As I'm new here, I thought I'd stick them all together, I'm from South Wales in the UK, in a small town, so I haven’t sarged in real life yet, all my pick ups happen off the internet first, then move into real life.

So, first k-close came from an off chat on facebook im June 29th. 18 year old HB 7 "for an indie girl", ims me, basic chat, how are you? etc etc. Then she drops an IOI that she’s single now, and her boyfriend was a weird guy, who looked through her texts while she was sleeping etc. I keep the chat impartial saying, you can't be too careful who you meet off the net, there are alto of weird people.

She asks what I was doing later, so I say not much, I ask the same, same answer. So I suggest I come down and meet her, as she lives like 15 mins away without any traffic. She agrees, so I say ok give me your number and I'll text you when I'm leaving, she acts surprised and says she though I was kidding, finally gives me her number and postcode to sat nav.

Drive to her house, pick her up and drive a minute into town, and she suggests going to a pub, so we go in, we both have cokes, and I make sure to sit on a big sofa so we would be sat side by side.

She sits next to me as planned, payer for my drink, and firmly puts her leg next to mine, so we chat, plenty of eye contact, hand gestures, smiling, a few stories of high value, she talks about her bro and her family, a few stories about her town, she touches my leg for a fleeting second, then takes it away like she did something wrong, so I just smile at her, she has short hair, so I run my fingers up the back of her hair and just say you're hair is short isn’t it.

We leave the pub, walk back to some local park, and stand in this undercover stage talking, she puts her back against the railings, a sign to move in, so I stand close, and put her head to the side of hers, looking at the field, bring it back brushing her face looking into her eyes and we start to kiss, for a long time, I was biting her neck and she just went silent, then when I stopped she let out a o0o0oo0o0o and a heavy breath. I was getting fed up at this point, so I started doing things like, putting my leg between her legs and gently rubbing my knee up her crotch once, touching her boobs over clothes, saying "wheres' your nipples then pulling her top open and looking, she did say I should slap you for that, but I wont and kissed me.

I took her home, went home, but it doesn’t end there with her. In between with just a few fleeting msn convos, and her texting me "=Pxxxx" and without me replying. I was on msn Sunday the 5th of June, and I sent her a msn..

Me : What are you upto?

Her: Nothing, why?

Me: Fancy coming out in the car?

Her: Are you horny?

Me: Very

Her: Ohhhh

Me: I'll be down in a bit then, wear a skirt!

Her: Ok text me when you're outside.

So I go down, pick her up, she’s wearing a skirt, she doesn’t look as hot as the first time I met her. We park up, outside this electricity grid place, pitch black.

I tell her to get in the back, I follow, we start kissing, she sits on me, wants to fuck without a condom, I say no way, and she says well can I say hello before you put it on, be my guest, she gives a pretty good blowjob, I usually don’t feel anything, but this one was pretty decent. I put the condom on, she takes off her knickers, sits on me, takes a while she’s really tight. When it was over, she says okay you're good, sits down and says she cant stop shaking, we sit there, I try and make small talk to keep her happy for a few mins, then start saying I can hear things to freak her out, so I can take her home. Took her home, she says she doesn’t know how she’s going to explain the love bite on her neck, but she doesn’t care, as it felt great. On the way home she texts =P xxxx again, I don’t reply. Had some sparse convo on msn again, her saying her parents are away all next week, and she just got lingerie through from Anne summers.

Lay #2 21 year old came from OKCupid. I never used the site really, but sent out a few emails the other week, only 2 replied, this girl was one. She doesn’t look that good in her facebook pics, so I lose some interest which prob made her think she had to work harder. I meet her 30th June for a drink, we go to the place, some little drinking spot, with lots of sofas, and beds and stuff, full of hot Italian women. This girl looked a lot better in real life her pics I would have said hb 5.5 but in real life a solid 8. Perfect model body, even her feet looked well kept, tanned, pretty face.

She's really nervy and quiet, so I buy her a southern comfort and lemonade, I have a coke. We fluff talk a lot, then I start talking about her tiffany jewellery and she perks up, and says they are from the people that love her. I put out some Kino, touching her leg, softly knocking my leg into hers, complimenting her on her nails then having her rub her nails on my forearm by just saying "what would they fell like on there?". I put my arm around her and she leans into me easily. We end up holding hands and shes rubbing my fingers.

I suggest we go back to hers to watch a film, she agrees, we go outside, and she wants a cigarette, I say well I'm kissing you before you do. She goes to light her fag while laughing, I take it out her mouth, she says !OI! like shes annoyed, I grab her, we start kissing for like 10 seconds, she takes her fag back, lights it, and grabs my hand.

