What are you good at?



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 10:26 am 
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Don't get insecure if people here tell you if you are only good at something if you're better than the others
This is the self help BS that really gets under my skin. The definition you're implying is:
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adept: having or showing knowledge and skill and aptitude
Good is relative. Good only exists because there is bad. If you haven't done anything measurable to test your skill, well. . . are you really good? How do you know? Because your mommy said so?

Did you know 93% of US drivers consider themselves in the top 50% of drivers. Or that 68% of teachers at the University of Nebraska thought they were in the top 25% of teachers. Or 87% of those masters of the universe at Stanford MBA school rated themselves as being in the top 50% of their class. Or 85% of people think they are in the top 50% for leadership ability. In case you're good at statistics without taking a test on statistics, being in the top 50% is better than average, or "good".

That's the point. You can tell yourself you're "good" all day. . . or you can pick something and actually get "good" at it. Or you can rationalize that someone will always be better to protect your fragile self esteem from the failure of trying and the eventual revelation you're in the bottom 50%. Or maybe you can be good at being delusional.

The technical term is called illusory superiority, in case you want to become more self aware.
This is were the PU community dissapoints me or you have missed the point.

This is an example I see happening with guys who learn PU and who don't have the right inner game. He learns about being alfa male. The alfa male is confident, a leader, is good at anything, and such. He is going to think about alfa males they know in their life or from films. He sees that those alfa males attract a lot of chicks. He thinks "damn, I got to be like that too!"
And so he changes his behavior. He activly act like a "confident" douche, always want to have the last word, win every conversation, always want to lead, lears to play guitare because he thinks it's a chick magnet ...
Then he goes out. Sometimes it goes well, scores a number or two, has a k-close, and more often, he gets blown out. Then he see a natural, not particulary an alfa or the high schools jock, and he seduces some hot chicks.
Now the pseudo alfa male, he thinks "why does that natural get the chicks so easily? I learned all this stuff, I'm alfa, I look good, he's ugly and afc and doesn't know the tricks, he doesn't have game!".
And so he gets frustrated. But he is trying to hide it by doing like he's confident and doesnt care. He is overcompensating. Meanwhile, he adapted some more extreme alfa male principles: "there are either alfa males or losers","I think this is cool because alfas are supposed to find that cool, and that is stupid because alfas are supposed to find it stupid", every action which is not directly alfa is considered to be a loser action, and he always wants to win: winning is for alfas, losing is for losers, and he gets highly frustrated if he loses a football (soccer) game even if he did well. He get's even more frustrated if he doesn't play well that day because the hard thruth arrives: he maybe isn't as good as he always want to tell himself, or want to be.
And in the end, he became good at playing guitare. He learned it himself. Maybe watched some youtube films, but he didn't look much at others to be better. He didn't take classes for it. He didn't have the need to be better than anyone else. The only thing he maybe realy wanted was to learn guitare and some popular songs so he could impress some girls when coming over to his house. And yet he became good.
But in the end, his frustrations, overcompensated by his alfa attitudes, didn't lead to him bringing girls home to whom he played guitare. He hasn't played guitare for any chick yet.

The only thing for him is to start accepting things: he maybe isn't that good, they're other people who will always be better, and it's ok, you can't help it. Maybe it's better to release the pressure from him and to start all over again. Don't look at what other people do, only about yourself. Do what suits you best. He must remove all his negativity and start being positive, but he can't. He sees positivity for losers who lie to themselfs.
But although deep inside he knows he sucks, his alfa mentality says "no! I'm not accepting that I lost. That's for losers. And I'm alfa I'm a winner. I never give up"

I used to be like that too. Fortunatly, by learning more inner game, by self acceptance, I got over this and I don't pretend anymore to be the alfa male. Unfortunatly, I have seen this also happening with friends. Some who dealt better with it and some who unfortunatly still didn't.

