Jesus fucking christ man. This girl is completely gone. No hope. If you go to the same gym as her she will cancel her membership?! Holy shit that is insane. I thought she was a relationship therapist. She needs to go to one haha. This is not fixable cause she is psycho and you are clingy as hell. Whatever you do, don't you dare reply to that email. I will drive to your house and smash your computer and phone if I have to.

1. DO NOT REPLY

2. GET. THE. FUCK. OUT. OF. THERE.

Damn, tru3demon!

All of this just came out of the blue it seems like...

And all without warning... Damn, i just gave her a key to my house on Wednesday and she thought that was beautiful!

Last week she said to me: "I need you" and on Monday of this week she said "I think I love you now"

I have no clue what triggered her reactions but it looks like she is done with me...

I mean, how do you go back on this? She busted my balls on everything she could. It is actually like someone said in this post earlier (I think it was chinopants) something like, she will sabotage things to break up with you.

Sure, I was clingy, and needy, but she wasn't an angel either all the time, or so it seems.

Thank you for the high-five tru3demon!

I know I screwed up with this girl but I thought all was well until this email today. What an eye-opener!

I don't know. Don't send anything. Just let it settle in. Just please sleep on it for the weekend at least. If I can think of any thing to help you I will let you know. All I can say is do something for your self. Be selfish right now and make your self a better person.

Sorry Mike.

_________________
Why guys and girls don't mesh.

"Chicks are crazy and guys are dumb." Chinopants.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=en ... a_Nno&NR=1

Thanks Chino!

I am really not sure what tripped her up?

In all honesty, things were going fantastically...really they were!

Even when she said she needed this weekend to herself, I was totally okay with it.

As far as going to yoga today? I can't remember her ever saying that "Saturday was my day"

I signed up there and it feels like the "home" studio whether she is there or not.

As far as my cats? They liked being outside, she is an animal lover. and Lily the dog? That is a new puppy i got for my daughter. Damn, i haven't had a dog for almost 15 years. Plus, my GF was helping me coordinate the shots and everything about it and she never said squat about it to me until now.

The flowers I send her she KNOWS that I sit and talk with the arranger (I have told her this many times) and he and I decide what type of arrangement to send her. She makes it sound like i'm picking flowers out of a book to send her, they are all custom designed arrangements.

and neglecting my health? fuck that! I was healthy before we met. she is into totally organic stuff that she shared with me and I "changed over" to that type of food and lifestyle because that is what she liked.

She KNEW I hadn't gone to the dentist for only 1 year. I told her what was up. (I had a tooth that needed a root canal and because of that it caused a minor sinus thing going on that created some bad breath) As soon as i noticed it was caused by the tooth, I went directly into my new dentist and had it taken care of, plus I am ALWAYS chewing a fresh piece of gum or I have a tic-tac in my mouth because I like fresh breath.

She makes it sound like my entire mouth was decayed!

I just can't make sense out of her sudden transition but the adrenal gland issue is taking it's toll on her.

I don't want to lose her but this "I'm only asking for two weeks right now" just sounds like total bullshit doesn't it?

I mean, who the fuck is going to put up with that?

I need advice. Sure I can wait thru the weekend no problem but I do need to address her letter and if we are breaking up, we have lots of stuff to return to each other. To make matters worse, i called Hawiian Airlines and the tickets can't be cancelled or can there be any name changes, so she will have a ticket or a credit no matter what.

A "2 week" wait runs us up against Valentine's Day and the trip to Hawaii starts on the 28th of February.

sounds like i'm in a jamb. What would you guys do here? I mean besides the solid advice that Chinopants gave me?

Hey mike. I gotta say, I knew this would happen, but as you seemed like a good hearted guy I gave you advice that would make you happy and would allow you to be with this woman, if only temporarily. Usually I would have said to leave and work on yourself, but for once I honestly felt like hoping things would work out for you.

My 2 cents:

Throughout this thread and since you're update, you've proclaimed repeatedly to this woman how much you miss her. There's a difference between telling someone you miss them now and then, but most conversations you have with her seem to end like this:

Her: Gnite. Sweet dreams!
You: Good night. I miss you so much right now!
You: Good morning...miss you alot.
You are being smothering.
I don't think she is doing anything really wrong. From your description of events I you ARE smothering her. I can only assume there are other actions that would be smothering as well. I can see that you're trying to be nice sincerly but this is not what she wants. She wanted space. Space means limited text messages and avoiding her, not going to yoga when you know she would be. Not coming up to her afterwards.

