for the record,
the drugs do help. I was on them, then I went off. I didnt notice a difference until i came off them. We wouldnt second guess a doctor prescribing us a drug for any other illness.. so why do we second guess anti-depressants? ur not a bad person for taking them.

Weird, this thread has become a sort of reflection of my personal journey with depression. Ender, I have started taking the mood stabilizers as they were prescribed (twice a day). I decided last friday that I would Shock and Awe an HB, but was unable not due to fear but an explicable bout of incongruence. I believe that goes beyond fear. That sent me into a bit of a down turn but I still feel pretty good, not as good as when I last posted, but I have felt worse. S&A is pretty heavy stuff and I thought I could do it. I mean, I put a lot of pressure on myself and I think that contributed to the just sort of freeze that I had. I so wanted to but just couldn't. I am in the position Ciaran was when we discovered S&A. I can get numbers but, those digits almost never lead anywhere (only once). So why bother with 'em, Fools Mate game all the way. I must just not be ready for it yet, or rather, the depression is not letting me get to that level. No worries, I will.

_________________
Call me Sly.
My goal: To become a Pickup Artist in everything but name.

And yeah, This is (still) just the beginning.

im not sure what to say, other than I totally know how you feel and I do the same thing.
I sit there, resolved to do something. Or maybe I really want something. or maybe I just think that something SHOULD be a certain way, and when its not, it creates this rediculous anxiety and depression.
My advice right now would be to not judge yourself so much! you are being way too hard on yourself. S&A is really fuking hard! lol. you should be so proud of yourself that you even considered trying it! holy shit, you get numbers? lol. i cant even do that most of the time.
I just try to smile and remind myself, "It is what it is, man." dont judge it. the universe doesnt care you did or didnt successfully S&A a HB the other night. Only you do. and you have a choice. You an be discouraged or you can see it for what it really is: a learning experience. You can literally turn every "bad" situation into a good situation by reframing it in your mind in a positive light as a chance to learn and grow.
Can anyone concisely explain to us whats going on here? I know me and Slie are not the first two dudes to feel this way. How did you deal with the gap between what you think SHOULD be and what actually is? How do you become internally validated, so my selfesteem/worth is based less and less on what others think of me?

Google "TYROSINE." RSD, Real Social Dynamics is really good for your inner game also.

Joe please explain what is to be gained from googling Tyrosine. I think I knew it was an amino acid, but, what do you think I can learn from an amino acid. In the future I will look more at RSD, thanks. For me depression goes way beyond inner game, given it does mess with IG, big time. But, in my case and cases similar to mine, one could have all IG issues sorted out and still be depressed. IG is something I can control, depression is largely out of my control, at least most of the time. Ever since I finished reading How to Have Confidence and Power in Dealing with People by: Les Giblin and began reading The Power of Now by: Eckhart Tolle my IG has improved dramatically.

Ender, your thought process sounds about like mine did 6+ months ago before I started reading The Power of Now. I used to do the same thing but once I read the TPoN, any of those expectations about what stuff should be or should have been, for the most part, just faded away. Seriously, read it and do so with an open mind. I had no idea what it would be. The only info I had was from the reviews I read on amazon.com and they were almost universally positive. Just read it.
-S&A is awesome, I love the philosophy behind it. I have tried the Apocalypse opener just to bring my IG up to congruence with it. The depression has always got in the of my IG in one way or another. As far as numbers go I am hesitant, I would do what you can to bypass just #-closes. Make sure the numbers you get are only after you have kissed her, had sex or your instincts tell you that an emotional connection has been made. Frame this as being a guy who does not give his number that many women, be selective about it, make her earn your digits.
-You are so right, anything negative can be reframed positively. I heard very early on that there are no bad nights sarging because those nights are all about lessons learned. This happened near instantaneously when I sarged while reading The Power of Now.
-A key point of The Power of Now is to always accept the present, if you don't that will create discomfort, anxiety or "pain" as Eckhart Tolle calls it. If your circumstances are not as you would like, accept it as though you had chosen it and just go with it. Never deny the present, always accept it. Making your self-worth/-esteem dependant on nobody but yourself is the sign of a truly confident person. Though I am depressed, my self-esteem is not tied to my depression at all. I accept my depression and that the level my IG can reach is what is for that particular time. My goal is always to change that, and I know that some day, my depression will be no more, but, I do not look longingly towards that moment. I look at every day as a chance to improve myself.

-I highly recommend both books I mentioned earlier. Go buy them at your first opportunity. Good luck.

_________________
Call me Sly.
My goal: To become a Pickup Artist in everything but name.

And yeah, This is (still) just the beginning.

Well taking tyrosine beats taking drugs for your depression. It just increases the amount of dopamine to your brain so you have better focus, and want to get things done---pick up. I don't recommend just taking it as a crutch, but it could help with the depression you have now. Until you get your inner game sorted out this could be an alternative.

Thanks Joe, I will ask my therapist about it. I got about a third of the way through TPoN, then stopped to finish On the Road and the depression really sent me down for a few weeks. I won't say that my IG is categorically sorted out just because I do not really believe in absolutes but TPoN advanced my IG by well, lightyears you could say. Not sorted out altogether but it sure felt like I it was after I read it. I feel just better as a person after reading it, I am just so much more at ease, and more content with life now, which is IG going way beyond the realm of PU.

_________________
Call me Sly.
My goal: To become a Pickup Artist in everything but name.

And yeah, This is (still) just the beginning.