Okay so I'm a good looking guy (just take my word for it b/c no pics at the moment) but I'm not good with women...at all. I just turned 20 so I'm not too far along in life luckily and I'm not a virgin either (lost it when I was 17), so I guess I'm not in too bad of shape; but I need to fix this problem now before it gets any worse. I have a range of problems ranging from mild AA, an inability to keep an interesting convo, and worst of all not being able to create sexual tension when I'm talking to a girl or even when I'm in bed with her! Yes it does even get to that point; pretty pathetic right? These problems confront me at all levels of gaming; many times I'll be walking down the hall at school, in the cafe, or at the store and a fine ass girl will be eyeing me but I just dont have the balls to go up to her and say anything. Partly because I wouldnt know what to say or if I did talk it would be boring and get nowhere, so I avoid it. If I do somehow get a number I would text her (rarely call b/c not good at convo) and get nowhere, eventually throwing myself into the dreaded friend zone. But here's where its gets really bad; I'm in college and sometimes I'll be alone with a girl in her dorm or mines just chilling on bed or something and we'll just keep talking and talking until eventually she gets bored and leaves or tells me to leave! I'll leave disappointed knowing good and well that she liked me but now she sees me as a loser because I didn't pull the trigger when I was with her. I hate it man it's happened twice last week and now they dont even respond when I text them. Meanwhile my roomates have girls over too but they actually get the pussy. So I really just need some help, some tips, some feedback, SOMETHING! I'm not a club guy so no bullshit routines or nonsense like that. I just need to know how to create that sexual tension. Thanks for reading guys...

I red your story and I totally feel you. A couple of months ago, before i studied pick up I had the image of myself that I was good looking aswell, but when it came to women... I had zero skill.

To refer to your experiences with women on your bed i would like to tell something what I did with a girl before I studied pick up, and what i did with the same girl after I studied pick up.

I met a girl in november, she was in the same group of friends as mine. she is very flirtious and when we went out with friends and at the end of the party she kissed me out of nowhere for something like 20 seconds.
We met eachother on the way back home and she came home with me. At home she sat down next to me on the couch and I realised i had no idea how to escalate it, so nothing happend on that night. She left...

In january i met her again i was studying pick up for a couple of weeks at that moment. Everything went right while going out and we agreed that she would come home with me. At my house we made some diner together and I told her it was very cold in the living room and my room upstairs was much warmer and we should go there. she followed me. We had a long conversation, I didn't care much about what she was telling me so I started to lay down in my bed and act a little bit unintersted, she was sitting with her ass to my face and after a while she turned to me and she was laying next to me, i started kino escalation but i didn't no how to kiss her. And after a while she was complaining that i didn't took enough initiative, so i kissed her after that. I wanted to escalate more but i couldn't handle her LMR. She finally left... Although I was proud that in such a short period i could take it to this level.
Afterwards I focussed on how to escalate in these bed situations and this is what i do now:
1. I'm building rapport to make her feel comfortable
2. I complement her on her 'beautiful' hair while touching it
3. i start stroking her hair
4. i start smelling her neck for some minutes (at this moment she start to feel really aroused)
5. I move my head up, look her in the eyes and kiss her on the lips for a couple of seconds
6. I stop kissing her, move my head back look her in the eyes and kiss her again and i continue this for a while
7. My hands slides to her body and caress her upper body and boobs.
8. I move my head down and start kissing her in the neck
9. She will be now aroused enough so you can escalate more, if she will resist, you keep doing what i wrote in step 4 untill 8 and try i again a little later... just do your thing.

Most important of all... practice, practice, practice. Don't see rejection as failure... see it as feedback.

Good luck with it pall

Thanks pope I really appreciate your advice! It feels good to know I'm not the only one with the problem. In fact, I was in the same exact situation you were in your story. I went out with some friends, guys and girls, to the club. One of the girls in the group I took home and before she got out the car she made out with me! She was pretty cute too. I decided I could fuck her no problem so I decided we should chill the next day. We hung out at her house in her room for a while and I could have fucked her no problem but had no idea what to do. She got bored and eventually told me to leave, I know she was disappointed, as was I. And I try to take these failures as feedback but its just happened too much and I always screw it up. I just feel like giving up at times. By the way what is LMR and rapport? (I'm new to all this)

Hey, I'm kinda in the same boat as you. I'm only a freshmen in high school so i still have a long time to learn this stuff but i used to fear approaching girls not because i was scarred of what they thought of me but because i didn't know how to hold an interesting conversation. What i did to get over this was practice. It sounds weird to practice talking to people but it actually helped me. I wasn't necessarily trying to "game" then but just hold an interesting conversation. i would just start a conversation with someone were ever i was going, it could be on the bus, between classes, or whatever.