As someone said, you're not giving her what she wants. I wish I could say she's doing something wrong or being crazy, but the description of events is only telling me that she is trying to give you multiple chances and you keep sliding back. Man, I read your update and when I read about the adrenal gland thing, I thought it would turn out she was crazy or wrong in someway, but I gotta be honest, you ARE smothering her.

I read gomike's first two posts, and his last one. Seems like not much has changed, only gotten worse.

And though I'm sure virtually everyone has warned you, gomike, about your neediness, it seems like you haven't adjusted your game at all. Your last post brings back memories from how one of my relationships broke down. The girl would find excuses and non-sense to argue. Shit that was just beyond me, that was completely irrational, made zero sense, and made me question whether I was losing my mind.

This has all the symptoms of a girl that is being suffocated by your neediness and may not be attracted, but at the same time is too afraid of being single and alone to let you walk.

I won't even bother telling you what you need to do, because I'm sure everyone has clearly said what needs to be done, and you haven't taken appropriate action. Instead, I'm going to tell you how it plays out: eventually, it all ends. You get your heart broken, and probably depressed. That's fine, because you'll eventually look back, learn from your mistakes, and find the courage to go find other HBs where you'll have much more success. I wish you all the best man. You have a long way to recovery but in the end, everything happens for a reason.

_________________
Before she can respect you, you need to respect yourself.

Hey fly_swatter and my old buddy Neo87!

I appreciate the comments and I have no problem admitting I screwed up. Maybe (probably for sure) it was because I was single too long before I met her, and I just AFC'd needlessly.

Or more than likely it is because I just don't "Get It" yet.

I wish i did "Get It" because I am a great guy, but my smothering neediness or clinginess is driving her, or has driven her away from me. It does look like maybe we weren't meant for each other anyway, but neo87 you hit it on the mark...

I honestly felt that by telling her that I missed her (and I did miss her because it is so awesome when we are together) I felt that she would appreciate it, and realize that I really enjoyed being with her. I had no fucking idea that doing that was counter-productive to what I was thinking.

We even talked in great detail about her "other" relationships and how those guys screwed it up, never thinking that I would be possibly the next one in line...

I never intentionally meant to "smother" her, or make her need space. I just plain and simple do not have my mindset, or my game together at all. period.

If you have any idea for me on where to start before I fuck up another possible relationship, I'd sure appreciate it.

A part of me wants to tell her how to find this post and read it. Maybe that would be a good idea, or a bad one...who knows?

I did call her and left a voice message. I mean fuck it, what she said, whether true or not, hurt. some of it wasn't even true and she knows that. In fact, 3 or 4 weeks ago she apologized to me for saying EXACTLY what she just said to me in her email from today about me "signing up" at "her" yoga studio. 3 or 4 weeks ago she said she was sorry for saying that to me because she said it in anger and didn't mean it, and here she is saying the exact same thing to me again.

She was the one who wanted me to sign up for Yoga if I wanted to. I never begged her, or asked her if I "could" sign up at her studio. But alas, that is water under the bridge now for sure.

When I called her today, I had to leave a voicemail message. I didn't want to leave a message, but some of what she said really bothered me.

All I did say in the message was that I did get her email ( the letter she wrote me) and that I was surprised that she felt that way considering that 3 days ago she said to me that: "I think I am in love with you" and that last week she said to me: "I need you".

I pointed out to her that even on the night before she told me that "I need space", I gave you a key to my house, and it looked like you loved the idea, and immediately put the key on your keyring.

I also told her that I was surprised that she left me an email like that instead of telling me in person, or at least telling me on the phone, and that I am not going to talk about this via emails or text anymore as I would rather talk on the phone about it, or in person.

I closed my message by saying to her that whether it is 2 hours, 2 days, 2 weeks, or 2 months, I want to talk to her, and that I will not text her, or call her anymore after this message. I also said at the end of my message "no matter what, I still love you" and then I hung up.

To be honest to myself, I truly believe I finally have the strength to do what I promised. Not call her or text her. Why should I at this point? I fucked everything up and it will do no good at all to even contact her.

In fact, even if there was a shred of hope left, if I was to text her or call her, that "shred" would surely be gone.

