The truth about "The October Man"



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 5:54 pm 
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Note from the Author: I originally posted parts this as a reply, to a certain member who was openly promoting the "October Man Sequence." I feel that it is very important for everyone to understand WHY this, and others, are considered "forbidden." To help with this, I've decided to create a little "write up" to hopefully dispel any myths and secrecy behind these patterns and sequences. I mainly discuss the "October Man," because it is the most controversial of these patterns, however, most of this will apply for any of the "Forbidden Patterns." I hope you take the time to read this in it's entirety.

First and foremost, lets start off with one of the golden rules of Pick-UP.

Leave her better than you found her.

This should be easy enough to decipher on your own, BUT, I'll go ahead and let you all know what it means to me. It means that you should NOT be out to harm anyone. The point of Pick-Up is to better your life and the life of those you interact with. This starts, with most of us here, with women.

It's important to keep this in mind as you read through the rest of this post.

There are three *main* reasons Why most of these are considered "Forbidden."
1. If you don't use it properly, you can really mess with someone's mental state. This is because most of these patterns rely on something called NLP. For more information on NLP, check out this article on wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuro-ling ... rogramming

2. Most people won't be able to use it properly. This is because these patterns and techniques rely on some of the more advanced techniques of NLP. Like most things, the advanced NLP techniques require a firm understanding of the more basic techniques.

3. NLP is, at a very basic level, a method of modifying a person's thought process. By changing a person's thought process related to sex, you are pretty much removing someone's ability to say "NO" to you. This is considered rape, and is unethical in any civilized nation.

With the combination of these three items, it's easy to see why the "October Man" is considered "Forbidden." The "October Man" has extreme potential to break that golden rule.

The October Man is NOT a "quick and easy" route to get laid. To properly use the October Man, you will need to understand the fundamentals of Pick-Up, and NLP. This will take time, and by the time you understand, and have developed your skills related to Pick-Up, you will no longer need a "quick fix" to get laid. The tools to get laid will already be at your disposal. To learn more about Pick-Up, all you have to do is poke around these forums a bit. There's a wealth of free information at your disposal.

If you are truly interested in learning this sequence, and you have a solid understanding of Pick-Up, you should read about NLP, and gain an understanding on how it works. Then read the book entitled "The February Man," which was what IN10SE based the October Man off of. He renamed it the "October Man" because his birthday was in October. Then, read IN10SE's document. The thing to remember through all of this is that the October Man has it's time and place. This sequence should ONLY be used by someone with a firm understanding of how to undo the results, and on someone who is consents, after understanding the possible implications.




Now for a quick bit about some of the other techniques/sequences/patterns:

It's no secret that someone with true knowledge of NLP could EASILY create something more powerful than the October Man. The only reason people are interested in the October Man is because people keep promoting it's "Awesomeness" and "Power," and then, after reading about it, they want the "quick and easy" solution to their problem with women.




The last thing I'll leave you with is that Pick-Up is about more than getting women. Sure, it' starts off that way for most of us, but, as I've said before, Pick-Up is a way of life. It exists solely to improve your life, and the life of those you interact with.


EDIT: The first batch of edits I made were grammatical. If I add anything, I'll be sure to make sure it's noted.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 11:54 pm 
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Beautiful post. Thank you.

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Last edited by Zip on Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:09 am 
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Haha, thanks for the response. I was starting to think I might have stepped over the line a bit.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:38 am 
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Book reccomendations for NLP?
Title/Author?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:45 am 
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I'd like to submit this as a defense to NLP and the thought that it is about altering people's thought processes, for that isn't it's most basic purpose, although it may be applied for that purpose. I wrote this on another forum, in response to some negative discussion about NLP and is written with quite a bit of hyperbole, so enjoy the humor.
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*Enter the NLP wizard*

There is truth in everything you have heard so far, YET so far there has been no TRULY informed and neutral explaination of what NLP is.

