Today I was remembering this weird experience that happened to me about 2 or 3 years ago, and I thought I would share it, partially to ask what you guys think (What do you think about this? Has anyone ever done this before?) and maybe partially as a warning sign (Don’t do what this guy did.) So here goes:

About 2 years ago, I was doing online dating, and I came across this guy’s profile (pretty sure it was on eHarmony). He seemed clever and witty, really outgoing and extroverted.

He had this one line in his profile that I particularly liked- I can’t remember exactly how it went, but it was something like, “Beauty is common, so a girl has to have something extra about her to impress me.” I thought that was a nice sentiment, especially after reading profile after profile of shallow physical descriptions guys wanted. I was horrified when I talked to one guy on the phone and he told me that if any girl he was dating ever exceeded 130 pounds, that was grounds to dump her on the spot. He claimed he was joking, but I couldn’t delete his number fast enough. So in contrast, that line about beauty being common seemed refreshingly unsuperficial.

We talked on the phone, and the first thing I was immediately struck by was how different he seemed from his profile. He seemed shy, a little nerdy, introspective and thoughtful. Kind of socially awkward, not anything close to the confident, outgoing guy in his profile.

I talked to him on the phone a couple times, trying to catch a glimpse of the guy I had seen online, but no luck. He was interested in meeting up in person, but I wasn’t, so things ended right there.

…Until maybe 2 or 3 months later when I was reading The Pickup Artist and recognized the same words on the page as words I had read months earlier. Word for word, exact quotes. I was shocked. Here were my general thoughts:

1. That is so fucking messed up. I’m really pissed off! I want to slap this guy across the face!
2. What a desperate, pathetic loser that his own personality is so bad, he has to imitate someone elses.
3. So that explains why he was completely different over the phone!

I actually ended up sending him a couple nasty texts and then deleting his number.

MUCH later, I got a text from an unknown number. I asked who it was. He wouldn’t tell me who it was until he had played this whole “guess who I am” game with me for ten minutes. I think it was his way of feeling powerful and in-control, and a way to get me to talk to him. And then when he finally revealed his name, I couldn’t remember who he was at first. Anyway, he told me that I was basically a bitch because at the time I had sent my mean texts, his dad had been in the hospital with a stroke. I apologized for the timing but not for being angry about what he did. To my surprise, he completely defended himself, saying that even though he had gotten the ideas from The Pick Up Artist, he still believed in everything he had written and it was no different from “quoting your favorite line from a book.”

Anyway, I never talked to him again, though I saved his number until I got a new phone so I could ignore any future texts from him.

Any thoughts? Would you guys ever do something like that? HAVE you guys ever done something like that before? Do you think he was justified? You could say that because he got a phone call out of it, he succeeded in “gaming” me. But it didn’t end up working out for him.

Thanks. Looking forward to hearing any thoughts!

I sympathise with you, and I understand why you're upset and feel like you were lied to but can I say something?

Most guys who start off down this path, myself included, are the typical "nice guys" who want to meet a girl, have a relationship and just have what other people have. Yet being ourselves doesn't work. The typical advice doesn't work. The hollywood romance doesn't happen. In fact if you've read The Game, you should be able to sympathise. What Neil Strauss goes through at the beginning is exactly what we feel like. Helpless and lost.

Because of social conditioning, being a "Nice guy" doesn't work. If that PUA guy hadn't read the game he would have been one of the hundreds of other guy's profiles you skimmed through and went "NEXT!" without a second's thought.

Guys turn to PUA out of frustration because the system is skewed and unfair. We're expected to approach women, we're expected to take all the risks. We're expected to take the lead and know exactly how to woo a woman. If we can't do even one of these to a high standard, we're rejected and the girl starts looking for someone else. We don't know what to do. We don't know what we're supposed to do. We're conditioned to put girls on a pedestal and that they're worth more than us. On the few occasions we get the courage to try we get kicked to the curb in seconds. See it from the guy's perspective.