Here is what i learned from my "practice".
1.Other people want to be talk to to(most of the time). What this means is that if you start a conversation they will most likely enjoy it and to to feed it and keep it going.

2.It was easiest for me to talk about things i noticed going on around me then relate it to a something similar that happened to me. Then normally they will remark about themselves in that situation and before you know it you guys are chating away like lifelong friends.

3.You want to change your movement and voice levels according to what your talking about. For example if you are talking about a happy or exciting time you probably want to move around more and talk more excidially than if you were talking about a sad memory.

4.If you feel the conversation is about to go downhill it's ok to leave. For me personally it feels better if they remember put you in the exciting and fun guy category rather than a person who starts a conversation and lets it dies out. You can't do this all the time obviously but if yo do it right it can make you look more busy and more fun.

I just got into this community a little while ago so I'm not the most informed on this topic and i could be doing this totally wrong. This is just some things i did that i feel made me a more interesting speaker.

I'm not sure on these because I'm still a noob but i think
LMR means last minute resistance
Rapatort is building a connection with a person.

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Okay I'll admit its a little embarrasing to be getting advice from a freshman in hs when im i jr in college, but hey thats life! Thanks for the advice man you seem to know your stuff. Hey by the time your my age you'll be a pro. Keep up the good work man your gonna go far!

Dude, I've been in your position several times but managed to follow it through. If you have got the girl in your room or you are both sharing a bed the hard work is already done, the best way to move it to the next stage is to say

you -hey you know what i am really good at / famous for

her - no what's that?

you - massages, do you fancy one

I don't know of a single girl that will not say yes to a free massage. If she doesn't want one, then she was not interested, but i guarantee if she is in to you she will roll on to her front and expect you to get working on her shoulders and back.

If your feeling confident, get her to take of her top as well.

Best thing is, you don't even need to be very good, just don't be too rough with her

From here you have 3 options

1) Start to kiss her neck (you will most likely be sat over her lower back so just need to lean forward, girls love it, i give it a few mintues before she turns her head round to kiss you properly)
2) Take your top off and tell her it's your turn for a massage, (now you both have your tops off and are in bed together, all you have to do is during your massage roll on to your back and she is on top of you, lean forward and kiss)
3) Jump off and tell her it's time to massage her front.............

Game on

Let me know if you try it

Thanks man..great advice!

Its funny I've actually done the massage thing in two different situations and screwed them up, but just to show how pathetic I am I'll elaborate.

I was with this cute girl back in high school, we chilled at the park for a while had a great time got to know each other, she even sat on my lap. We went back to her place and I offered to massage her and she wanted it. I gave her a massage and she liked it and then I told her it was my turn so she massaged my back and then I decided I would seize the opportunity and make her massage my front so I could get the kiss. As it went, I turned over, she started massaging my chest and after a while she was just sitting there on top of me looking in my eyes, and I in hers. To my dismay, and hers too obviously, I wimped out and asked her to get off b/c I had to use the bathroom. When I got out she told me to leave.

Another time, more recently, I was with this really fine chick I met at a football game (she had been eye-fucking me the whole time so I had to meet her). We talked for a while on Facebook and she invited me to her apt. to chill. I knew she liked me and after a while of watching some tv in her room (on her bed) I offered to massage her. The massage went great and I was gonna do the kiss on the neck thing but at the last minute I wimped out (once again) and left disappointed.

I guess the main problem is I just doubt myself to much, no confidence. Its something I really struggle with and have a hard time getting over but I'm gonna keep trying. Again man, thanks for sharing!!

It sounds like you have missed out on two perfect opportunities to have kissed these girls, so I think it's really important for you to understand what your thought processes are at the crucial moment.

Think back to the two situations, was there anything in particular that stopped you going in for the kiss? I think once you understand what has stopped you going in for the final move, then perhaps you can begin to undo the negative thought processes, which should hopefully result in more positive outcomes.

Bare in mind, that these two girls were allowing you to be intimate with them, so it would have been unlilkely that they would not have allowed you to kiss them.