I know some of you will say that I shouldn't have called her and left that message, but we are both adults
and up until this past wednesday night/thursday morning, there were NO SIGNS of any problems to me, even as fucking blind as I appear to be.

So, if she calls...good. If not, I have already lost her anyway. I appreciate the extended time that neo87 got for me as it was a beautiful thing...

Anyway, i'll post more if something comes up. meanwhile I really gotta figure out just how to be an "Alpha male" and buck up.

And honestly, what is the thought about me giving her the link to this post?

Thanks!

Whether you give her a link to this board (terrible idea) or not, you won't win her back. The sooner you realize this, the easier your life will be. Trust me.

_________________
Before she can respect you, you need to respect yourself.

No problem Mike. I felt like saying those exact words but I didn't know how to explain not getting it yet. For your next relationship, there are no simple fixes. It's a tough road if you're naturally smothering (I think you just like expressing your feelings and having someone you finally love makes you want more of that. You have to get to the point where you can love someone alot, yet can go a week without talking to them without losing your cool. This can't be faked. I could tell you not to text or call someone, but eventually they'll pick up on it.
Have some things in your life that make you happy besides a woman. Things that you REALLY enjoy or want to accomplish. Some guys confuse this with finding something they like but when a woman comes along that's what they were looking for. For example, I work 8 hours a day, I'm working on my career, getting my CPA and MBA. I also love playing video games and watching movies. I could be alone without a woman for 3 years and literally go to work, hang out with friends, study and play games and watch movies in my free time and be very happy. A woman in my life knows that she is icing on the cake. If my gf needs space, I could go a week without her comfortable and it would pass in a second because I have so much other stuff I'd be interested in and doing. Shit, sometimes I tell my gf I'm taking my phone off for a day just because I need some me time and dont want to think about checking my messages. I tell my gf AFC shit like I love her so much and she says the same and it's not smothering because she knows I could go the next couple days being busy and not talking to her. I even keep my phone on silent every day because I hate checking it.
For example, my gf recently went to visit her family for Xmas. I contacted her less, not to be cool, but because I thought "hey, she's with her family who she barely sees, why should I distract her...she's not going anywhere and I trust her." In fact, she gets slightly bratty when she goes to her family because she knows I'm gonna contact her less.
Women come and go. Meet new women and sharpen your skills to the point where getting them is easy. Then you'll value YOUR time more and doing what you want to do.

You know Neo, that is more than likely my issue...

I have things i like to do but they all flew out the window when i met her.

I made her the most important thing in my life and now i see how it is destructive to me. Funny you said something about the "icing on the cake"

she said the exact same thing to me like a month ago or so... saying that she should be the icing on the cake and I'm the cake.

Well, at this point she is asking for a couple of weeks alone. I have nothing to lose now that i have already lost everything with her.

I have to leave her alone now because I pushed myself to this point.

She did not say that she was breaking up with me in her email today, which could be good, but the fact that she had to ask for a couple of weeks alone is not a good sign we will be together very much longer, if at all now.

I hope we can salvage this but it sure looks doomed. I love boats and i have two of them.

If this relationship was one of my boats, i'd be sending out an SOS signal to the coast guard, putting on my lifejacket, and know that the boat is gone forever...

Maybe, just maybe, the boat will stay afloat...

Haha! I'm always the optimist!

Thanks man! I appreciate all your time and your help.

She doesn't want to be with you and its over, that's what you need to accept, and its difficult I know. I am the king of AFCing relationships towards slow painful deaths. It's a hard habit to break, but you can do it.

When a girl constantly says things like "I need space and time for myself" you need to be thinking "what's really going on?" Because in my experience it rarely means precisely that. It's like when a magician bombards you with conversation so you miss that sleight of hand.

For a start, you won't feel it now, but this woman seems like a fucking nightmare to be in a relationship with! When you meet a good person for you, you're insecurities won't be brought out nearly as much.

I fucked up a relationship over christmas, now I have recently been dating and taking it slowly with a new girl who is SO FUCKING COOL and I don't wanna screw it up, so I wrote down a list of EVERYTHING I did that fucked up my previous relationship, everything. You should do that now so you can learn from your mistakes and save this thread for regular perusal.

Hey Rough,

I really think you said it correctly right here:
Rough, I'm glad that you found" someone who is a better "fit" for you. As I began to know this girl, I started to see small things that told me maybe we weren't all that great for each other...( things like different interests, hobbies, recreational things, etc., etc.)

