I learned a lot on these boards through people, who posted their thoughts or even their personal problems. I have never written anything here, but this one thing has been bothering me really and maybe my post even helps other people, so here I go...
I got like 2,5 years experience with PU. A lot of knowledge about seduction came from theory, although I am not able to apply everything in field, I am getting there - yet one thing has always troubled me and with every new seduction I am struggling with the same thing over and over: What is persistency?

Getting numbers is easy once you get the courage to ask. Setting up a meeting can be as easy, when you did things the right way when meeting her initially or asking her out the right manner. Where I am always struggling is how to keep it rolling. I get her number, I meet her and even if it all went well, there is silence. Only after a looong time I hear from here eventually. However, there is some kind of echo: I write her, she writes back. I do not write, she does not write either. She asks me something complicated via text and I ask her to call me on this matter -> she does not. I am asking her out again, I get another date. She is always mirroring the same amount of energy, that I am putting in her (she does not call me, even if I ask her to, she texts back with some lame excuse). In 99% of the cases this leads to nothing and is truly frustrating. And I am not talking about this „one“ girl. This happened about seven times last month and the month before that several times and the month before that...
Now on the other hand in a few rare cases things just seem to work out magically. First date, we make out, she calls me, we spend a great time together and things just work out... Or I have a first date with her and meet her some weeks later at a club and we have a great time and things work out.

Now, what is persistency? I read it a lot in dating books: be persistent. It seems like I have not understood this concept at all. Because everytime I was being persistent, it brought me nothing but worries and even seems to make things only worse. And what do I mean by being persistent? To continue the seduction! For me being persistent does not mean to text her 24/7 or to try to setup a meeting as soon as possible. I always try to appear busy. I just want to meet her again and try not to get in touch with her too often, but still be persistent. But again: Persistency did not get me anywhere... It just seems to put me into a weak position of neediness.

Where am I going wrong? What am I doing wrong? What is Persistency?

Someone correct me if im wrong but this is a numbers game. In order to find someone you have to play the odds. Prepare yourself for failure 90% of the time. Most relationships do not work out otherwise there would be no one here.

I personally am very impatient and I feel that many times I am too persistant. I have rules you know but after a point I know that I become frustrated... If I can call a girl to do something but she never calls me... Well I think you get my point. When I realize this I think to myself screw it! Its either not going to work out (more than likely) or I need to turn up the heat and get this girl involved in my life.

But has being persistent ever paid off for you?

I think Pick Up is only partly a numbers game. In some ways PU often reminds me of Texas Hold'em. Being lucky is a key factor, but with good skills you can win even without luck (a bad hand). However, sometimes even my best game is useless because my opponents just have plain better hands...

First of all, "persistency" isn't even a word. Persistence, on the other hand, is an invaluable tool that will get you laid as long as you combine it with calibration.

You must also be persistent for the right reasons. If you are persisting out of neediness or ego-gratification, it'll dry up any vagina faster than Mystery DHVing himself.

If you persist out of sheer and honest sexual desire, however, it's going to make her feel like she's in some sort of romantic Disney movie with sex at the end.

Here are a couple of LRs where persistence was key:
One from me: fr-persistence-and-honesty-now-lr-vt22137.html
One from ace_of_spades: ljbf-lmr-lr-toughest-sarge-thusfar-vt24143.html

Persistence in my opinion is about the actual pick up not the follow up, it means if you go up to a set and they are cold or outright rude you plough and carry on. As for how useful it is it is huge, most women are sweet once you get past the bitchy evil top layers.

As for it working for me here is the epitome of persistence;

41. Glory, the only way to describe the orchestration and work that went into this interaction. I will start at the start, roughly 9 months ago I spotted a girl in 13, she stood out not sure why she just had an aura/presence. So after a couple of random interactions I started to figure her out. She is a shit test onion, layer after layer after layer of shit tests and has no problem in walking off as soon as you fail one. So this time I opened her 3 times in one night the first time it was a strange mutual opening (both kinda opened each other at the same time), small talk ensued it broke off. Next one I was walking and she walked past I went in ballsy " are you stalking me or something?", she said she was going for a pee and said she could see my nipples. So started unbuttoning my shirt, (shit test) I played along (failed). She walked off. The final time of the night, she walked out of the club and walked by, I asked her whether I should have porridge or shredded wheat when I got in. We bantered about that for a while then I started escalating the conversation, that continued for a while again she unbuttoned my shirt and started some kino. She then said she had to head home (I was walking her to the bus), I asked if she fancied coming back to mine she said she would but had to be up early (probably based in some truth). I could have pushed for some sort of close but didn't feel the need. The interaction ended well and when I re-open it is on.


So sure enough when I see her again in another few months it's on again hehehe slowly getting there inch by inch.

I say forget about persistence for now. Are your intentions honest? Cos dishonest intentions can lead to some fucked up things. Even if you're a good conversationalist, friendly and interesting, if there's no sexual attraction in the interaction you're gonna run into problems. Make it clear from the get go that you're excited by and like this girl. Create that spark.

Everything else comes from that. This ''echoing'' you mention could be a sign that the girl thinks ''wow, we're friends and he's nice, but he keeps messaging me so he might want something more from me... but i can't call him out on it because he hasn't said anything to prove it... i'll try not make it awkward so i'll just play along.'' As you can see, everyone loses: you end up frustrated and she gets stressed.