Realy, look at yourself. And yeah you should have watched television or other people sometimes to be able to set the standards of what is supposed to be good or able to know that you're not good on you're first day. But after that, you should set the goals and standards for yourself. You might be a very good football player, having made 5 goals in 3 games, but even then there might be 1 or 2 guys who play better in the team. You can be very good internaly, but there will always be external factors, factors on which you don't have a grip on, why you can't be the best. Look at the internal factors, not at the external factors.

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You CAN make a change.
You WILL make a change.

Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 2:30 pm 
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Inner Game in PU is the karate of the 80's.

Most of you are too young to remember the 80's. The Japanese economic boom in the early 80's also influenced a Worldwide growth of their culture. This was evident in architecture, cuisine, business practices, education, fashion, and yes, TV shows . . .

So here's the line that still makes me chuckle to this very day. Regardless of the genre, every show in the 80's featured some weirdo fanning his hands out in front of him screaming, "I KNOW KARATE!" - What does this mean? Here's a guy wearing a lounge suit or a plaid jacket . . .probably has never seen the inside of a gym, let alone a dojo, screaming "I KNOW KARATE! I KNOW IT!" - These days, you'll still hear this line once in a while for satirical use in comedy.

Now . . . I see "Inner Game" in this forum often. "I studied inner game", "I know inner game," "I'm working on inner game," . . . LOL . . . but EVERYTHIHNG that most of you write suggest that the only "inner game" that you've studied is the reading and writing of the words "INNER GAME".

Guys, stop tossing the "inner game" phrases around like you're chatting about your last game on Xbox. It's somewhat disrespectful and really, pretty freakin embarrassing for YOURSELF. It is about as retarded as tossing on a lounge suit and running around your city telling everybody that you know karate.

On the other hand, if you really want to 'study' inner game, why not take some steps and actually study it? There's a lot more to this than 'believing in myself and accepting myself, durh, hur, hur . . ."

Hobbit, how about creating a sticky for 'inner game' resources? Books, links, etc . . . By the way, I didn't you were old enough to know "Alf". I swear . . . there's got to be an episode of the Alfmeister doing Karate.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:09 pm 
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Never heard of wheelchair basket all chief? Google it.

What makes good though, people tell me I am good at lots of things (and I don't mean people like the mum of a 200lb whale lol). The thing is, when you ARE good at things (as in generally good at things you try) you have to stop judging yourself on what your better than most at.
For example, I was a straight A student. In a few of those subjects I would say I am just good at- not great. Now, compared to the majority I am great, but to my standards I am only good. This to me is more important once you get good as it can then become easy to rest on your above average status. The good example is if you are the best getting 90% in a test you shouldnt settle for that.
Being a big fish in a small pond is only great until you get put in deeper water ;)


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 4:25 pm 
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the topic is about being good, not the best
Well then? What's your point? Then you do agree with me.
Then it's this what you should critisize:
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And although I'm not sure if this is what Chief had in mind, 'being good' at something means that you are BETTER than others. All of this wishy washy, in your head stuff, "I'm really good and I know it," is about as impressive as a mom complimenting her 200 lb daughter's attractive qualities.

If you ARE good, you are a Gold medalist in the "State Chemistry Championships"
If you ARE good, then your band won the Holiday "Battle of the Bands".
If you ARE good, then you are on the Dean's List.
If you ARE good, you'd be competing in the xBox World Championships.
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And also, it seems you're a high school student.
Hahaha, lol, like what makes you say that I'm a high scool dude? You realy think you know everything? Then I have to dissapoint you. Apperently then judging people is something you're not realy good at.
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but I'm cooler than that!
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This is why high schoolers shouldn't learn PUA.
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In a few years, you'll understand.
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stop tossing the "inner game" phrases around like you're chatting about your last game on Xbox.
Now if you realy are the ("inner game") experts as you see yourselfs, can you then explain what this confidence thing which is always emphasized has to do with arrogance? If you guys are soooo grown up, long out of this "high school" period, then why acting so childish? It's not like anyone else less experienced in your eyes is immediatly a noob. And if it frustrates (frustration, yeah, where does that come from?) you so much that so many noobs are around here, what are you still doing here? You could have been picking up a girl somewhere else.