You made me think back to my previous relationships where this type of thing NEVER came up, the "I need space" thing. Even getting a little break (what, she just told me yesterday she wants time alone...) from knowing that she and I are "together" has gotten me thinking about this very same thing.

I honestly had some serious doubts when I first read her dating profile on okcupid and then emailed her. I had guessed that she was either a Doctor, a Lawyer, or a Therapist, based on what she said. When i found out that she was a Therapist, I tried to "reality check" myself but it was too late. In my heart I felt that going out with a "Relationship Therapist" was a really bad idea and now it seems like I was right.

I have never been with a woman where my insecurities were brought out so much while we were in a relationship besides her. The only other times I can think of was when a girl was "done" with us and was out sneaking around and/or seeing someone else before telling me blah, blah, blah...

For sure the next few weeks will totally suck... I mean come on!... Fuck!

Valentine's Day is coming up in less than 2 weeks, as well as the trip we already planned for Hawaii on the 28th of February as well. She said in her letter to me "You can decide what you want to about Hawaii".

So to "end" this relationship" with her, and to just to get this girl out of my head will cost me literally over $2,000 (the lost money I pre-paid for Hawaii) plus the normal and usual heartache of breaking up with someone.

Just to "break-up" I have to do all this stuff... it is nothing like getting a divorce (which I have had to do as well) but still nothing I wanted, or had planned to do right now:

* I have to do the "Exchange" of all the stuff we have at each other's house
* I'm fucked on the Hawaii tickets, there is no refund for the trip, only a credit and one ticket is in her name
* I already bought the Wanderlust tickets for the festival, non-refundable. that was another $1,000 lost
* I can get back the $2,500 for the hotel, but I'm still out the flight $$$ and festival $$$ if I don't go
* we had beautiful sex together, some of the best for me actually, I have to deal with that being gone...
* up until this, things felt great together, even though obviously she wasn't totally happy, that is tough

Just a bunch of stuff I didn't want to have to deal with right now I guess.

It looks like the general consenus here is that she is done with me and this relationship.

If so, why did she say to me this instead of just breaking up with me? I can't figure it out...:
I am thankful that there are some very cool people on this forum helping me, and others, keep their shit together under all types of conditions. Honestly, without your guys help, I'd be a fucking mess right now...

With most everyone on the forum here (actually everyone on the forum here!) telling me that this relationship is "over" with her, what should I do now?

Do I wait 2 painful weeks to do the "exchange" of the stuff?

Do I just wait through this weekend like Chinopants suggested, in case she realizes she didn't want to say that?

Do i just "call her out" on the idea of the "break-up" and just tell her i think it's over?

I just have no idea at all on how to proceed here as I was not expecting this to happen. There was no real warning that this was going to happen that I was aware of as we do have plenty of "time" apart as she has work in the evenings during the week, and I have my 11 year old daughter with me part-time as well.

Shit, last Thursday we went skiing together all day and then she spent the night. that entire day and night was honestly so fucking perfect together I could just fucking bang my head against the wall right now...FUCK!

Keep the suggestions coming, It really helps a lot.

thank you

I can kinda see what Rough Operator is saying. If a woman is constantly asking for space, it could be a signal she doesn't want to be with you or is bipolor or something else is going on. But your actions have blinded a proper view of things because I can see from the text messages that you're being smothering. If things were normal and you were laid back with her and she kept asking for space that could be a red flag. But if I were her I would want space because I'd be getting over emotional messages and have you coming up to me at yoga.

You have only been in a relationship for 2-3 months. That's way too early to be shelling out money on a trip and all these things. That says something.
Guys, if you were in a relationship for 2 months and a girl,:
1. Texted you emotional stuff all the time,
2. Told you she missed you all the time
3. Paid for thousands on a vaction for you
4. Mentioned moving somewhere where it most likely means she wants to move in with you
5. Joined you gym and showed up at times you were there then came up to you afterwards

All these would make me feel smothered. Did you do these things in previous relationships and what was the result? Why are the next 2 weeks going to be hell?

I obviously didn't read the entire topic because 8 pages. I did read through the initial page and through some of OP's posts.


Anyway,here's the deal.

You gotta understand that you're a certain type of person. You have a lot to offer, a lot of love to give.Now,some people are scared of this. Why ? because they feel inadequate. They think that they cannot rise to the expectations of the one who gives because normally , if you give a lot you want to receive a lot.


