Recently, I have begun to notice an unintended side effect of most peoples' progression to become a PUA. This side effect comes about by people taking methods and/or canned lines to be a doctrine of how to be sucsessful with women and/or social situations. What is the side effect? Loosing yourself to a certain canned, structured facade of a "cool" personality that everyone likes. I always hear advice like "be alpha" or something else of the sort. I hate to break this to some people who work so hard at becoming "alpha", but, the fact of the matter is, not everyone can have an Alpha personality. This is fine however, because another fact of life is that you don't need to be Alpha to have sucsess or power in your life. Some of the most sucsessful, powerful, wealthy, and wise people are those who stay below the radar and don't have to display that they are the king of the moutain. If you aren't an Alpha personality, don't worry so much about it and waste your time "acting Alpha" because really, that is all you are doing. Merely mimmicing something you are not and sometimes this changes people for the worst, they change and become argumentative and always out to prove themselves to people. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for self-improvement and changing your life for the better, but some things don't need to be changed. It is much better to shine with your unique characterisitics than it is to cloak behind this super-imposed persona. In the end, it is your genuine personality that will make you who you are, not how many women you've slept with, or any other accomplishment. A measure of a man is in his honesty, integrity, and character. Always remember that.

So, how do we avoid this side effect? Simple. Stop being superficial. Superficiality is an embracement of the trivial or surface and an avoidance of the deep thinking about life in general. Though while giving up being superficial you make have to face some troubling, hard, and intimidating aspects of life, in the end, your decission and behavior will be true to reality, and more importantly, yourself. Take this new deep thinking and look at WHY methods or canned lines work and infuse these deep-rooted micro-societial truths into your daily life. As complicated as it may sound, its really not. If one is to grow as a man, there must be an end to this superficial aspect of one's life.

Make yourself. But always, always, always be yourself.

Peace. Love. Life.
Methuselah.

_________________
Amor est Vitae Essentia

You keep telling us that not everyone is cut out to be an alpha and I agree with that, some people just don't have the spine and you can't give them one, they need to grow it themselves. You keep telling us that you don't have to be the "king of the mountain" or "the top dog" though and that has very little to do with being alpha as far as I'm concerned.

In my own social circle, sure I'm the "top dog", I'm the "king of the mountain" and people know that I set the laws of the land, but that's because I run the household and I'm the one that does all the administrative work, so that makes me the man on top. If I wasn't the one that did all that stuff, I could still be the alpha of the group though.

You say that you can stay below the radar and achieve success and power, but that doesn't mean you can't be alpha under the radar. That's one of my favorite tactics as far as AMOGing goes. You come into sets under the radar as some friendly guy interested in getting to know some people and you buddy up to the guys in the group. You talk to them, with the occassional word to the girls of the set and you can show that you're the alpha, without the guys even realising that they have been blown out (that's under the radar alpha attitude).

You think to black and white for my taste Meth. You make some good points about being deep and thinking about what you're trying to achieve and not becoming some canned persona, which is great, but if you spent much time reading what's being said around here, you would see that aside from people just getting into things, the vast majority of stuff on this forum is orginal, uncanned lines and generally its the underlying psychology and theories, so that people can replicate the results themselves in multiple situations.

My challenge to you: Find me a time when Tripp, Starbuck, Doc, and myself have told someone to use canned material. If that's too hard, then just find me 3 times that I have told someone to use canned material, it won't happen. You can't judge the entire forum based upon what people that are just getting into the game are using, because its training wheels man. Next you're gonna tell me you go around your neighbourhood taking the training wheels off of all the kids bikes and trashing their tricycles, just because they aren't riding properly.

_________________
"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

Wow, Meth, nice job! You finally get what we've been saying! Cool. Glad to see that.

That's the goal of the process. You start with training wheels until you figure out why they work. Then you don't need them anymore.

Essentially an alpha male is himself - he doesn't care what other thinks of him. Moreover he is internally validated so he doesn't need to change himself entirely to get approval from others. He changes in order to become a better man and in this way he changes for himself.

If you throw away your personality to please other people you are big time beta/AFC because throwing away your personality comes from a wish to get approval.

Methuselah wrote: There are many characteristics of an alpha man right here. If you let external things like how many women you have slept with define you then you are not alpha. If you don't display your thoughts (aren't honest when it comes to what you want/feel/etc.) then you are not alpha. If you don't know where you stand regarding various things (a lack of character) then you are not alpha.

It is only by being your genuine (best) self that you can be alpha.

Anyways just my two cents.

_________________
- - > "It's better to die on your feet than to live on your knees"

hollywoodinpa on The Transition to Natural Game:

the-transition-to-natural-game-vt15880.html

That is one of the most concise definitions of how I feel about being Alpha that I have ever read FreeLife. Thanks for the spare change!

_________________
"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

And that's where the real issue lies. Most guys are not secure in themselves. Hence the need for the training wheels.

