They had dogs. Small Paris Hilton style dogs. Like the kind you would dress up. And seeing them sitting underneath the tree at the center of campus, I said to myself that i would probably hate them both immediately. But--GODDAMN--one of them was DEVASTATINGLY attractive: legs like a gazelle, flowing, raven-black hair, and a hint of the mysterious in the way she carried herself. And so--like a slave to the PUA voice developing in ther back of my head, I was compelled to spark conversation with them. Don't you hate that a pair of legs can have such power over you?

But here's to open mindedness: I love PUA because it allows me to completely reverse my initial judgments of people. I'm so glad I opened these two.

1. TARGET: HBgaga, the cocky, video game gambling glam rock wannabee--dyed black hair, eye makeup, hip, "don't give a fuck" tattoos, black rubber bracelets that say things like, "Stay Brutal, Babe." I made an effort to tease and dismiss her as another "princess of darkness." She's clever and aloof and damn intriguing. And she's feisty, too, which I really love. Hell, when I asked that this girl, "give me the rock," for a fist pound before I left, she covered my hand with hers, looked me in the eye, and said, "paper beats rock." I was speechless. Let's say: 9.0 on looks + some big personality points.

2. NON-TARGET: Sweetheart, a sweet, good natured friend, low self-esteem, craving attention. Not UN-attractive, but lets just say that compared to Gaga she's shooting herself in the foot by hanging around. Of course, for me, she's a perfect pawn. (I'm surely going to hell for this...)

Honestly, boys, I'm moving out of this city in a month, and let me be straight with you: I want to have sex with this Gaga girl. So help me out here, because this latest interaction has brought up another in a series of problems that have been seriously limiting my options: I have no day 2/phone game.

So here's a quick rundown of the interaction:

Its like a script at this point: Approach. Open with an offhand question about a pet name. Time constraint. C+F busting of responses. ESP tricks to spark some investment on their part. Some impromptu (but of course, well scripted) cold reading, in this case some comments on their friendship ("you two are like two sides of the same coin--a good and evil, ying and yang thing..."). Some big neg work against Gaga ("you'll wait your turn to speak, hun,") A casual DHV story about some street performing I did downtown, and my slave hand work on an organic farm last summer, and my upcoming trip to Spain. Adventure? Travel? Ambition? Check. From there, I felt the tug of the hook point ("You're fun," one quipped) From there, I let the conversation run on their topics: to Nintendo 64 Smash Brothers challenges, the 1990s, Nickelodeon--video games and Pete and Pete? This was a fun group of girls, all things considered. I was glad i didn't write them off as a couple of Hollywood wannabe dog-walkers.

K so i exchanged numbers, fluffed a bit, teased a bit, and went on my way. A couple playful texts from Gaga about our conversation (S:"I'm taking credit for that idea, princess," G:"Hah! We'll see about that,"), and a life-affirming, "everything you say makes me more and more interested in you," from Sweetheart. Overall, good interaction. Sweetheart shoots me a few more texts that day. Tells me to add her on facebook, et cetera.

K here's the concern: Sweetheat obviously likes me. Gaga is responsive (?) but more aloof. I call Gaga last night and leave the following message (I had mixed feelings about it after i left it.): "hey glad i ran into you today--as a writer i have to admit that you fascinate me: something about your mystique and they way you carry yourself. anyway, my brother threw me an interesting question today and it reminded me of you: I'd like to hear your response to it. Call me back if youre still up. If not, I'm sure I'll catch up with you later." No immediate response. Next morning now, 11:00 am, still nothing. Its still early but i Fear the Flake.

They are good friends and live next door to one another in an apartment complex down the street from me. Do I work Sweetheart as a means to Gaga opportunities? Or do I try to get Gaga's attention directly? I hate this non-proximity/phone game stuff b/c I always feel like the power is not mine.

I'd appreciate any input, gentlemen. Thoughts? Especially about phone game. I'm trying for intriguing, non-needy messages with no immediate "set up a date" agenda, but I still don't feel like I have any consistency with the responses.

Peace,
Shaman

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-SHM

Hahaha! I tried reading this post before and I couldn't. I was about to ask if you were a writer when I glanced at the answer. You're writing is too dense, it's hard to read, even for a fellow writer. Water it down and make it conversational so it flows. Sorry I'm not helping with your actual question, but the writing style is too off-putting.

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31 and still figuring it out.

"Water it down and make it conversational so it flows."