Problem: Girls won't give most guys the time of day
Solution: Guys become frustrated and look to others for help.

Can you blame guys for this? There's a terrible double standard in the dating world. Look at *any* girl's magazine and it's full of "How to get him to...." articles yet these are seen as perfectly acceptable.


"Gaming" girls isn't about trying to sleep around, or pick up every chick (Although for some people it is) for most of us it is simply a way to create an opportunity to meet you girls! .... because you would otherwise reject us in a split second BEFORE YOU EVEN TRIED TO GET TO KNOW US and not care.


Is "Game" moral? Probably not. Is it "fair"? Probably not. But is it "fair" that most genuine guys are rejected in seconds? Probably not. Until the social status quo changes, guys are going to make their own opportunities in any way possible.

When girls start feeling less entitled and guys aren't expected to make all the moves and take all the risks *then* you can start complaining about guys using tactics and plans and seeking advice.

not sure why guys bitch when they get rejected, it is pretty pathetic, and never ever works in accomplishing anything.

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http://www.joshsway.com -- dating, online dating, fitness, fashion, and more...

It's not really bitching it's just the way it is. Guys have to take the all risks. I'm fine with that, but you can't blame guys for looking at methods to minimise the risk and increase their chances.

Yes, it is bitching. Telling a girl off because she is not interested is pathetic, no real other way around it. And what risk?

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http://www.joshsway.com -- dating, online dating, fitness, fashion, and more...

Don't be so bitchy.

Instead of sending him nasty text, just tell him he isn't who you thought he was after reading his profile. That could actually help him be less 'pathetic'.

And honestly, you're Online dating. What did you expect?

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Two words: Carpe Diem

Arlene - Bravo for putting your story out there. I run a service called Profile Diva http://www.profilediva.netthat helps guys write authentic, interesting profiles, messages, etc and I give them exactly the same advice you are giving. I'm also a woman who has lots of online dating experience and I can't tell you the number of times I've been SHOCKED in the difference between the profile and the REAL guy. Like you, I always felt lied to and immediately TURNED OFF.

In my considerable experience, most guys get rejected because they go for girls that are out of their league. PUA tells them ANY guy can get ANY girl, and the fact is, they can't. They try these lines and tactics, which they aren't charismatic or confident enough to deliver and follow through with, and always get found out for being phonies in the end.

Guys get rejected because they have NO idea how to read women and the signs that they give out - both online and in person. I always say, do you want to get rejected by 9's or have sex with 6's? Seriously - what is your priority? To have the ego boost and respect of other men by having a hot girl, or by actually having REAL sex with a REAL woman who is into you? That's an easy choice in my book.

Bottom line guys, and you can believe me or not, getting a girl to message you or even meet up with you DOESN'T MEAN SHIT if she's just going to find out that you're a phony using some other guy's lines. You might be able to trick a girl into viewing your profile or sending you a message, but you can't trick her into much more than that.

Confident and cocky lines only work if you ARE actually that guy in person or on the phone. BE that guy, don't imitate that guy. That's the only way you're going to have more success.

I help guys write profiles for a living and it's amazing how many think that they aren't good enough just being themselves to get a woman. When they start with that pathetic "nice guys can't get laid being themselves" bullshit I instantly stop them. You've failed before you've even begun. Yes, you may need to skill up, learn a little about women, and improve your confidence, but that is not the same thing as assuming a stranger's persona because you're just cursed with being a nice guy who always finishes last. Boo Hoo!

Truth is - do you really want a woman who doesn't want a nice guy? Do you want a screwed up princess who just wants guys who treat her like shit? Or are you so desperate you'll take ANYTHING you can get? Think about it and have some standards. The only way you'll attract the right girl who is into you is if you put your true self out there.

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Profile Diva
http://www.profilediva.net

If you got bamboozled and hornswoggled by that corny ass antiquated line of trite you deserve whatever befell you

I don't see anything wrong at all with what the guy did. Did he ever even say, "I am very outgoing" in his profile? You just said he came off as outgoing in his profile, well ok, I've had women who came off as outgoing online and then I've met them in person and they are as quiet and reserved as a mouse.