With regard the situation where you bailed to go to the bathroom - when she was looking in to your eyes, you could have flipped he situation round to make her take the initiative. For example you could have said

"How long are we going to look in to each others eyes before you kiss me?"

I remember a situation i was in with one girl at a house party, we were both sat outside on the step, there was chemistry so I knew she was in to me, but she was sat too far away for me to lean in and kiss her. So after 10 mintues of talking i said

"Are we going to kiss yet....?" and then smiled at her. She shifted over and we started making out.

It doesnt always have to be your resposnibility to make the first move, so if you find it hard to physically make he move i.e instigate the kiss, why not say something which gives her the go ahead to make the move

Hope this helps

Hi BxBwoy,

one word answer to your problems.

KINO.

You mention a lot about talking. Conversation is a start but talking alone will not get her to take it any further. if you do not touch her she gets the idea that she is not attractive. Why would she want to take it further with someone who doesn't find her attractive?

Start the touching and build up

You can do it!

Yo Bx. I ran into David D.'s stuff back in jr. high, but never really looked into it till senior year of hs, now. Basically what slow burner said.

KINO

Look up some info on the Escalation Ladder.

KINO is basically touchin, like taking her hand, brushing something off her face(or pretending to ) , take her by the waist. Stroking her hair. Stuff like that. And getting more through the ladder. Hope it helps bro. - Redkid/Evolution

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I'll rise to the top yet. Just watch me.

A good one is to tell her your back hurt for whatever reason and ask her to massage you, as she massage make fun of her and tell her she's doing it totally wrong, and you tell her to turn around and show her how it's done.

Thanks for the advice guys.

Kino is definetely key. My problem is; I know certain parts of kino like hand holding, hair brushing, holding the waist, etc. I just dont know how and when to execute them with the right energy. I need to learn steps A to Z and make it flow.

I was with a girl and out of nowhere I just started touching her hair and she gave me a wierd look. You know what I mean? I dont know where to start and how to escalate.

When you feel the energy is wright and she is giving you so many IOI's you can just go with caressing her arm or whatever.

When it is not there yet there are several excuses to start Kino. examples:

- complimenting on her hair, telling her that it is beatifull while touching it
- smelling her hair and telling her it is delicious then caresse it
- palm reading
- ask her if she likes dancing, then take her to the dancefloor(don't start grinding her!!)

- the massaging escalation of anhpeter is a very good one as wel

Just try it out and discover. If you're are ding more Kino than she is comfortable with, they normally will takeaway your hand very gentle. Just act like it's not a big deal for you, she isn't rejecting you, she's just not ready for it yet. But remember, never Apoligize for it!!

you obviously know that its a kino issue. i know exactly what youre going through dude. the biggest thing you need to know is that if a girl makes an effort to be alone with you anywhere, she wants you to kiss her. your job is to kino escalate. allow me to elaborate.

the most important thing you can do is to build a habit of casual touching. this releases any tension that may come up and stops the "make a move" mentality. start off with small stuff, play thumb war or something. the important thing is to always roll off when you initiate kino. i used to mistake kino escalate as A) hold girls hand and never let go B) go for kiss and dont stop C) try to touch boob, etc. obviously this is not the correct way to go. if youre playing thumb war for example, once you are finished, throw her hand away. it doesnt have to be anything special just casually be the first one to end kino. slowly build kino from here, just make sure to rolloff, it makes her chase.

needless to say, if a girl is massaging you in her bed, you should have no trouble making things sexual. try the style kiss gambit to escalate the kiss. if you have any other questions, feel free to pm me

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haha omg we're in the same boat lol, sept i'm 17 turnin 18, but i wanna change this before i turn 18, so i'm ready to pull at clubs, bars etc

If the girls on her own wid u nd ur doin kino escalation, SERIOUSLY don't completly stick to the PUA rules, one because their not cast in stone, nd they hav to be adapted to u, so treat the PUA rules, as a guide as u shud, nd other PUA's disagree with each other

so for each different PUA technique treat em as different schools of thought, a bit like Plato, Aristotle, Socrates etc, their very similar but they do disagree with each other nd their theory's r not 100%, exact same wid PUA, so seriously u shud of just gone fuck it, u probs defo cud hav fucked her there nd then, but no worries plenty of em left nd she may be recoverable, but don't go chasing her, my advice is, don't chat to her for like a month or 2, nd in that time try nd get laid by 4 girls, they gotta be 8 nd above lol, den get bk to ehr, bet u won't even want her after