I could have give you negative rep, for a few seconds I realy felt like it because the arrogance I sometimes find here sickens me, but then I changed my mind because, you know,
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I'm cooler than that!

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You WANT to make a change.
You CAN make a change.
You WILL make a change.

Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 6:24 pm 
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In the real world your critics/ bosses are the only ones you can rely on to tell you if your good or not -( people who dont have anything to lose by giving their honest opinion ) and if you aint got any complaints then your not doing too badly! But to find out if your GOOD at something - apart from test results and all that shit - I think it depends on how long youve been doing something compared to someone who is good and been doing it for there whole life and them saying if your good or not. Tricky ego ridden shit.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 7:40 pm 
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Why is it that these threads always end up being hijacked and and turned into a discussion about inner game and one poster's supposed 'value' and superior understanding?

The point of this thread has long been made. Talent is relative. You are talented at something compared to those who are not talented at something. If everybody was born a basketball all-star, well, then nobody would be basketball all-stars. In that case, the people who were 'good' would be those who excelled beyond that.

But this is straying far from both pick up and the purpose of this thread.

Get good at something. Cultivate your talents. If you enjoy something, if you have a natural inclination to something (anything), take the time to get really good at it.

Be the guy who can pick up a guitar and play Through the Fire and Flames, be the guy who can pick up a Rubik's cube and solve it in 10 seconds, be the guy who can sink three pointers at will.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 8:41 pm 
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It's funny the first thing you do when someone disagrees with you is "I'm going to negative rep him. . . ha ha! That'll show 'em!" I couldn't even tell you how much "rep" I have without looking. Who cares?
First of all, it was sarcastic (I have never given neg rep before and I'm not realy planing to). Secondly, it has nothing to do with "disagreement", (you may disagree with me as much as you like), but more with attitude, which I saw as arrogant. From some others, I'm used to their behavior, but not from yours. I tought of you as 1 of the chillest moderators on the forum, and thus I was dissapointed.
If you have anything to add about this matter, then PM me instead of us having to bash this thread further.

Further, to contribute to the topic, I find that you don't have to be an athlete, or a lead singer, the guitare hero, or whatever (not saying that being so wouldn't be nice). We like to hear succes stories about people who went from zero to hero because it inspires us. Truth is, it's the best that we don't focus too much on things you're naturaly not good at, because it only works in some occasions. However, as Sharplin said, I do find it very important that you develop your talents, your natural gifts, and that you do something with and build further on it. Compare it to nature-nurture: nature gave you a talent now you only got to nurture it.

For example: you're unbeatable in discussions, no matter you're right or wrong, and that in addition you're also very smart, start thinking about becoming a lawyer. Or if you're creative and like cooking, become better at it, and invite your friends over while letting them try out a new recipe and surprise them.

Ofcourse you always got to try something out first before you can see you're naturaly gifted for something or not.

_________________
You WANT to make a change.
You CAN make a change.
You WILL make a change.

Ambitious to be succesfull => Shyler


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 10:29 pm 
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Remember that text is going to be how you make your first impression over the internet; if every third word you type is misspelled, people will automatically assume that you're a moron. Even if the public school system fails you, there are browsers that come with spellcheck built-in.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 11:05 pm 
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Is this not meant to be about being a community?

Its fine to have differences of opinion, and to debate them... but to openly just have a pop at hobbit like that was kinda un-needed. Perhaps you disagreed wih him, but the point of this thread was not 'who can win in a bttle of wits'.... This was, I suspect, meant to be a light hearted topic.

No need to spoil it =]


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:00 am 
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This was, I suspect, meant to be a light hearted topic.
Have you SEEN my other threads? lol


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 9:14 am 
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In the real world your critics/ bosses are the only ones you can rely on to tell you if your good or not -( people who dont have anything to lose by giving their honest opinion ) and if you aint got any complaints then your not doing too badly! But to find out if your GOOD at something - apart from test results and all that shit - I think it depends on how long youve been doing something compared to someone who is good and been doing it for there whole life and them saying if your good or not. Tricky ego ridden shit.
I'm going to hijack my own thread here for a second to gather some honest opinions.

