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Eye Contact Problem
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Author:  WalterWoods [ Sat May 03, 2008 11:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Eye Contact Problem

I have a problem with the reaction I tend to get with my eye contact. I go through the typical thing with normal people (AFC) where I make the eye contact at a certain moment. We both wait and look in other directions until we are about to pass each other and then we finally make eye contact. I need to work on doing it earlier I guess. But thats not even the problem I'm asking for help with right now!

I don't like the smiles I'm getting. They're not really smiles. They're sort of half grins like you give in a very formal greeting. It makes me feel like I'm being condescended to. I think this is becuase of how my smile looks. But I can't help it. Its just the smile I end up giving. Its a sort of friendly grin. I can't make myself give a full on smile, it feels too awkward, I'm too shy. How can I get a better smile from a girl, bring out more enthusiasm that I can escalate with? Is there some other kind of way other than a full on smile? I don't know if that would even work or not really anyway. What are some of the techniques I should be doing?

Author:  c_n12 [ Sat May 03, 2008 11:25 pm ]
Post subject: 

"I asked one woman friend of mine "why did you go out with him?" and she replied: "because when I looked at him he kept eye contact with me."

When I recall the very successful people I have had the pleasure of working for in the corporate world, I remember that they all maintained eye contact while speaking to me. When you watch somebody successful being interviewed on TV, like Scott McNealy of Sun, you notice that they never look away from their interviewer's eyes and they rarely blink.

You are approaching a chick in the hall as you walk towards each other. When should you look at her? (Her eyes, silly. If you look at anything else, it's over.) I have tried all combinations. If I wait until the last instant, I either find she is not looking, or, if she is looking, she quickly looks away. If I look at her and she looks at me and I look away, then she never looks again. Then I tried something bold and decide I will look at her eyes the entire time. To my amazement, she gazes like a deer into headlights. Never breaks eye contact. So I decide to try this little experiment.

Recently I spent a week attending meetings in one of our buildings filled with educated successful professional women in their 20's and 30's. Most are definitely doable. Some are gorgeous. Some are married, some are not. I spent my time betweenmeetings trying this: I would pick a different floor and I would walk down each hall, walking just slightly to the right of center. When I saw a woman walking towards me, I maintained looking at her eyes. Only the heavy ones did not keep looking. But for all the others, including the gorgeous ones, they maintained eye contact the entire time. I never blinked. They never blinked. They broke eye contact only when we were just about next to each other. I broke eye contact only after she did. What really amazed me was that by the time we passed, almost every chick had broken a smile. Some even said "Hi." I did not smile or say Hi until they first did.

These halls were not long. Each woman was no farther than 30 feet away when I first saw her. But what if it had been a very long hall? How far down the hall should I start looking at her eyes? I certainly don't want to scare her. I look straight ahead, and then when she is about 30 feet away, I start looking into her eyes.

I then went to the mall a few times to try the experiment there. Most did not look at all. Of those who did look, most only looked for a second. Only about a third locked on. Of those, about half broke a smile or said Hi. A couple of them where so moved that they almost tripped.

Do you have to be walking? I tried the experiment while sitting. Almost none maintained eye contact. Do they have to be walking? While I was walking I would look at any chicks who were sitting. The results were the same as if we were both walking.

If I was approaching two chicks, and looked from one to the other, I lost them both. So, if I am in such a situation, I lock onto one and I don't change my mind.

If I smiled or said Hi, while she was still looking at me, but before she smiled or said Hi, it would usually result in my loosing her. On rare instances did it make her smile and say
Hi with enthusiasm. So, I never smile or say Hi until she first does so, and I smile if she smiles and say Hi if she says Hi.

If she did not lock eye contact with me, I would go ahead and say Hi when she got close to me. In many instances she would then enthusiastically turn to me and smile and say Hi.

I would also look at chicks who were with a man if he was not looking in my general direction. I was surprised at the number of times that she would lock on and actually smile.

I noticed that the better I dressed, or the sexier I dressed, the better I did. I noticed that the women who looked where better dressed then those who did not.

Eye contact in a bar is an entire science in itself. When done correctly, it can be fucking lethal.

Real players never stare. They lock eye contact. There is a difference between staring and locking eye contact. They are two totally different things.

When you look at a woman, here is what you do. Lock eye contact with her. Don't blink. Don't look at her friend. Pick one eye and don't let go. You only get one chance at this. Don't give up. Don't smile. Don't say anything. You are telling her that you are interested in her and you are not intimidated by her. Then leave it up to her. You will be amazed at the staring capability that women posses.

She is thinking "Who is this guy to be so bold as to continue looking at me while I look at him? Now this is interesting. He is different." She knows that if she lets go now, she will loose you. She will go one of two ways. If she wants to loose you, she will break eye contact and look away. If she does not want to loose you, but is instead intrigued by what you are doing, she knows that she has to eventually end the stare down and she will have to make the move. She will have to either smile or say Hi.

