That was a great line and I sent it to her after both of us having a cooling off period and it us talking again.


Here's an update and where it stands now. copy/paste of the convo.

she's in Lala land on this one^
any advice from here would be appreciated.

Also I know I probably set up the wrong frame to begin with and that's what got me in this mess in the first place and why she expected me to pay but i'm not sure how to turn it around now if that's even possible.

If she see's me as a provider how can I stomp that and get back to be seeing more as a lover?

forget the whole lover/provider, think more in terms of being accountable for personal choices and having boundaries in your life and relationships, you want a relationship with someone who is not financially dependent on you, so that's fine, it's your choice how you want to live, not hers she has no power over you to force you into anything, if she respects you, she will respect your decisions, all you have to do is remain certain of your decision, keep it final and give to her what you would like in return (respect), as long as that frame continues, she will conform, or she will withdraw, if she absolutely will not respect your boundaries, then she is a bad choice for a girlfriend for you because your needs are not being met, a relationship is a mutual two way street, both parties should be doing everything they can to bring value to their partner, a win/win situation, if at any time you feel you are in a losing relationship with a needy person, then you might want to consider if you guys are right for each other

keep it up, more honesty, don't be afraid of her or her mom being mad at you, be strong, just don't insult her or attack her or her mom ad hominem if she starts raging on you, don't be the mirror that reflects her ugly behavior and you'll do fine, lead by example and keep your cool, if you find yourself getting mad at something she's said, step away from your txting or what ever and give yourself a break until you've calmed down and can write a clear headed honest response, if she can't go to florida then so be it, I wouldn't budge on this one, this is sort of like a kid throwing a temper tantrum cause he didn't get the present he wanted, boohoo you didn't get the ipad, enjoy your ipod and stop being a brat

if she is starting to make passive aggressive idle threats about leaving you or what ever, who cares, trouble signs of a terribly manipulative girlfriend who is testing the shit out of your boundaries, keep the boundries strong and don't react with the same threats she is putting out, just hold your frame, show respect and be firm and clear on managing her expectations, without some respect your relationship will become a prison, it goes both ways, you shouldn't be afraid to not bring anything to the table that you will not bring, if she has issues with that to the point she will not be in a relationship or throws a fit, too bad soo sad, you're her boyfriend, not her bank account, no thx jeff, if she wants a bank account for a boyfriend, then you're not for her and you guys might want to consider finding other people that more suit your lives

Doesn't sound good. Won't blame you if you walked away.
I don't think she's being a bitch by breaking up with you. You entertained her expectations for a while so now that you're making this boundary, you're going to come off as insecure regardless. Ironic right? Think of it this way, you started off as the older guy who could pay for stuff so he did. Now, she probably sees you as trying to establish this boundary to gain power.
In fact, can you afford to take her with you? Not saying you should, but if you can and dont she's seeing it as you dont want to gain the upper hand. For eg, let's say you were dating a girl and the sex was amazing in the first 2 months. She did everything easily. Then one day she comes along once things get serious and says, "we're not having sex as much" and she's not sucking your dick when she did before. No explanation...she doesnt say she's working longer hours so she's more tired lately, she doesnt say she's stressed out and cant think about sex as much. You'd probably be like WTF and think she must be insecure that you like her for herself and it would insult you even if you did care abt her. By trying to establish this boundary you're going to change the dynamic of the relationship for no other reason than "I don't want you to take advantage" (which implies you don't trust her and can be taken negatively). Next relationship, if this doesn't work, manage expectations early.

Yup, I should've set the boundaries earlier and the first week we dated I did - then she lost her job and it changed everything because now she couldn't keep up. I took over feeling bad for her losing her job. In retrospect I should've denied going to these fancy places she suggested but couldn't afford anymore as I will obviously be getting the bill.

Anyways, the shift in boundaries has changed she now views the relationship as a 50/50 exchange and we're on good terms again. Everything is great and I got what I wanted, great advice.

However, now there's another problem that aroused from the email. Her mom is beyond pissed at her, me and us. She thought my email was full of red-flags and thought I was rude to her mom and insulted her (she showed her mom the email) she wants us to break up even though me and her are on good terms.

Oh and to reference an earlier post that said she would start using sex as currency funny enough last night when discussing how she can pay me back she jokingly threw in "can't i just give you blow jobs?". I dismissed it real fast and said no.

Spot on the money with that one. Hmm.

You can explain the MK instead of the dress thing to her by telling her that you opted for the better gift in your mind.