Try not to be approval seeking. Do things for you, get what you want, and get it in style. Let her know that you're into her. She'll most probably like that, even if she might not admit it out loud at first.

...and that's where the persistence comes in.

sounds to me its a combination of not conveying the right message and being boring?

I don't think persistence is really the issue...... if you keep hammering the way you are they'll prolli get annoyed.

its good your out getting numbers and meetings.. personally i find THAT to be the hardest part... once u get the first meeting this part and beyond is the easiest~

i think you and prolli a lot of guys do it.. when they "get" the first meeting after the pick up they immediately assume "ok she likes me". Then they go and assume being there is enough to close and keep interest.... its not...... not at all...

i donno what ur home situation is like... more than not I usually manage first meeting at my house.... im good at building comfort and trust early... if not then at a coffee shop or bar near my house and lead it back there later..even meet at my place first and leave from there. i have a nice open place with a projector and a pool, bar.. etc..... i also mention my adorable little three legged goldfish....its crazy! etc...

if u have to meet them somewhere... do it.. but dont talk too much ... let them talk more.. if u have to write down 20 things you can say to spark discussion like:

man when i was a kid i was sucha brat... i used to run away from home alll the time.. u seem like you were the perfect little goody goody princess....

then let her ramble about herself.... and keep doing that.. if she asks about you... keep interesting.. maybe quick story about it and swing it back to her. let her talk .. keep saying things to spark her to say more.. dont give her things she can say yes or no too...if she does give a one word answer grill her.. say "wow.. EXCITING childhood.. hope u learned to tame urself" sarcastically.... to make her elaborate....(and prove shes more exciting)

make fun of some things she says... "really? a tom boy? wow i pictured you as the all in pink frilly little dresses, cant wait to get makeup kinda girl.... did u play with ninja turtles then too? "

just stupid stuff .. dont go all deep about anything just yet unless asked about it... even then .. keep the answers short... girls like to ask why u dont have a gf.. or why u just broke up... say something like "she was really boring in bed.... no no she was just so jealous and worried all the time. says i was too flirty? .. meh .. i think girls are just too flirty"

then let her give her opinion on that... etc.....after a bit... you can do some more playful things like palm reading is fun.... get in close to her... look up some little things u can do to play around.. so shes having fun.. telling you lots (investing time) and gets comfortable and trusting but u answer short to keep the interest.... then when u think uv done enuff... say "lets get outta here" .... if u left from ur place.. great. walk back and dont invite her in... just say "aright come on in for a few mins. u might as well get the tour and meet my goldfish... he doesnt say much at first..but get a few drinks in him and..."

if at the bar/coffee shop and leaving and she dont wanna seperate. or seems like she wants to do something else.... SUGGEST.. dont ask.. suggest you go to ur place.. check out ur whatever.. meet ur goldfish... etc..

"well.. i dont like the theatre(really dont) cuz of all the kids. plus we cant talk its not comfortable... so we should just go to my place. watch some movies... sides you HAVE to meet my goldfish. hes awesome... .ur not allergic are you?... u know where blah blah st is...(its right around the corner.. if its a trek...she wont go)"

and see... if she bails. she might say "well its late. i can meet him next time...."
feel it out.. and see if u should push or just say "cool." and next time have her come straight to ur place.... im not gonna write about what to do at ur place this post is long enuff..

good luck.

and no one grill me on tactics here. everything i tell them(women) is TRUE and honest, unless said sarcastically and obvious... i dont trick or play anyone.... so i dont need a lecture....

PS: i dont have any fish.. i do have pets tho...


oh and altho setting up the meetin can be easy.. you might have urself as being considered a friend to her... non sexual friend... and it might be good to not bother at least for a few months... outta nowhere down the line say "heY!" and start over... if none of that helps u then... meh.

Being persistant doing shit that is not working is a waste. If you are going to be persistant, be persistant and flexible.

You admit that you feel the energy level dropping in these situations. That's a girls way of telling you "Hey, I'm bored". So either change the energy level or quit wasting your time. You are getting this because you are close with PUA, but not yet there.

So keep in mind, you have to get better at what you're doing. WHat you're doing is not working.

I've run into the same things and am working out some new strategies for the recovery. The recovery has to increase energy in the relationship and get her more involved with persuing you. Here's one.

If you see things dieing and know they are going to fucking die, I go nuclear. I tell her I am breaking up with her. This has got to be done correctly or it will be AFC. It's sort of extreme, but if the fuckers dieing anyways, why not?

The breakup has to be cool,,, maybe even C/F and not hurt feelings
It has to demonstrate increased value for you.
It has to build value for her so she will still want to still see you.
It's sort of a neg. It gently lowers her confidence and puts you at a higher level.

Think about some HB who broke up with you and let you off easy and how that built even more attraction. A woman getting dumped is a huge emotional event. Adding emotion can change the flat-line status or things.


I've used it very successfully in the past. It really changes the vibe. But it will not work unless you come in with a brand new vibe. You always want to be coming in with less than she is giving you. Keep her chasing or it will be AFC.

In the end, for me it's better energy to my game to dump chicks who do not perfrom, instead of AFC hanging on.

Cheers