I'm tired of getting compliments all the time for my music from girls just because they like me or guys just because they want to suck up to me, with little to no constructive criticism. The only clue I get of people thinking my music is potentially unsatisfactory is if nobody says anything, and that's really not a reliable source of information. If anyone can give me some honest feedback for my shit I'd probably be able to use it! Thanks in advance.

My soundcloud: www.soundcloud.com/michaelnoname
My youtube: www.youtube.com/michaelnoname


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:25 pm 
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To be on track; I'll use the one area of this that I have alot of experience with.

In the Martial arts world there is a big argument going on between the martial arts that compete in tournaments and fight often for the entertainment of a crowd and the martial arts who discourage not only comeptition but also "sparring" (play fighting) in general.

The non-competitors LOVE to play on stereotypes and portray the competitive fighters as ego-maniacs who are searching for validation by dominating others.

"All the while (and here's the kicker) they think to themselves. "Look at those pathetic comeptition fighters needing to prove themselves, I don't need validation, I don't have that kind of ego, I'm so much more self secure than those immature assholes."

Truth is in competition you put your ass on the line; when you put yourself in a situation where others can demonstrate better skill than you, on a long enough time line you will get a "reality check". Competitive fighters are well aware they are one bad fight away from being dethroned. Great tennis players have lost plenty of matches, and they are still aware that then can lose again.

Our martial arts man who doesn't spar, or tennis coach who doesn't compete and never plays tennis with his students can sit surrounded by people who idolise and look up to him. Safe in the knowledge that no-one will ever turn up and tread on his pipe dream.

It may seem counter-intuitive at first but...
Not engaging in competitve activities is a brilliant way to protect and inflate your ego.


----
For those arguing for "I judge myself by myself"

You walk into an electronics store and are looking to buy a coffee machine.

One machine can make an espressio in 15 minutes and it tastes kinda crappy.
The other machine makes 6 different types of coffee and in under a minute, not only that but the coffee tastes better than you have ever tasted.
The last machine makes 12 different kinds of coffee in under 30 seconds, and is similarly some of the best coffee you have ever tasted, AND the machine washes and cleans ITSELF.

You tell the store clerk there is no way you will buy the first machine, which is also the most expensive (why would you?).

The clerk turns to you and says, "good is tottaly subjective, that coffee machine while making shit coffee in only one form in 15 minutes and costing a horrendous sum of money... is good in its own way"

Are you honestly telling me you would be convinced by this sales pitch?

Things and people are good in bad depending on context. The context of good and bad is usually your ranking compared to everyone else.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 5:38 pm 
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I'm going to hijack my own thread here for a second to gather some honest opinions.

I'm tired of getting compliments all the time for my music from girls just because they like me or guys just because they want to suck up to me, with little to no constructive criticism. The only clue I get of people thinking my music is potentially unsatisfactory is if nobody says anything, and that's really not a reliable source of information. If anyone can give me some honest feedback for my shit I'd probably be able to use it! Thanks in advance.
I can't speak from the side of a technical musician, so I'll speak from the side of an artist.

I only watched the Cure video since I'm most familiar with that song. From what I saw it seemed to me that you were just reciting the song and didn't seem that into the song. Guitarwork and singing were good, but the spirit wasn't there.

Back on topic, I believe that I am good at the following:
-Spelling
-Computer programming
-Watching and talking about horror movies
-Psychoanalyzing people
-Marvel vs. Capcom 2
-League of Legends

Just because I'm good at something doesn't mean I enjoy doing it. I HATE computer programming. Nowadays I get so distracted that I have trouble finishing what I started.

Speaking of horror films, I noticed something while I was checking out videos yesterday. Look at this:

Image

Image

First, horror star David Hess most famous for his role as Krug in Wes Craven's 1972 Last House on the Left. For the sake of the discussion, also refer to him in Ruggero Deodato's House on the Edge of the Park.