*Crosses arms in an X and then seperates them to either side as he speaks*

Forget all the stuff you've heard about it being designed to anchor things to people's subconscious and manipulate them.

*Holds right hand in front of his chest for emphasis*

Yes that is a capability of NLP as you are currently witnessing. I sweep aside the negative conotations and I cement in the idea that that is only ONE capability of it. Let's get down to business, shall we?

You have been using the principles of NLP your entire life, whether you knew it or not. You used them when you were just a baby and unable to talk, yet capable of crying to let your mother know you had made a mess in your diaper, or that you were hungry.

NLP is merely the STUDY of language and the effects it has upon people, whether it be words, tonality, or body language. There is nothing evil about NLP, just as there is nothing evil about a gun. It is how it is implimented that causes it to have moral value; just as using a gun to hunt and feed your family is a noble effort, whereas using it to rob a bank and shoot a cop is a terrible crime.

NLP was created in the 70's by Richard Bandler and John Grinder in an effort to maximize the effectiveness of communication between people. It enables you to more completely understand what others are trying to communicate to you, as well as enhancing your ability to communicate your thoughts to them. This is done by studying the body language that they have and reading the signs that they unconsciously and consciously show in their actions, which often aren't represented in their words, as well a noting the tone changes when they are talking and the words that they use to communicate their thoughts. When you are talking to someone else, you use NLP to choose body language that helps to emphasise what you are trying to communicate (remember how I sweep my hands in an X as I tell you to forget something, it adds to that and helps you to remove those thoughts), as well as choosing the right tonality (not speaking loud to a person that is upset and instead matching their tone, then slowly raising it up until they feel better, which is a technique known as pacing and leading) and picking the best words to get your concepts across in a way that will connect best to the other person.

There are many many many books and media about NLP, with various schools of thought on how it can be applied, what is morally ok and what isn't. Some say anything is fair game and some say not to manipulate people with it. The trouble comes from the fact that there is no distinct line, because when I use my voice tonality to cheer up a sad person, I have manipulated them in a manner of speaking, so what really makes it so different from planting thoughts of having hot sex with you in her head? That's truly up to you to decide, as no one else can tell you where to draw that line.

There are many many many many many techniques that fall under the umbrella of NLP, just as everyone employs most of them in their day to day lives without being consciously aware of it. As I said, it is merely the study of communication and didn't re-invent the way we communicate, only took note of what techniques are most effective and emphasized the use of them over bad techniques. This is just like how you know many people that have good posture and get more respect than those that have bad posture. Unconscious use of NLP tools is unavoidable and so I personally suggest that everyone familiarize themselves with it, so that they are more capable of choosing how they desire to communicate.

I hope this has been informative and that all the negative stigmas about NLP, so that you can choose for yourself how to go about communicating with others and how effectively you would like to be able to do so.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:32 am 
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I agree with you completely Rye Lee.

NLP in itself is not bad at all. I actually love reading everything I can related to NLP. I had tried to seperate NLP and those classified as "Forbidden" with the Wikipedia article, but I guess I could have done a better job of it. However I have, what I guess you could call a personal vendetta against The October Man and other sequences like it.

These forbidden patterns are just seen by many as a "quick fix," which is not what they really are. The only reason anyone should want to learn a forbidden pattern, IMHO, is so that after learning NLP they don't accidentally do something similar to one of these patterns without realizing it.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:32 pm 
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I dont think is a good idea to forbid something. Forbidden stuff is always more attractive. There is a lot of guys out there wanting to get laid, and denying them apparently good information to do so, its cruel and selfish from their perspective.

When people posts that the forbidden patterns are just as a "date rape" , thats actually advertising them, because every aspiring PUA would think "I gotta learn that stuff".

Many people new on the community have the idea that PU is manipulating girls to have sex with you. I mean; In a sense, stuff like pretending to be the "Alpha male" is lying, because many of these guys are geeky, or a little bit dorkish...so they are actually pretending to be someone else, and its difficult for the un-experienced ones to separate that from lying.

