Hmm...

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In this grinner's world, it'd be best if you kept your smiles like Hallmark cards... only on occasions. Make her deserve them. - Prizzy

As has been said we shouldn't go around blaming anyone for pretty much anything. However I like the idea of looking into the past to investigate (if that's the word) the events that caused this (and others) problem in your life. For me I believe it was always trying to impress and seek approval from OTHER people and not from myself, my father being a big factor in that when I'd always try to impress him when I played in youth football teams (soccer to the americans) because whenever I came off the pitch he always mentioned "you coulda tackled sooner there" and you know stuff like that, and obviously seeking the approval of girls and my social circle etc. As of the last few years though I've realised this isn't the correct mentallity to have in life. This is a quote out of nowhere but I like it, it's from the gutiarist Ted Nugent and he said it on that VH1 program "Supergroup" the quote is "Noone has higher authority over what is or isn't right about my music other than me." change the word music for the word life and there you go.
For the record though, as far as my dad is concerned he is the biggest natural I have ever seen in my life, my dad could charm the pants of anyone in my opinion, as I have seen it with my own 2 eyes and wondered how. He is still married to my mother but still "games" every human being around him wherever we go and it's only recently I've noticed this, he especially does it when we go on holiday so next time we go as a family I'll be obvserving and taking mental notes. Whether he's cheated on my mother or not I don't know but from what I can tell he does it just so that he never "loses it".

I hope some of that slightly inebriated rambling made sense lol.

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"My toughest opponent is always myself"
Musterion's Journal

Exactly. Parents are not to blame for what they are INCAPABLE of passing on (i.e. knowledge that they DON'T have) - see my previous thread on mothers for why this is...

... But they ARE most certainly at fault for mentally conditioning their children to think a certain way. Like the way most guys had parents that they were always trying to impress, or how some parents are much too harsh... socially conditioning their kids to be almost like slaves from a very early age, treating them like shit for having their own opinion, the kind of parents that nobody could ever please. The kind of parents who are very harsh with discipline and only teach their kids nervousness, insecurity and fear. Then when they grow up - WHAMMO! They won't know what hit them in the real world where you have to fight your own battles and have CONFIDENCE, not fear!

Mom & Dad aren't going to be there forever, and the only good parents are the ones who realize this and want their children to SURPASS them in EVERYTHING, not just money and an engineering degree. If they can't teach you to be a PUA, the LEAST they can do is not distort your mind with false notions of "how to be nice and caring" that were ALREADY outdated when Sputnik was launched.

If they can't even do that much, they are hurting, not helping. I knew a girl from an Indian family, whose parents were ALWAYS pushing her to have an arranged marriage, and here's the kicker: the guy had to be from the same CASTE - yes they believed in caste system even though they had immigrated to the U.S.! And on top of that, it had to be "astrologically sound" where they hire a fortune teller to "match" them up based on their Hindu zodiac signs... And she's almost 30 now, her parents were TOTALLY fucking up her life, treating her like shit because she didn't like any of the creepy guys they tried to set her up with. She finally said "let me choose my partner" and they CUT OFF ALL TIES with her.

Now if that happened to ANY of us, I'm sure we would put 110% more effort into forging INDEPENDENT lives for ourselves where WE make all the choices - including the choices that the PUA lifestyle opens up like no other.

ok now some of you are just being...masculists? idk... Saying women are completely controlled by emotions and shit like that. as if you, the epitome of logical thinking, aren't.

Why should we blame our fathers? What do you expect from them?
"Son, come here. I'm going to teach you how to have sex with women."?! As if that is some kind of life goal, like going to college and getting a job, that we should strive toward? It isn't, it is an emotional matter that isn't your fathers business, just as he wouldn't teach you to masturbate, and he wouldn't, beyond the most basic social skills, teach you how to make friends, and he wouldn't tell you what music to listen to or what clothes to wear.

Before you blame them, let me ask you, how many of you ever even tried to ask them for advice in these matters? Awkward question? It should be, its not one he is meant to teach you. He can tell you about sex and personal responsibility and condoms/abstinence, and that is it. You could come to him with specific relationship problems with your specific girl, but not with something so completely unrelated to family life like, how do I get with girls.

man some of these replies are plain nasty. And speaking about chief's thoughts of the matter which is accurate "are u going to blame your father's father, then your father's father father?"

I think YES. I'm not saying blame them and be cold and spiteful towards him, he was unconsciously ignorant, therefore not even KNOWING that there were scientific laws/rules of attraction....he may have knew what sometimes works and what sometimes doesn't work. But he may have been a nice guy AFC who bought women's attention, and found out that his current wife was actually persuaded by buying shit. He only knows what he has experienced.

But the AWESOME part about this, is that "WE" can be a new type of father. We can teach our sons the way of the world with a more statically accurate way of owning our reality. Of course we all wish our father's taught us this, but that doesn't mean our future children are going to as clueless. I can't wait until mystery has a son, he'll be fucking celebrities as soon as his balls drop.

It really depends on the unconscious raising habits of both parents, I would say. My Dad, great man, is a lover of quiet time, since he has pretty much never been without a kid under 5 years old since his firstborn, so it was very important to keep the house quiet since someone was sleeping at pretty much every hour of the day.

I think this had an impact on me in that I can now comfortably sit anywhere with anyone and not say a word and not feel awkward at all. While the other person fidgets and fiddles because they are awkward as. This made me react to loud situations with a bit of disdain, since I was always quiet, but if I became loud, it was like a release, so I would get really active, and the girls loved it. So I was always in either a silent mood or a loud active mood, and I don't think people react well to inconsistency.

But as you grow up and go through adolescence, you rebel against your parents, it's only natural. I never rebelled against my Dad because he never gave me a reason to, and I still love him. I rebelled against my step mum because goddamn did she give me reasons to. Once you rebel, you get to know yourself and your own nuances better, and develop your own personality traits. Once the rebel stage is over you are pretty much as you will be for the rest of your life, save a few more experiences (near death, grief, having a kid).

We also moved around alot, so I got a good chance to meet a hell of a lot of people and mak a hell of a lot of friends. I was shown a lot of social situations and archetypes so that now I am pretty comfortable in most settings, till it came to actively seeking a girl. I had always just flirted with them normally and they had come flocking. But after leaving school and moving away, cutting all ties, it was all of a sudden a lot harder to meet girls, let alone court and fuck them.

I am always kinda thinking of how I can raise my kids so that they are naturals. I think it involves allowing them to make alot of their own decisions, like what to wear and what to eat, and they can learn from their mistakes, rather than me saying no and they never know what would have been. Also, I'll get a copy of the MM and give it to them when they first start showing signs of puberty. That should set them up pretty good. Unless they don't need it.

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It is only in your failures that you have any chance of success