I couldn't agree more, but you aren't getting what I am saying if you are explaining that to me. I'm not associating being Alpha with being the top dog or anything like that, I don't know where you are coming from with that. I didn't distinguish it in the post perhaps, but this post wasn't just about being Alpha, that was just to serve as an example out of many. I don't know if it just wasn't clear or you haven't actually read many of my posts. But I have been harping on this exact same thing for the past year. I've always given advice that is similar to this, and always will.
I'm not accusing anyone of spewing canned lines all the time, I'm stating a simple warning to people who are following guidelines and gameplans taken strait from some distinctive methodology.
No need to get your back up bro, I haven't accused any of you of doing such a thing, so I really don't know what you're getting at with this "challenge". I'm not judging the entire forum, and I'm certainly not going down the slipperly slope you suggest of bullying kids on bikes. That is non-sensical. Once again I was just posting this as a warning, and my thoughts on the community as a whole, not as some sort of subliminal attack at you, tripp, doc, or starbucks advice. I actually enjoy reading all of your posts. So once again bro, in case I wasn't clear, this post has nothing to do with you or anyone else in particular.
I'm not sure if you just haven't read any of my previous posts or what. But I finally got what "you've been saying" a long time ago.
I completely agree, like I said this post wasn't all about being Alpha, it just served as an example. I think part of the problem is the misconception throughout the community that being Alpha means you are tough, loud, and assertive. The fact of the matter is that like you said, an Alpha male is himself, and that can be anyone, therefore there are countless different types of Alpha personalities. Great feedback.

_________________
Amor est Vitae Essentia

I guess I mistook your intentions, so I appologize Meth. I have read a number of your posts and I've noticed that you do always give this sort of advice, but it seems very "doom and gloom" to me. It always sounds like you're warning people of some impending PUA apocolypse because we are becoming stagnant and so you call for action, for change, but you don't offer a solution, or coaching, because you expect people to realise these things on their own. We mention the same problems that you warned of here quite often, but usually directly before, or after re-enforcing it with a way to avoid and work around the problems. I'm just struggling to understand why you always sound as if there's bad things on the horizon, when all I see is clear skies and lots of potential.

_________________
"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

Well, I offer solutions but like you said, I think that most of the answers and truths in life are best learned when the person seeking improvment and/or answers comes to them from their own thoughts. It's much easier to aqcuire all this knowledge if it is being handed to you, but are you truely learning like that? Sort of. However, like I said I prefer stimulating thought rather than saying "do this" because it works. Both methods of learning will obviously teach you something, but I honestly beleive that instead of just knowing, you should know not only the why, but the how of what you know. And the best way to do this is to arrive at the conclusion from your own deep-thinking.

I'm not pessimistic about the future of the community, trust me, I see very clear skies as well.

_________________
Amor est Vitae Essentia

That's exactly what we keep saying, as mods and teachers. And in order to get people to that point, we realize that those people usually need canned lines and routines to start with, as with the training wheels.

Hence the NEED for the different systems. It gives people something to work with. Until they do understand the phsychology underneath.

That's why I, for one, don't understand why people have such a problem with others starting out with canned lines and routines. They just need a place to start.

BTW, a warning of what? Meth, you said you're giving a warning to the community, but why?

Yep Meth, you're right experience is the best teacher.

But I'm reminded of the old saying 'fake it until you make it'.

Everybody's got to start somewhere. And the thing about this journey called life, you never ever really reach your destination. Until the day it's suddenly cut short by death.

People take this whole alpha thing far too seriously. Being alpha isn't about dominating others. No, far from it. That's what separates us humans from the animal kingdom. Otherwise we'd all be out in the streets fighting it out over our own personal perceived alpha'ness or lack thereof.

Besides, those who will voluntarily agree to be dominated IMO aren't worth dominating anyway. They're simply weak or inexperienced personalities.

No, being alpha is far more complicated than that. Being alpha is as much about being secure in who you are and what you are about, without having to put down others (the weaker among us) to compensate.

I'm reminded of something I read some place that describe those who can't compete at the highest level based upon their own personal merits only. So they resort to such trickery, deception and often abuse to compensate for such personal inadequacies.

"Two of the most effective psychological tools that people use in order to manipulate others are compliments and criticisms. More specifically, they use insincere flattery and subjective criticisms. There is nothing too wrong with expressing sincere compliments and objective criticisms, as long as it’s not an excessive habit, but you need to train your mind to ignore and remain unaffected by insincere flattery, subjective criticisms, and/or opinionated insults.

When you become too excited in response to flattery, and too angry or depressed in response to criticism, this is not a good thing. If manipulative people detect this characteristic in you, they will always try to take advantage of this. This is why you have to strive for egotistical indifference."

_________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

I think the nail on the head.

Education is only part of the puzzle. Experience is the other. But an important part nonetheless?

Independence of thought is another important quality to possess as well.

But then heck, everybody's gotta eat. And how many 21 y.o. CEO's do you know?

_________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4ufa-q7DcWM

way to go methuselah. I always agreed with what you just said

Listen man, you must be reading what I am saying wrong. I am not knocking the use of canned lines or methods, please re-read the opening statements of this post.

Recently, I have begun to notice an unintended side effect of most peoples' progression to become a PUA. This side effect comes about by people taking methods and/or canned lines to be a doctrine of how to be sucsessful with women and/or social situations. What is the side effect? Loosing yourself to a certain canned, structured facade of a "cool" personality that everyone likes.

Nowhere in there am I saying "DONT USE CANNED LINES", what I'm saying is that to truly and effectively progress as a man, you have to transcend following some gurus method.

The warning? The warning is to people who develop these entirely false avatars stretching themselves to be something they are not just to fit a certain methods standards and/or advice.
I don't see where you are seeing this from, care to explain?

_________________
Amor est Vitae Essentia

Ok, sure, some people lose themselves, but again, that's something that happens in any field of endeavor. Not just this. As far as taking a method as doctrine, what I teach people are the social dynamics that are taught in the MM. Because those social dynamics apply to every area of life. For losing yourself to become some cool personna . . . again, that happens in any endeavor, but anyone who is SERIOUS about their growth most likely won't do that, because we are ALWAYS teaching people to find themselves. Find what makes you, you. And develop that. We just use the gurus methods in order to help people to learn the social dynamics.

And people HAVE to stretch, otherwise you don't grow. Period.