Statements like "Fake it 'till you make it" distort ethics. They just validate lying to accomplish an objective. "Victory by all means necessary" is not my idea if ethics.

Its funny when someone posts in this kind of forums that NLP is not a quick fix. In the real life there is not such thing as a quick fix. You cant find a quick fix for the down payment of you house, or for cancer, or for poverty. In the world there is not such thing as a quick fix for real life problems. Pick up arts need determination an discipline. The only quick fix to get laid is paying for a prostitute.

If you want a quick fix...you are not going to find it in PU or on NLP....you are not going to find it cause Quick fixes do not Exist.

But just as giving a gun to an angry person is a bad idea, giving forbidden patterns to the un-experienced is as bad. Because the angy person is going to use the gun to fufill the most immediate need: revenge, So the average newbie will use the patterns to: get laid, thats the priority at the moment.

I think that forbidden patterns shouldnt be forbidden, instead they should have a big caution sing right in the cover explainng why they can be dangerous. May it be a good, scary caution sing...not like those on smokes....no one is scared about those.


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:03 am 
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Book reccomendations for NLP?
Title/Author?
I've actually learned a lot from freely available information online. I have one NLP book that goes into more advanced topics that I would recomend however.

The book is entitled:

Neuro-Linguistic Programming: Volume I (The Study of the Structure of Subjective Experience)
by Robert Dilts



This book is a great read for anyone with a basic understanding of NLP. It is a tough read though. Most of it is written at the graduate level, and there are sections that are hard to relate to (An entire chapter on using an EMS...). However, if you can manage to get through it, it's a GREAT tool for furthering your knowledge on the subject.

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 9:52 pm 
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Note from the Author: 3. NLP is, at a very basic level, a method of modifying a person's thought process. By changing a person's thought process related to sex, you are pretty much removing someone's ability to say "NO" to you. This is considered rape, and is unethical in any civilized nation. [/quote] I respectfully disagree. Hypnosis can never make you do something you don't already want to do. I use patterns that are somewhat like this to remove mental blocks etc.. Does that mean I am a rapist? hell no. [quote] 1. If you don't use it properly, you can really mess with someone's mental state. This is because most of these patterns rely on something called NLP. [/quote] I will agree this shit is powerful, thats why I use it, but unfortunately it can do some damage and should not be used to "get laid". you have the potential to give someone ultimate pleasure and to take advantage of that is completely emoral.[/quote]

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 11:30 pm 
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I respectfully disagree.

Hypnosis can never make you do something you don't already want to do. I use patterns that are somewhat like this to remove mental blocks etc.. Does that mean I am a rapist? hell no.
You are correct in saying that all current research shows that hypnosis can not force someone to do anything they don't want to. The proper definition of hypnosis is a state of increased suggestibility.

However, NLP is not hypnosis. Neuro-Linguistic Programming is based on different theories entirely. Two of the most important assumptions behind NLP are

1. A human being can't know reality. They can only know their own perception of Reality.
2. This perception of reality dictates our interactions.

(more on this here: http://www.nlpu.com/whatnlp.htm)

When it comes down to the "Frobidden" patterns, these perceptions are altered. By altering a person's perception of reality, you are changing how they will interact under certain circumstances. My wording was a bit strong in the original post, however since people act differently under different perceptions of reality, and you are changing their perception of reality, you are changing the way they will interact with the given circumstances. This, for our purposes of this discussion, is making them do something.
Quote:
I will agree this shit is powerful, thats why I use it, but unfortunately it can do some damage and should not be used to "get laid". you have the potential to give someone ultimate pleasure and to take advantage of that is completely emoral.
That's what I was really trying to covey with the original post.

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 11:38 pm 
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Here's something I found on the internet that might help explain the difference between hypnosis and NLP better than I could:
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The main difference is that Hypnosis uses, almost exclusively, language; to elicit a state where you are very receptive to well phrased suggestions. Trance is a rather formal and prolonged experience

NLP does this as well, but in addition takes advantage of the subjective neurological pathways, and makes behavioral changes by manipulating those pathways. Trance is considered a naturally occurring phenomena and is recognized and taken advantage of when it spontaneously occurrs even if only momentarily.

