Ok, sorry for the length of this post, but I need to get this out there and I would love you guys’ input. I have known this HB9 for about 5 or so years as she is a friend of my sister’s. Recently though, we began partying together – by that I mean we meet up at the bars occasionally and there is usually mutual friends present, so it’s not just the 2 of us. I am really into this girl as she is not a typical girl, she comes from a foreign family and she is very smart and just generally pleasant to be around. She loves to have a good time, too and will drink all night with the best of ‘em. She almost seems above the typical PUA tactics – almost as though they don’t apply to her. When we see each other at the bars, we kind of get in our own little world and talk to only each other and lightly flirt. The fact that she mainly talks to me is an IOI in itself so I have tried escalating a little bit. I am good about kino, I am an attractive man according to many women, I am confident and enjoy using Cocky-Funny tactics and have had success in doing so. However, with her, I just cant seem to break through. She does not come off at all as being sexual or interested in having a bf (or even a fuck buddy). It’s throwing a wrench in my game and now I feel like since we have seen each other a lot lately and I have not been able to even kiss close, I feel like I will be LJBF’d.

Recently, I was LJBF’d from another hb9 I was trying to fuck because she knew I only wanted to fuck, and she wants a marriage material BF – not me and I was honest about it, and it screwed me. So, because of that incident, I think I have a fear of being LJBF’d again, and don’t want that to happen. This girl is great and I could definitely get into a LTR with her and would jump at the opportunity.

So, the other day I decided to step things up and ask her out. We were texting back and forth for a bit and then I told her “I’m going Xmas shopping for my sister tomorrow. You should come with and be helpful.” She declined, giving some long few texts about how she hates the mall this time of year (can’t blame her) and how she already got her shopping done in Sept. Now, like I said before, she is foreign so it’s difficult to pick up on intent sometimes in her texts because of how she words things, but it just felt like she truly didn’t want to go to the mall and that she wasn’t declining because she doesn’t like me, but because she actually didn’t want to go to the mall. She also texts me after the bars a lot and has suggested that she had sex on her mind once, but didn’t want to act on it. That night my phone died and I found the text the next morning (just my luck!). This all occurred on the weekend BEFORE Christmas.

Fast forward to Christmas night, I bumped into her at our annual Christmas night party where all our friends go and drink and have fun. I knew she would be there so this was no surprise. Again, we hit it off and were talking and she asked how my mall trip was and all was back to the way things normally are between us. I was using kino again and was observing her talking to another guy (also our mutual friend). This guy is completely AFC style, overly nice guy, kind of dorky and a douchebag at times, but still a friend of mine. She was talking to him the same way she talks to me and seemed interested in him too. He is not attractive, does not escalate or kino, does nothing that suggests he knows how to handle a woman, and she seemed semi-interested in him.

Now I am just confused and feel like I can still pull this off but need some direction. I am no mPUA or anything but I feel good enough about my skills and techniques that I should be winning this GAME! I have one-itis and am willing to lose it if I can get a definite “no” from her or take it to the next level. Please offer suggestions on what you think I should do from here, as I am totally stumped at this point.

Hey man, Im in such a similar situation, HB9, friend of my friends, always meet with a lot of people around, had a quite good progress, but I simply cant get physical, even trough she still acts diferently with me compared to her the other guys in the group.

I can fell the sparkles, but I dont know how to make the fire!!! lol

I sense that if we met in a club ramdomly, without common friends, it would be done... but in this equation, there is more than just me and the girl... she may really be interested, but once we got into a common social circle, I lost one of my strongest weapons, the mystery.

The "normal game" seems to be not that effective here, even more with one its, we loose your capacity of reading what is happening (Im speaking the wrong language and blind! lol)

My conclusion is the following... Even if I had an almost perfect game (not the case), she would gradualy see me as just another friend, cuz we are in a friendly context, there is a risk to became the "I like to flirt with him for fun, but it will never happen" guy.

And here is the best theory I could find to break trough this:

First, I stopped to hang out with the group for a while (it made she message me), and next time we meet, I will try not be in her group, maybe bring some girl friends with me and have a good time, and work on the eye contact.

The concept here is to act like... I know you, but did never really noted you, you may THINK that you know me, but you dont, MAYBE I can give you chance to join me.

Im not 100% sure if it will work, but when what youre doing is not working, its a sign to think about it and change... and thats the best idea I have untill now.

Listen J
i want to be as honest as i can and not be an asshole on this one so hear me out

The shit is gone man, it's G-O-N-E gone, 5 years is too much of a danger zone, She KNOWS you she doesn't care and shes not gonna change her mind, shes not "the best" either shes just a girl, you were LJBF after 1 year of knowing her period, and you've been put on that list, no matter what theirs no mending at all. The odds of you getting with her are slim. Your best thing to do is one thing with one-itis, move on.

i have been in your situation and it's shit i know but dont hate me when all i can give you is truth

on a brighter note i have one thing you can try and do
ignore her for a bit HIT ON OTHER GIRLS
PICK UP OTHER WOMEN
thats all i got, peace

Fender43

You asked her out to go shopping at the mall. How about an actual date?

You've known her for a long time. So you have a good basis. What I mean by that is, you hang out and you're friends, and you're not hooking up or being romantic. A few dates isn't going to change your basis, so once you go out a few times and feel each other out, if either of you don't like the way things are going you can always go back.

Don't worry about the whole "ruining the friendship" bullshit. It only happens if you cheat on each other, or if you weren't good friends to begin with.

Man up. Tell the girl you're interested in her, and ask her out. If she says no, then nothing's weird. Just move on, no biggie.

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ITS YOUR CHOICE!
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I have known her for about 5 years but not in any kind of real capacity. we met a few times, she lived in a different city and recently moved back. She is a friend of my sister, and maybe that is holding her back. we've only really hung out for the past couple months, so the fact that i have known her longer doesn't really mean much.


You guys have given some solid advice so i'll try it. Thanks for the help fellas!

On the bright side (for you JKill5), I would have to disagree with Fender43. At no point (at least for me) is a girl considered too far "gone." It's a game. The sooner we all realize that the social standards we have created around "courtship" is indeed a game, the better players we can be. No girl is so far removed from the game that you can't recover from it --- the thing about the game is how far you're willing to take it to make your comeback. It's like a game of checkers, you don't lose just because someone takes away one of your kings - you create a strategy for your next move(s).

But, many guys take this to the extreme and fall into AFC mode when trying to recover. They suffer from watching hollywood romance comedies, or reading romance novels -- the protagonist will always pursue her, when in real life it comes off as creepy.

So how do you recover from this without becoming creepy? Just the opposite of what any AFC would do....

Think about how she's treated you in order for her to create attraction with you. And now she's making you jealous with your AFC friend. Do the same.

Don't ignore her, but don't pay special attention to her. When at the bar, don't approach her and just start talking with all your friends (preferably flirt with another girl). When she approaches you, you can talk to her -- but try to find an excuse to get away and talk to another girl. Would this not work on you? --It's part of the game. You have DHV your way back on top.

Don't text her -- you're too busy to be thinking of her. After all, you are just friends. Make her text you. Respond hours later.

So yes, essentially your next move is to forget about her, but in doing so it might create attraction when she sees you interacting with friends and not her. It could actually open up opportunities you're not asking for....

So no, for me at least, it's never over. It's how far are you willing to take the game in order to "win?" Some girls are worth. Some, well.... lets leave them to the AFCs...

_________________
"I control the playing field." -- QuarterBack

That makes perfect sense, Quarterback. Great Post. I do tend to become AFC a little when I start falling behind in the game. Cheers.