Maybe he really did feel the way he said in his profile. Talking on the phone, chatting online, and talking in person can all be different experiences for ANYONE.

what do you expect the guy to do? Say he's a wussy nerd who sounds insecure when he talks? Like someone said b4, if he was negative in his profile women would never message him at all.

He didn't do anything wrong according to your post. If he posted a fake pic or said he's a big time talker then you'd have an argument. But that beauty line he used, he may actually feel that way. Even if something is stolen from someone else, it doesn't mean the person who's using the line doesn't feel that way.

I think yall should hug and make up

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http://www.dynamicdaygame.com

A lot of the guys on here are like that. It's part of the problem you see here (and the main reason I don't hang around here so much), too many guys don't realize what really matters and merely try to immitate others in hopes of getting laid rather than getting in touch with themselves and understanding what women truly seek.

Anyway, I can understand your sentiment, and yeah, the guy hopefully learned a thing or two about being genuine from his exp (though I doubt it). However, you shouldn't have lashed out at him like that. Yeah, he's a liar, and a loser, but you should have tried to understand the reason he did it. A lot of the guys on here have serious self-esteem issues, and your little act probably didn't help.

Anyway, my advice would be to not seek dates in online dating sites, you likely won't find anyone worthwhile. Likewise, you shouldn't be so quick to judge people as losers cause they're introverted. I'm an introvert myself, but I'm far from being a 'loser.'

In fact, you seem to be more of an extrovert, perhaps you should pay more attention to the quieter guys, they might be a better match for you, just my two cents.

And no, I'm not hitting on you, honestly, I'm not interested (no offense). Not all the guys on here are here to merely try and get laid, there are a rare few of us who seek something more wholesome...

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"Be the change you wanna see in the world" -Gandhi

Yet several MONTHS after breaking off contact, the OP texted him out of the blue to insult him... at what was apparently a bad time in the guys life.

Really there's no clear "winner" here, just a bunch of humans who made mistakes and hurt each other.

That's just it, you aren't interested in a shy, introspective and thoughtful person. You're angry he "gamed" you, but you set up requirements he cannot meet without "game." Most women seem to have those same requirements, so either he learns game and applies it or he stays alone forever.

Why is it "messed up?" Many people borrow ideas from books and use them as their own. How many women read Cosmo for dating tips? How is that different?
Yet look what you thought of his personality. The funny thing is, the line you quoted as being sweet, whether it was his or not, is part of his personality you liked... you just couldn't get past his shyness. Maybe he's an all-around great guy but you only care if he's assertive and outgoing.
True. One of the points of pickup, though, is that he should be "improving" his personality as well. Someday he will be outgoing, and maybe then you'd give him a second glance. (By improving, I mean shaping aspects of his personality to fit what women like you want.)
Why? So you were angry, does that give you the right to lash out and try to hurt someone? It was months later... I don't even get why you still had his number!

Done what? Tried to appear more confident than we really are? Yes. ALL men have. We have to.

Retaliated? No... he should have let it drop. But you should have let it drop too.

If anything, maybe she's trying to do that now... but I wouldn't say she should have tried to understand the reason. Just left it alone is more like it... she'd already decided she didn't like the guy, why try to hurt him?
Funny thing to say on a board dedicated to online dating... especially given your next couple points. Introverted guys (quality or not) are much more likely to try online dating than meeting women in person.

Thats why I keep my messages short and to the point.
I'm not a talkative guy on the phone or in person.. I'm very blunt and straight forward. It's to the point where people will look at me and smile.. like damn did he just say that. lol
Sure I'm creative and poetic to the point where I could create beautiful,inspiring sentiments but that's not my personality. Especially if it isn't bringing me money lol...If a girl doesn't like my 1 or 2 line message then she isn't for me. Why would I waste time on a woman who wants Mr.Perfect and long drawn out messages anyway. They live in a fantasy world.