We go back to hers, she puts music on, we chat a little, she lays on the bed with me, we kiss a bit, I kiss her neck, she flakes, so I pull back a bit, we kiss some more, I kiss her stomach, she flakes, kiss again, I put her leg over my shoulder, she was wearing jean shorts, and I kiss the back of her leg, she goes to stop me, then gives in, then when I kiss near her crotch she flakes.

She then tells a story about how she doesn’t want to sleep with me as she doesn’t want to be that girl anymore, so I play like I understand, but its obvious if we meet again, its happening.

So I meet her again, this past Saturday, we go out and play pool, Kino from the get go, no resistance on anything, she had a very loose dress on, I put my hand through the sleeve and was walking down the street stroking her lower back, we have a few drinks, go back to hers, she puts the ring on, I like to take my time, so we lay there stroking each other, she has her hand just below my navel, I'm stroking her arms, she leaves the room, and comes back in her bra and knickers, top model body, all over tan, we start kissing, she undresses me, and its on. When it was over, she was knackered and wanted to sleep, I was still charged from the 2 red bulls I had on the way driving down as I felt down and still up for more, she literally fucked, I say I have to leave as I cant sleep, she says what can I do to make you fall asleep, insinuating blow job, I say nothing, as I just wanted to go home and not wake up with her, so I leave and go home.

Lay #3 22 year old I met the same day as Lay #2, only about an hour and a half before in a different part of the city, This one is off plentyoffish though, and within her adding me on msn, I got her to meet me within 2 hours, by just saying its better than watching eastenders and being bored, and she said she'll risk it for a biscuit, so I say, you can have a rich tea, but you cant have my hob nob yet, she finds that funny gives over her details easy.

We met at a pub, she was already there, when she saw me, she had a look of dread on her face, oh no, she thinks I look too young, goes through my head, which is my usual downfall. HB 7 really pretty face, body looks doughy, wearing a really low cut red top, so I can see the like 60% of each boob and the bra

We sit down, talk, shes really straight laced and not funny, she brings up rugby, so I tell a story about this really fat rugby guy pursing his lips to me one night and wanting a kiss when he was hammered, shes laughing, she relaxes, we talk more. I don’t think its going anywhere, so I suggest I walk her home, to get her isolated from the rest of the pub goes. We walk up the street, she tells me a story about her mate who meets loads of men offline, we get so far and she says if you go any further you wont get back out, as its like a maze.

We stand there, for like 3 seconds, she smiles, looks at me and moves her eyes up, so I give her a hug, she lets go after a few seconds, we look at each other, she looks down, I move closer, we kiss, we stop, she lets out a sigh and says when am I going to see you again, so I just act ambiguous and say well we'll sort it out.

For the remainder of the week, she texts me to meet her everyday for a drink after she finishes work, I make reasons for not wanting too. Then Friday just gone, I was bored and she asked me to come down, so I did, was fairly late, her flat mate was in, but then went to Asda, as soon as she did, Hb 7 lays on me, we start kissing, feeling each other etc, she wants to put on a movie, so I say we'll watch it in your bed room, she puts on her movie, Philadelphia, its hard having sex with that on I tell you.

We start at it, I get her down to her bra and knicks, she has a huge wet spot, she isn’t that good, just laying there, she says it isn’t fair I've still got clothes on, so I tell her well she didn’t take any off me, so she starts. Tells me shes got an implant, I say I'm using a condom, we have sex, I cant feel anything, so I fuck her hard, we both here the friend come in the front door, she doesn’t care headboard if smashing against the wall, we finish. She goes to the loo, I want to leave, so I put my shirt and boxers on, she comes in the room naked still, wraps herself in the bed sheet and hugs upto me. I say I cant stay as my sis needs my car for work in the morning, she says no and wants me to stay, that freaks me out, I say I have too. So I leave, she texts me on the way home, so I'll see you again, or will I see you again, that freaks me out a bit too, too clingy.

Fail

I start talking to this 20 year old model on plentyoffish, typical email, putting down the other members who say the same old thing, you so sexy etc, and a corny/funny opening line, and ask for details. We chat on msn, fluff, then I mention are her legs long as shes 5' 10 or is she proportioned, she says she has long long legs, so I play along saying I love long legs and I'm a leg man, we talk more, she asks me have I ever been in love, I say no, she says that’s a good answer as if I said yes, I would still be in love with them. I ask to meet up, she agrees, gives me her number, she cant do it that day, so we agree 6pm on 2nd July.