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PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2008 8:31 am 
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Quote:
Quote:
I respectfully disagree.

Hypnosis can never make you do something you don't already want to do. I use patterns that are somewhat like this to remove mental blocks etc.. Does that mean I am a rapist? hell no.
You are correct in saying that all current research shows that hypnosis can not force someone to do anything they don't want to. The proper definition of hypnosis is a state of increased suggestibility.

However, NLP is not hypnosis. Neuro-Linguistic Programming is based on different theories entirely. Two of the most important assumptions behind NLP are

1. A human being can't know reality. They can only know their own perception of Reality.
2. This perception of reality dictates our interactions.

(more on this here: http://www.nlpu.com/whatnlp.htm)

When it comes down to the "Frobidden" patterns, these perceptions are altered. By altering a person's perception of reality, you are changing how they will interact under certain circumstances. My wording was a bit strong in the original post, however since people act differently under different perceptions of reality, and you are changing their perception of reality, you are changing the way they will interact with the given circumstances. This, for our purposes of this discussion, is making them do something.
Quote:
I will agree this shit is powerful, thats why I use it, but unfortunately it can do some damage and should not be used to "get laid". you have the potential to give someone ultimate pleasure and to take advantage of that is completely emoral.
That's what I was really trying to covey with the original post.
I think you've got a good point Lucid. I think that with NLP, you could twist up someone's perception of reality to the point where you can make them do shit that you couldn't with hypnosis by itself. You can utilize hypnosis when using NLP, but that doesn't mean all NLP is hypnosis, or that all hypnosis is NLP. With the right application though, you could totally change their perception.

Now, that being said, do you think that makes it "evil"?

Seriously think about this now, cause you could do some massive damage to someone and fuck them up for life, or you could use it in order to fix someone that is totally messed up. I think that is one thing I want to learn more from NLP. I think you could use it in the form of therapy very effectively.

I advanced a lot with NLP for a while and then I concentrated on other things, but I think I'm heading back to looking into NLP and psychology some more, so that I can figure out how to fix broken people, cause that's probably my biggest goal and desire in life right now. Slightly catalysed by the relationship I just had with a girl that was amazing, but couldn't properly communicate due to issues from her past. I made a lot of progress with her, but couldn't figure out how to get around certain boundries. Maybe with the right knoweldge and tools, one could get around anything and regardless of what a person has as mental blocks, you can fix them, even without them having had the drive to do it themselves; which is my current hinderanc, I can only help someone if they want to help themself, which most people are too afraid to do.

Whew...hopefully I didn't get too deep there, really tired and late...

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PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2008 3:18 pm 
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 10:23 pm 
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However, NLP is not hypnosis. Neuro-Linguistic Programming is based on different theories entirely. Two of the most important assumptions behind NLP are

1. A human being can't know reality. They can only know their own perception of Reality.
2. This perception of reality dictates our interactions.

(more on this here: http://www.nlpu.com/whatnlp.htm)

When it comes down to the "Frobidden" patterns, these perceptions are altered. By altering a person's perception of reality, you are changing how they will interact under certain circumstances. My wording was a bit strong in the original post, however since people act differently under different perceptions of reality, and you are changing their perception of reality, you are changing the way they will interact with the given circumstances. This, for our purposes of this discussion, is making them do something.
Fair enough, just more reason for me to not teach a lot of people my patterns(shamelessly stolen from many people :lol: ) for the safety of those they want to seduce.

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PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 6:13 am 
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@ RyeLee:

We're on the same page entirely. NLP is not evil. There are some applications, however, that someone with bad intentions could use to their advantage.

@ __Chief__: EDIT: i before e :D -Chief

And I'll gladly shake yours as well :) .

@ x3dxFox:

lolz...not quite the point of my post, but I think you understand.

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