Second, NLP enthusiast Ross Jeffries. Notorious for being creepy.

My point?

MY GOD THEY LOOK THE SAME. I CAN SEE ROSS BEING THE CHARACTERS DAVID HESS PLAY. HIDE YO KIDS, HIDE YO WIFE!

That is all.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 8:15 pm 
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As we are all talking about the subject of "talent" here I'm going to give my input.

There is absolutely no such thing as talent or natural ability (excluding activities fully relying on genetical potential, such as athletics)

It has been proven that all things, excluding the aformentioned, can be mastered. The reason why world class sportsmen are world class is not because they are gifted or genetically an anomally but because they have practiced for longer than everyone else. It is simple psychology as to why when we look at someone such as Roger Federer and think to ourselves, "He is special" and "He was born to play tennis": we are only seeing the end product and not the hours of training put in. It has been scientifically proven that we all progress with our skills sets at the same rate and whats sets us apart is the quality and quantity of the training. Nobody was born with better skills than everyone else, we learn them.

And this is where I completely disagree with kasabi's assumption that after 20 you cannot get good at something, and you cannot change your personality. Sure you need to be motivated, but if you want to get good at something or change your personality you are motivated, right? All social skill sets and features of your personality such as being charismatic are just like any other skills and can be improved accordingly. (If you forced someone in a room on their own for 20 years, would they be charismatic? No. If someone was placed into hollywood superstardom would they be charismatic? Eventually, yes.)

So basically, what I am saying is quit bitching about not being a "natural" at something and not learning a language because your not a natural linguist or are too old. Bullshit. Anything can be mastered with practice. You just need to start.



Nick G


PS I strongly recommend that everyone should read BOUNCE which will completely change all of your views on the limits of yourself and humanity. Thats what it did for me! :D

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Impossible is just a big word thrown around by small people - Muhammad Ali


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 1:16 pm 
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As we are all talking about the subject of "talent" here I'm going to give my input.

There is absolutely no such thing as talent or natural ability (excluding activities fully relying on genetical potential, such as athletics)

It has been proven that all things, excluding the aformentioned, can be mastered. The reason why world class sportsmen are world class is not because they are gifted or genetically an anomally but because they have practiced for longer than everyone else. It is simple psychology as to why when we look at someone such as Roger Federer and think to ourselves, "He is special" and "He was born to play tennis": we are only seeing the end product and not the hours of training put in. It has been scientifically proven that we all progress with our skills sets at the same rate and whats sets us apart is the quality and quantity of the training. Nobody was born with better skills than everyone else, we learn them.

And this is where I completely disagree with kasabi's assumption that after 20 you cannot get good at something, and you cannot change your personality. Sure you need to be motivated, but if you want to get good at something or change your personality you are motivated, right? All social skill sets and features of your personality such as being charismatic are just like any other skills and can be improved accordingly. (If you forced someone in a room on their own for 20 years, would they be charismatic? No. If someone was placed into hollywood superstardom would they be charismatic? Eventually, yes.)

So basically, what I am saying is quit bitching about not being a "natural" at something and not learning a language because your not a natural linguist or are too old. Bullshit. Anything can be mastered with practice. You just need to start.



Nick G


PS I strongly recommend that everyone should read BOUNCE which will completely change all of your views on the limits of yourself and humanity. Thats what it did for me! :D
Why are there so few 5ft basketball players?

Of course work will take you a long way, but to deny that both situation and genetics have no roll is deluding yourself and sets yourself up for some big dis-appointing fails in life.

BTW: Psychology likes to think of itself as an inductive science nowadays, and would appreciate it if people stopped using the word "Proven" which should not be utttered in serious scientific discussion (the preffered phrase is, "there is evidence that suggests").

I don't mean to be picky but as a psych student It's my pet peeve when people just refer to psychology like some whore which doesn't need referencing or evidence to be used for a claim.


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