, and easily observable in any relationship)

-being irresponsible (not holding up share of chores, etc.)

-not being assertive in bed (KEY)

-being into S&M and other stuff in bed, that the girl thinks is too far out

-getting angry/frustrated when he initiates sex, and girl is not in the mood
(KEY)

-being too predictable, not passionate

OK, there are some basic ones. I will now break these down to show you how I would roughly respond to any of these complaints, in a way that I appear to be sticking up for the BF, but am inadvertantly BFdestroying him. This is not the sum total of the routine, but simply the raw fuel that you are employing, while using standard *** kino/bodylanguage/tonality etc. Remember, that you may not necessarily want to start escalating your sexual state, until she is convinced that her BF is lame-ass, otherwise she may potentially realize that you are trying to pull one over on her. This is not the rule, but simply something to be considered based on your evaluation of the circumstance.

Jealousy:

"You have to understand that this guy really appreciates you, because you're probably the best girl that he ever got, or ever will get. I know that...you care about this guy (maybe sp)... but there's just a certain equilibrium where if you've done this guy a favour by being with him and he's not equipped to handle it, since he knows that he'll never get a girl like you again if he walks out, that he's just constantly frustrated and panicked that you'll leave. It's not his fault."

Neediness:

"You've got to understand that for this guy you are his entire world. He cares about you so much, that everything else in the world is meaningless to him. You are his only source of pleasure, and without you he knows that...he's nothing. You can't blame him, he just doesn't have anything else going for him, so he needs you."

Failure to commit:

"It's not that this guy doesn't love you. He does. Its just that deep down he has a fear that... you're too good for him... and that you'll realize it and be like, you know....you just have to dump this guy.... and then he'll be left emotionally destroyed because he made himself vulnerable. Yes yes I know that you wouldn't do that to him, but its just that with (x,y,z into consideration - bring up imbalance struck earlier in the convo) he knows that you could get other guys (SP)...like me...I just think that he's not an emotionally secure person, and you've gotta cut him some slack."

Abusive behaviour:

"It's not that this guy doesn't love you. Its that he loves you too much, and just can't handle it. He's not emotionally available, and because he knows that you're the best he's ever had, he can't handle all of these things that he's going through emotionally. All his life he probably wasn't very good with women, and women weren't interested in him.. So now that he's got this girl, he doesn't know how to handle it. (plus use the he doesn't want to be emotionally vulnerable, because he's such a loser ass that he can't handle it as per above etc.)

Periodic Psychological Withdrawal:

"(use combinations from material I've written.. Rather than downplaying it for the perfectly normal behaviour that it is, magnify it by making it appear to be a sign of insecurity, that is typically displayed when nice guys who can't get girls get stuck into a relationship with a girl that is too good for them)"

Being Irresponsible:

"Its not that this guy doesn't -want- to do these things. Its just that he's so overwhelmed by all of the things that are going on, that he just can't keep up these responsibilities. Yes yes, I know that x,y,z aren't that much, but he's not in an emotionally healthy place right now, and he just can't handle it (you mirror this against yourself, the image of a REAL/STRONG/COMPETENT man, basically trying to make him seem like a little boy)"

Not being assertive in bed (THIS IS KEY, AND IS VERY OFTEN THE BEST ONE TO USE - VERY COMMON)

"It's not that he doesn't want to excite you. It's just that he's so overwhelmed being with a girl like you, that he's not equipped to handle your sexual needs. It's like the typical case of the rich daughter who marries the labourer. At first the labourer is so exstatic to have this gorgeous girl (point to her) wanting him.. But in the end, he cheats on her with some white trash mullet haired girl, because he knows that that's who he really belongs with, and that's who makes him feel good about himself. You shouldn't hold his lack of assertiveness in bed against him, because its just a reflection of his insecurity. With the right girl, any guy can be a stud in the sack .. its not hard, you just have to take CONTROL (perhaps show some controlling kino here, to get her turned on)." then transition to some HOT sex talk, where you inadvertantly spill how much you need to take control in bed.

Guy into weird stuff in bed (S&M etc) when she hates it:

"It's not that this guy doesn't love you.. Its just that he uses these things to objectify you, because he knows that he's never had a girl like you, and probably never will once you're gone.. so he doesn't want to "make love", because he doesn't want to make himself emotionally vulnerable to you.. but he still wants sex, so he has to turn it into a perverse game, to keep his insecurities from overwhelming him"

Guy gets angry when he initiates sex and she's not interested (ANOTHER KEY ONE TO PECK AT..VERY COMMON)

"The thing is, that this guy loves you, and he's just exasperated that.... he's completely impotent to turn you on.. he just can't turn you on, and he knows that, so he gets frustrated.. Its like when you want to have sex...with me.....its like, I know that its your job to get the girl turned on. Girls need a man who knows that they want, and how to get it. When a girl says 'no', but at the same time she loves this guy (sp), it often means please turn me on more.. please, I want you to be more attentive to me.. (this totally mindfucks the girl, as it is an EXTREMELY COMMON part of the LTR cycle, that once sex becomes stagnant -> foreplay nearly ceases. Because chemically women are addicted to OXITOCINS which are released by touch, and it is more testosterone that they get from sex, most women will hate sex once it degrades to a lack of foreplay. However, most LTRs have this problem, so you must exploit it.. I'm ceasely amazed by how much girls in LTRs PERK RIGHT UP the second that you imply that you're attentive even in LTRs)

Being too predictable, not passionate:

"Its not that this guy doesn't love you. He does. Its just that he's so comfortable with you now.. and feels so close to you, that you're more like a sister to him.. Like a special sister, but someone who he doesn't feel that he has to do all these things for anymore, because your relationship is so secure and so predictable.. there's no need for all that excitement, because he knows that nothing will change.. Some guys deal with true love that way.. I dunno, for me, I think that if you really love someone, you have to do x,y,z (established earlier in convo) to keep it fresh. Like if you are really a real man who loves his woman, you have to do x,y,z to keep it fresh. But really, its not that he doesn't love you, its just that he loves you so much that he doesn't see the need."


***So, remember that you are focusing on destroying the guy's sexual appeal, by making him seem too familiar, and easy to understand. People generally get 'one-itis' for those who are challenging and hard to understand. By making the BF seem both easy to understand, and very insecure/nice/beta in the meantime, the relationship will likely not last the week.

Just remember not to be the LJBF who counsels her on her problems. Instead, you are constantly getting her worked up by doing the EVing that MrSEX4uNYC discusses in his archive. Ideally, she must be getting both turned off the guy by what you're doing, and getting turned on by YOU, and the conversation NATURALLY LEADS TO HOW YOU ARE DIFFERENT, AND -IDEAL- FOR WHAT SHE WANTS. The natural flow of conversation must indirectly lead to exposing your highly desirable qualities.

She is getting turned on by the DIRECT CONTRAST between you and her boyfriend.

You do not offer your qualities directly, but highlight them by pointing out that you understand where her BFs negative qualities are insecure. Getting her to beg you to tell her how you treat women is all the better, and if it is going well can likely be expected. Act reluctant to tell her if necessary, though not to the extent that you are sending an SOI that her getting with you is not a program that you're down with.

Once you have her worked up, use standard *** material to move in, and its a done deal.

Tyler Durden

Great post thanks a lot, I am still reading through it but this has really helped me clarify somethings.

I do wonder, should one or I really use these boyfriend destroyers, I mean if you hate the guy sure, but what if you are happy for the girl and the guy, is it really morally justifiable for you to destroy a relationship?