This girl is the emotionally unstable type.She's not even over her ex entirely.
So you see,it's all relative. In general , your offer-a-lot character , with the right person should reward you with a GREAT deal of happyness.But this only happens with a strong person. Someone who's not afraid of falling in love or getting hurt and someone who can live up to high emotional intesity.

Don't get me wrong , there's a thin line between this and neediness.

Normally in relationships I rarely ever suggest freeze-outs as they can do more harm than good at times.Obviously I'm not gonna encourage you to keep texting her a million times saying how much you miss her , but texting her every now and then could work IF you will show absolutely NO EMOTION.

A little something I'm trying out is this:

Act vague , like you don't give a single shit about her anymore. She can't live up to what you want ? a'right , no problem. Someone else can. This doesn't have to be true,she just needs to think it is.

SO basically she's getting some attention from you every once in a while but without the emotion she's used to.

It's creating some sort of "so close but yet so far away" effect.
What this should accomplish is:

1.At first it will help with her 'space' needs. She'll see that she can talk to you without feeling overwhelmed emotionally. This should be a refreshing feeling at first.
2.After that , she'll start feeling that she's talking to you..but not really you. She'll start asking herself where's the love. Where's the affection ? The more she'll talk to you the more she'll start missing it.She's gonna start believing that you're letting go and consequently ask herself if she really wants to lose that.

You can throw her a bone every now and then if you think she's drifting off. Just a little one though.Pull away fast after that. Cat-string theory.
The point is to enforce her ' do I want to lose that ?' with a little reminder of what she's losing. It should increase the intensity. But just stab at it,it's easy to get caught in the moment.

A freeze-out leaves room for interpretation. She could think that you're exactly as emotionally attached. Doing what I described above is constant proof that emotion is not being withheld ,but fading.



Read your texts 10 times if you have to before hitting send. Ask yourself repeatedly if it's not a mistake.Basic principle is that she already knows what you feel. Now she has to start thinking that you're fading away.Or rather , she's pushing you away.


Also,dude, STOP APOLOGIZING FOR EVERYTHING !
If you take 2 steps towards her to comment on a yoga class and she freaks out its not your problem. Why are YOU apologizing ?

"Fuck it, this woman can't take a casual conversation and yet I'm the one with the problem ?fuck that." That is what should be going through your mind , not "Oh...sorry I guess."

All in all,like I said , you seem to be a guy that has a lot to offer. She really doesn't offer you that much. In the end , if she dumps you guess what ? She's the loser. Someone else will soon be made happy by you and you will be made happy by them.

Remember,expressing emotion is not weakness. Expressing weakness through emotion is weakness.

Texting "I miss you" is emotion. Texting "I miss you" another 2-3 times after that expecting a reply is weakness.

_________________
I know my place. It's me on top of the world.

My in depth texting & dating guide.
There's no such thing as shit-tests.
How to keep a girl.

Ok I know how you can get her back. Thing is you don't have the balls to try this. What you need to do is switch it up big. Call her up and start a fight with her. Tell her That you done trying to love her and that she is not worth you love. Then you need to tell her that she is nothing and that all you want from her is just to fuck hard and to make her your cum slave, Little fuck hole just there for you to take and discard. That all she is to you now and a piece of ass. That all you desire from her is some deep fucking and that when your done that she should pick her shit up and leave. You need to blow this girl away with a complete 180. Make her ride this emotional roller coaster and that you are so drawn away that she needs to get to you to get her fix of you. Hate and love are like a drug. Your love has numbed her and that you need to treat her like a little piece of meat. The complete opposite of treating her like a queen. She is far from it and if you make her less then zero she will be pulled to pleasing you. I know you dont have this in you. You need to be committed to being a complete ass to her. I bet if you do this she will chase you. You will disarmed her cuz she is expecting a complete broken man. You were the safe little puppy dog that she pick due to her having a bad relationshit in the past. Give her what she now craves. She was sick and bored and grinder down by the nice Mike. Give her the ass hole Mike now. Any one else out there think that this would be an option that would work? Be Alph be not sexual but masochistic on your wants. They are not desires but dirty actions that she is going to take hard and deep.

_________________
Why guys and girls don't mesh.

"Chicks are crazy and guys are dumb." Chinopants.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=en ... a_Nno&NR=1