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Creepy
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Author:  Guess [ Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Creepy
Guys I'm having trouble feeling like I give off creepy vibes. When I approach girls and talk I try and hold eye contact but it feels like I'm just creeping them out. I think my enter game is struggling, I try and make everything so perfect and analyze every little detail. Suggestions please.
Author:  Rye Lee [ Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:57 am ]
Post subject: 
Often this is a body language issue. I would suggest studying and focusing your efforts there for the time being. Also might be a problem of being too forward, or saying things that are too off the wall.
Author:  Chief [ Sun Apr 20, 2008 1:43 am ]
Post subject: 
Poor body language is but a symptom of a larger mindset issue.

Lead with the mind and the body will follow (it goes both ways, by the way).

"Creepy" to a girl means that you are trying to take value instead of giving it. If you approach a girl thinking that you are below her status or level, you will be trying to get yourself up to her level and/or, with neg theory improperly applied, cut her down to your level:

Image

Girls can sense when you aren't confident enough to see yourself as high status. If that's the case, she'll get an unsettling feeling when this low status guy is trying to work his way up to her. It's the same feeling you get when a hobo is begging you for change.

NOT being creepy involves the assumption that you and her are at the same level from the very start:

Image

Whatever you are THINKING and believing in your head, you will project that reality through subtle cues such as body language, mannerisms, vocal tonality, and a million different other things. Other people will subconsciously catch onto those cues and it'll affect how they feel. Girls are especially more in tune with this sixth sense.

In short, how you deliver your Outer Game will be determined by your Inner Game.
Author:  Rye Lee [ Sun Apr 20, 2008 3:56 am ]
Post subject: 
In part Chief, but not entirely. Good body language also influences your inner game and if you don't change it, you will be stuck in the habits that you are in and thus it doesn't matter if you work a ton of inner game, because that doesn't break you out of a bad posture, or crossing your arms, or looking down when you walk. By doing those things properly though, you end up influencing the way you feel and thus you encourage better inner game.

I'll use as student of mine as an example. He had strong inner game and had great intentions and knew what was going on, but he leaned in when talking to people. As soon as I got him to stop leaning in, fixed his posture and a few other body language things, he became even more confident than before and was no longer viewed as a creep, but the amazing guy that he really is.

I think his transformation was incredible and that was a large part of what was holding him back, he just didn't have a good grasp of his body language. Ask him if you don't believe the power of body language (maybe you've seen the thread by Ka of that name), as he's a member of the forum, Dr^Zigman.
Author:  NOILLUSION [ Sun Apr 20, 2008 4:18 am ]
Post subject: 
hmm. sorry I have to ask a noob question.
I just stand my ground when talking to people, but why is it bad to lean in when talking to someone? I'm guessing because it makes them feel uncomfortable? (but i've seen people get away with it).

What kind of posture is one supposed to maintain and why?
Author:  Chief [ Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:43 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
hmm. sorry I have to ask a noob question.
I just stand my ground when talking to people, but why is it bad to lean in when talking to someone? I'm guessing because it makes them feel uncomfortable? (but i've seen people get away with it).

What kind of posture is one supposed to maintain and why?
Leaning in is called "pecking" in the community. It demonstrates that you are more interested in her than she is interested in you and therefore conveys a sort of neediness.

If you lean back, you show more non-neediness and you give your diaphragm more room and air to project your voice better, richer, and deeper. It also sometimes causes her to lean into you, making you look better to the rest of the room and theoretically makes her more dependent on YOUR leading frame, therefore more attracted to you.
Quote:
In part Chief, but not entirely. Good body language also influences your inner game and if you don't change it, you will be stuck in the habits that you are in and thus it doesn't matter if you work a ton of inner game, because that doesn't break you out of a bad posture, or crossing your arms, or looking down when you walk. By doing those things properly though, you end up influencing the way you feel and thus you encourage better inner game.
I'm not disagreeing with you. The mind leads the body but the body leads the mind as well. I just think it's more likely that Guess had more of an Inner Game issue than an Outer Game one, and that a mental shift would have a more profound effect on his game.
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