We are meeting at a whether spoons for a drink, shes late, then texts shes on her way and an apple J2O for her and shes in a little white dress, so breaking the rules, I get her one and wait, she walks in, hot as could be, an easy 9, tall, slim, long legs, long blonde hair, face like a cherub, she comes upto me, and hugs me, I make sure to site on a sofa and put her drink on the table so she would sit next to me, not across from me. We chat, she talks about her modelling, her friends etc, she says to me relax, I was relaxed, but I noticed her fingers shaking. So she kept stretching out her legs, I say stop trying to seduce me by putting her legs out, she smiles and is a bit tongue tied, so I stroke one, and say aww you put glitter on them for me too, so she touches her leg and says its my moisturiser, so I pick up from that she has long nails, and get her to stroke my forearm with her nails, I do it to her, and she says she doesn’t feel anything.

So we talk more, and I say how big if your hand to mine, then she doesn’t pull her hand away, so we hold hands a bit, then I break hand holding. I put my hand to my side with the palm facing up, and she puts her hand in mine, and starts stroking my hand, I put my arm around her and she leans into me easily, I think I'm in.

I SHOULD have ended it hear, but I was a bit struck by how hot she was, and we agreed to go to a beer garden, but it was miles away, and talking in the car is always crap as you cant concentrate, she tells me about her prefect man, out of like the 20 things she listed, I matched about 8, its getting dark so we get there, its closed, crap. So I say we'll just have a drive and take her back, we fluff a lot, I take her back, and she says its lovely meeting me and gives me a hug, I kiss her on the cheek, she wasn’t going anywhere for the kiss at all, wouldn’t even look at me.

So she gets out, doesn’t look at me in the car and just walks, got a text when I was driving home "Don’t get lost " as she lived in some housing maze. I reply, I'll try not too, had a good time.

She comes on msn the next day, I say back of the neck kiss, as she told me all her sexual fantasies on the date and where she likes being kissed the most other than her lips, that she wasn’t a fan of oral etc etc.

She replied you called, I say something else no reply
So I say something else, no reply. :/

We planned to go out again Sunday, so I text her 2 days later, what should I be expecting to see you wearing Sunday, as she told me she was in a little white dress before. No reply. She comes on msn later that night, no contact, I don’t, she doesn’t.

So I text her the Sunday morning and say I'm going out with my mates as its a lost cause.

Looking back I see my mistakes with that one, making another date on a date, not ending it when I should have, and taking a 9/10 date down to a 5/10 with the drive and mediocre ness of it. Which prob killed it, and too much contact after the date.

So yeah, major long post, but there are 4 in there.

One thing I've noticed with dates, is when I pick them up, and we drive for like 10+ mins to a location, it never tends to work, ever.

But if I've met them and we've driven a minute, or I meet them at a location, it tends to work out alot better, its alot more relaxed, and I get alot alot alot better results than picking someone up, and driving over 10 mins to a location.

Good and really interesting post Millerlite! Enjoyed reading that.

It's very encouraging to see so much success from dating sites. I'm meeting a girl from a site tonight for the first time.

Any tips for the initial meeting would be welcomed (first 5 minutes - how do you want to play this?)!

Also recommendations on the type of place to go. I'm guessing somewhere with a bit of background noise as invariably there's going to a few silences on a first date. I liked your techniques for flirty / fun things to do (nail scratch etc.)

If they are out going and confident it's generally fine otherwise it can become a little laboured if you've got nothing to work from.

I have to admit, I lost my way a bit, after I broke up with my girlfriend a few months ago. Like even the ability to be sexual/cocky/funny with a girl, it was all yes girl, no girl, three bags full girl for a while. But its coming back slowly.

The first few dates I went on, I'd always say, if the girl was a bit tense, I'd say "well nice to meet you then", and stick out my hand for a handshake. Its less invasive than a hug, and sometimes when you hug someone and they don’t hug back, it makes you feel a bit meh.

Tips from girls on the net would be, I would never pick up a girl in my car anymore, then drive over 10 minutes to a place, as its a bit awkward every time, plus there first view of you, is sat down in a car, and apparently I look really short in my car, when I'm 6 foot 1, so I'm starting to realise its not a good idea.

So I'd suggest someplace semi quiet, but will have a few other people in there. My most successful dates came from a harvester, local pubs, restaurants where you don’t eat. And always sit on a sofa, or large chair for two, as if someone is sat opposite you, its a lot more cold I find than if they sit next to you.