I'm all for criticism, minsok, but, you're making vague and overly general remarks about my post that don't help me much.

as a writer, can you make a specific suggestion about how i might make my message more clear? i honestly feel like i offered an intro into the scene, a sketch of the girls, a summary of the interaction, and an articulation of my problem. look, i'm no shakespeare, but it all seems pretty clear and "conversational" to me.

thoughts?

_________________
-SHM

You wrote it like you'd write a story. You're being too descriptive, it's too dramatic. I know that's what makes a story interesting, but this is just a regular, everyday approach, not a crime novel. Filling your trip to McDonald's with luscious detail doesn't make it any more interesting to the reader. We don't care why this girl is awesome, we'll take your word for it, you don't have to "show, don't tell". We're satisfied with HB9. In short, get to the point, make it dry, dirty, and concise, you'll never capture the full scale of the interaction anyway. I, personally, appreciate your effort to set the scene, but when I come these boards, I just want a quick and dirty run down that requires very little mental investment and reads like stream of consciousness, like someone not very educated is talking.

So, for putting up with all my negative, but constructive, criticism, I took another stab at your problem. "So here's a quick rundown of the interaction: " This is where you should've started.

This is what you do when leaving a voicemail. Anyone who gets a lot of voicemails hates long voicemails. You get 10 seconds. I like to start with the girl's name to get her attention. No "Hey", just the girls name like I saw her pass by and I'm calling out to her. "Jessica. It's Minsok." Next thing you do is recall something you did that she was really into or an inside joke that made her laugh. For example, "I just saw Lady Gaga's 'Telephone' video and took that as a sign that I'm supposed to call you to see if-". The key is something external reminded you of her; you definitely haven't been thinking obsessively about her. It doesn't even have to make any sense. "I just drove by a Denny's and it reminded me of you." (She'll probably be more intrigued if it doesn't make sense). And the third component, invite her to do something specific or invite her to make plans "-see if you want to go out to ____ on Thursday." You have to pick a venue you know she'll like. I'm iffy about giving a day because she might be busy that day, but it will let you know if she's interested, because even if she is busy, she'll suggest another time. If she doesn't suggest another time, I see that as low interest. I also like to just say, "I wanna see about getting together this week." And finally, "Call me."

So, Call attention using girl's name -----> Recall inside joke or routine-----> State intentions to meet up -----> Command her to call you.

Should all only take 10 seconds, and I never bother editing the message because I just don't care that much, it's just a voicemail. For my style, your voicemail wasn't to the point enough. This is a popular girl, you're a busy guy, state your business and get out. Never EVER leave a voicemail that just sounds like you want to talk. That is a girl thing. Men use the phone for business, not idle chat (except texting). But good job CALLING her instead of just texting. Some girls are shy about calling, so I'd say try calling again with this format and then send a text if you still don't get a response. If you get her on the phone, you can even use the same format, you still state your intention to meet and eject, except you'll end with something like "Looking forward to it, bye," instead of "Call me". This is a business call, the business is to get her to meet you and leave her wanting more. That is phone game, it is minor and should not take more than a minute. If you somehow really screw up, SOMEHOW, say you have another call and you'll call her back.

Okay my friend, keep the non-target on the back burner, but keep her clearly in friend town at all times. If she pushes to meet, make sure it's not just the two of you, invite a friend and encourage her to invite friends, ask for your target specifically, but don't be obvious. Keep her interest, but don't give her any attraction, only comfort. It's important that when she talks to the target she communicates that you're not making any moves on her, otherwise the target might IGNORE you so she doesn't get between you and her friend (it looks like this is where you're at). You'll want to put all your effort in the target. Now, if the target isn't responding to you even through text, that's when you have to start proactively hanging out with the non-target in a bid to get the target to join you. At that point, it's really too much effort for any actual PUA and verges on oneitis. But at least try calling her again with my phone game. I know it's not your style, but being concise and direct on the phone will prevent you from getting into the friendzone where you talk to her for hours on the phone and get nothing. Alright, I've invested a lot in you, I better see some returns.

Holy shit, this was my longest post ever, even when I posted threads.

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31 and still figuring it out.

"I've invested a lot in you, I better see some returns." Haha, thanks, man. Excellent, excellent responses. I really do appreciate your input. I'll let you know what happens. The whole situation is actually turning out to be quite interesting. Look forward to a good story...but straight to the point, of course =)

_________________
-SHM