As for her expectations, those are your fault. You bought her an MK watch 2 months into a relationship, thats about as good as buying the girls affection. I dont care how fast the relationship is moving, you have given her these expectations.

She was up front with you and communicated well with you that, she is not working. So any trip that you are thinking about planning you have to consider covering her way. Or at least discuss how much the trip is going to cost and find out if she can pay for anything at all before committing to the trip.

The guys are right this was your fault for having the "I'm Mr. Moneybags" frame from the start. That frame could bring the gold digger out in any girl. Let me explain to you a little about how important your frame is when you first start seeing a girl:

Once a woman has slotted you into a particular category in her mind it becomes difficult to change because she sees it as incongruent on your behalf. Women HATE incongruence. For instance if you seduce a woman with a 100% SEXUAL frame she will view you as a source of orgasms for her, she will fuck your brains out no questions asked, she will also be open to things like anal sex/sex in public etc. Now... If you seduce the SAME woman with the PROVIDER frame (let me take you on a date etc), she will see you as a potential source of PROVIDERSHIP, and SEX will be secondary. This same girl who let that 100% sexual guy fuck her in the ass on day1, will now be totally different with Mr Provider. Suddenly she "doesn't do that" on day1, and doesn't do anal sex because its "slutty" and will only do it with someone she "loves" blabla.

In your instance you seduced this woman with the frame that you were "well off" and "happy to pay for things", now she has slotted you into the potential SUGAR DADDY category and is acting accordingly. This same girl would never even THINK (JOKE) about using sex as currency with a guy that has a SEXUAL frame. She wouldn't give him drama if he refused to pay for things because he never even implied he would. Do you get what im saying here?

I love how she showed her mother your e-mail (which wasn't rude at all by the way). I might also point out a conflict of interest: her mother pointed out she's owed a lot of money. She knows a 50/50 relationship means she will be paying for a lot of things, and therefore won't be able to be paid back anytime soon. So it's in the mother's financial interest to get you guys broken up for her to see her money back faster.

This is just a case of bad parenting. If the mother really cared for her daughter, she'd be happy you both are happy and would put the financial issues aside.

_________________
Before she can respect you, you need to respect yourself.

This is why older men younger girl relationships are f'd up. If the mom wanting you to break up is true (may just be her excuse to eventually do so) its because she's young and not woman enough to make her own relationship decisions. Again, you chose to go down this path.
Keep in mind that 50/50 shouldnt be financially. Focus should be that both of you are making EQUAL EFFORT. If you make 6 figures and she makes minimum wage and you take her to a $200 dinner, she doesn't have to do the same next time because a $200 dinner is MORE effort for her. Things should be EQUAL meaning you both invest the same effort into the relationship. My current gf for a year is in college and I make alot more than her. For vday though I bought her a $20 necklace and took her to chilis. Picking the necklace took time and I wrapped it myself with a card. She got custom gifts (couples pictures and specialized mugs) that she spent around $100 total on her limited budget. Even though we spent different monetary amounts, we both know the other gave equal effort.

Absolutely, it makes perfect sense. I'll chalk this one up as a learning experience. Her parents are also feeding her this mentality too, by telling her things like if he drives an audi he can afford to be the one calling you, taking you out, and paying for you. Her father specifically said to her, the man should pay for everything - that's how I did it with your mom. I'm not interested in being beta like that.

I've remained firm in a 50/50 exchange and she is being compliant. I'm going to push for a more sexual frame now and see if I can really switch her from viewing me one way into another.

I didn't think my response to her email was rude at all either. She is insistent on saying it was rude and her mother has been flipping out for the last 2 days saying I insulted her and I havn't done anything to win her over blablabla. We were on the phone and her mother walked in and they started yelling at each other while I was still on the line and i overheard that part of the convo.

Good point about it's in the mothers best interest to break us up to see her money back faster.

This is how I originally saw it, I have a comfortable income and she has nothing. It takes no effort for me to take her out, while it takes her a lot to contribute. I'm actually not sure how to keep a balance given the circumstances unless we plan on eating kraft dinner off the bedroom floor every night, but that's how i've set it up moving forward.

one big point that hasn't been mentioned yet though, is she did work her ass off for a week as a production manager for a play and earned some cash and spent it all on her valentine's gift for me which was around ~$150. She spent her entire pay check from the work on me for the gift. She is putting in the effort when she can.

Alright this girl is fucked.

I noticed she reactivated her online dating profile on POF today, time to drop her ass.

Post the profile here lol... this is funny now but you don't need her.