I always fluff for a few mins at the start, I never neg, most times I've negged the girl gets really defensive and it usually breaks the rapport I've gotten, like my way of negging the model was playful saying stop stretching out your legs trying to seduce me, and she laughed and played along.

I always do the leg touch, whether its "are these suede or jeans" and touch to see what material they are, have you got fake tan on and touch kind of thing. Then they usually touch their leg themselves then if they have long nails you can comment on nails, and say you love girls with long nails, then ask them to touch your forearm with them. Sometimes they do it and look at you like you're mental, sometimes they enjoy it and other times they dig them in, then you know they are kinky

Plus I always say things on msn to girls before I meet them, like, you have nice full lips and so do I, imagine if they collided it would cause a clap of thunder, just shit like that, or if a girl comments you on your eyes, lips, body whatever, just bring it up, and go with it, a lot of times girls will say I have nice lips, so I always mess around with well now is your chance to see how they feel etc. I always get a girl to hold my hand too, whether its from the nails thing, just put your finger tips on her nails like you're enjoying the feeling and then hold her hand, or do the how big is your hand to mine, or just hold it. I've had girls give me five, grab my hand really hard to say they didn’t want too, then when they come accustomed to holding your hand, and maybe give there finger a few gentle strokes, they start stroking your fingers or palm and they are comfortable with you then.

As for the first five minutes, I'd always do a handshake, or if you're getting a drink gently put your hand on the small of her back like you're guiding her for a second. I never get a kiss in 5 mins, or even her touching me, as I just try and show them I'm a decent guy, just lots of eye contact and smiles, I usually say its a lot different from the net isn’t it, to which girls usually talk about there experiences from guys on the net, and I'd probably playfully flirt with them from a prior convo from msn or something, with the model it was her legs, the other girl it was the hob nob, and the one that flaked a lot in bed, it was that she was so much more tanned than I was, so I was putting my forearms next to hers, and hand to hand etc, just an excuse to touch, nothing too heavy.

I never try and kiss the girl in a pub, or the restaurant or anything like that. As it would perhaps put them on edge with people looking so I always wait. And I usually play the game, you ask me a question and I'll ask you a question but you have to answer honestly. It almost always lands up in sexual questions. I did it with the model, and she asked me what my sexual fantasy was 3 questions in.

If I was honest though, if you can get on with people easily, just being yourself and being friendly, I wouldn’t rely on game too much, just use little bits of pieces here and there, I never knew about it until my mate told me about it a few months back, and I never used it until my past 4 dates, I went on one date, and I didn’t touch a girl once a few months back as she was telling me stories about how she didn’t like touchy feely people, then I read a blog she wrote saying about she met this guy "me" and she thought he was gay as he didn’t come onto her once or show any interest. So that’s what started me off.

If a date is shit, like the girl has nothing to say, I try a few ways to relax her, usually family, her work, or compliment her on her clothes, to get her to talk about something that makes her happy really to calm her down, if that doesn’t work, I do the nail thing, if she wont do it, I have to admit I do give up the ghost a bit.

As a rule, I never try and shag on the first date either, as if I go in with that mentality, I find it never works, sometimes it happens, but most my lays come on day two always, unless I've worked them up enough online that I'm meeting them for sex, but then you have to wonder how many others are they meeting to do the same with :/

I have to admit, Adam and Gambler has changed how I see game, as I started from knowing about the Game, I looked online for Mystery stuff and Style stuff. I used one of styles quirks on the model which she thought it was funny.

How he folds the dollar bill, and keeps saying can you see the eagle, yes, still see it yes. etc, until its folded long ways. I substituted that with the queen’s head.

He then bends it like 2cms in both sides, gets the girl to put her fist out, and puts it on her fist and says like the eagle I can make it fly away. I changed that to the queen flies in many private jets, like the queen, I'll make this fly away.

But you have to say wing wing wing 3 times, so the model said wing wing wing.

And you pick it up "as its shaped like a telephone". And say no you've got the wrong number sorry.

She did fold over laughing at that, but by that time, like 20 mins in I felt comfortable doing it.

I tried styles imagine a white room, put a cube in it thing on a few girls, most of them just said you're strange etc. I don’t like any of mysteries style if I'm honest. But Adam and Gambler did change how I thought about this stuff. And being yourself, being natural and throwing in a bit of game here and there is the key to success I think, well that’s what I've found anyway

Sory for another long answer, but I hope some of it worked, I'm in a rush so no time to calibrate in my head some structure Hope your date goes well.