If she smiles, you smile. If she says Hi, you say Hi. Don't say Hello.
Then you reward her and make your move.

Of course, you don't always have to wait for eye contact to make your move."

- David Shade

- Chris 8)

Author:  bboy_spy [ Sat May 03, 2008 11:34 pm ]
Post subject: 

damn nice chris... very good detailed info with explainations for everything. Great experimenting too, definately invested some time in thos words. Major props to you man. Agree 100%

Author:  mozyFresh [ Sun May 04, 2008 12:04 am ]
Post subject: 

I seen a study on this.
When a person smiles a someone, its their natural instint to smile back.
Out of all the people only a few did'nt smile back. Dont worry too much about smiles you get in return. With some people its there in-build for them not to smile, so they have to force it (or fake it), even if they wanted to smile they just dont for some reason. So dont feel bad if they dont smile back.
You can normally tell the difference between just a smile and a im interested smile.
Keep it up.

Author:  mozyFresh [ Sun May 04, 2008 12:25 am ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
damn nice chris... very good detailed info with explainations for everything. Great experimenting too, definately invested some time in thos words. Major props to you man. Agree 100%
He nearly had me going there for a sec.
Do you know of David Shade?

Sounds good, but thats alot of words and it kind of loses you by the end.
For me the (pre-approach) eye contact is one of the best parts, it feels really good, maybe its the antcipation and feeling desirable with a mix of attraction.

Author:  c_n12 [ Sun May 04, 2008 12:45 am ]
Post subject: 

I was not trying to present that as my own work. The whole post was in quotes with David Shade identified at the bottom.

- Chris 8)

Author:  Castnett [ Sun May 04, 2008 2:11 am ]
Post subject: 

Interesting insight, but I kind of disagree with a couple of things that David said. First off, it would seem like it would be better for you to lock eye contact and smile first. This would result in you appearing to be in control and would most likely force her to smile no matter what. Just looking into a girl's eyes without smiling may seem threatening and the girl may not feel the need to smile. Also, David is pretty misguided when he says that you're done if the HB breaks eye contact with you. People with a deep understanding in social dynamics are all in consensus that if you initiate eye contact with a girl and that girl looks at you and then breaks eye contact and looks down, then that girl feels inferior to you (auto DHV) and will be honored when you approach her.

Author:  mozyFresh [ Sun May 04, 2008 5:35 pm ]
Post subject: 

Ah nice one man. It did'nt know that it that they are 'inferior' to you when they look down. I just thought it was just them being shy or was un-interested. But im not sure about them be 'honoured' if you opened them. (lol)
Also look out for raising one hand towards there face or hair, and the mouth opening, i've found these are good IOI.

Now about locking eyes without a smile, it doesn't seem threatening, well if so only rarely and i suppose it helps if you're attractive, but it depends how you do it.

Author:  Castnett [ Tue May 06, 2008 3:45 am ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
Ah nice one man. It did'nt know that it that they are 'inferior' to you when they look down. I just thought it was just them being shy or was un-interested. But im not sure about them be 'honoured' if you opened them. (lol)
Also look out for raising one hand towards there face or hair, and the mouth opening, i've found these are good IOI.

Now about locking eyes without a smile, it doesn't seem threatening, well if so only rarely and i suppose it helps if you're attractive, but it depends how you do it.
Okay, Mozy, I guess poor word choice on my part. hahahaha. Anyway, a girl looking down typically signifies on a subconcious level that you are, infact, superior to her. Using the word "honored" was pretty stupid, I guess. I meant that the girl will most likely be flattered. Actually, I kinda want to hear more opinions on the whole eye contact with/without a smile. I know that personally, I have locked eyes with HBs in the past and they have seldom smiled (A lot of HBs also consider me attractive/handsome.) Girls (at least my age) seem too intimidated and shy to be the first to initiate eye contact.

Author:  c_n12 [ Tue May 06, 2008 4:03 am ]
Post subject: 

In addition to a woman looking down and away being a sign of submission, I've noticed for the longest time an interesting thing about most boyfriends. If you are walking past them on the street, in the mall or anywhere in the general day enviorment and try to look at their girl they will often look over as well (unconciously surveying a threat and conveying lack of self confidence). However if you lock eye contact with these "men" they will often quickly look away and down as well.

Author:  mozyFresh [ Tue May 06, 2008 8:17 pm ]
Post subject: 

I did read somewhere that if they look down or away and then look back at you again they're attracted to you. I suppose thats obvious really, but something to take note of.
I remember when i was an AFC i did'nt have a clue weather a girl liked me or not. They could actually grab my cock and say 'you're so fit' and i'd still be like 'does she like me?'
Now im pretty good at reading small IOI's, as time goes by the better at it im getting, learning these is key when it comes to sarging.

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