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Need some help. Serious sticking point problem :(
https://pick-up-artist-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=33608		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  -=JeDi=- [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Need some help. Serious sticking point problem :(
Guys, if someone out there could please help me out here it would be seriously appreciated. Been talking to a girl for a little while now and we're well into the Comfort stage. Attraction and comfort levels seem to be fairly even and a mutual respect has been building nicely. But as soon as i start feeling something for a girl, my game goes completely to sh*t. I start doubting myself, and it's almost like i can feel the mojo and flow that we've established in the situation just draining right out of it. In the past, this feeling has proven true because the potential relationship dies right there.

I'm thinking maybe what happens is i let my feelings show way too much and that starts acting as a DLV. I thought it could be oneitis, but i don't think it is. I just don't know where to go here to continue keeping things moving along well and the way they should. I think i'm fuc&*#g it up basically. So my latest thoughts are that maybe i should start DHVing some, and maybe letting up on the IOIs till she gives me a good reason and deserves them? Maybe even let up altogether on the IOIs for a little bit? Advice here and approach strategy would REALLY be appreciated guys :( And i repeat, things are well right now, just have to keep them going. It's not a girl i want to get rid of, i just don't want the good flow to drain because i'm starting to have feelings. How do i keep her attractiong going?

I've messed up a few times here now. The girl will be into me and a possible relationship could be blooming, but then i'll say something or put forward some mention of feelings and it blows up in my face. Like all the mystery is gone and she just looks at me like a guy that approached her all wrong at A1. I feel really powerless and like i'm trying to hard to keep the spark going.

Please, if any of you out there could help on this one you'd be a real life saver for me. If i missed anything or if anything is unclear just ask, and i'll be happy to clarify. I want to get this under control ASAP.

Thanks Guys,

-=JeDi=-
Author:  Conceit [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm having the same problem man. I dont know when to switch on and off the non-needy guy and the guy who wants to show the girl he cares about her. It is my sticking point as well. Any help would be appreciated. How's your phone game with the girl?
Author:  -=JeDi=- [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hey Conceit,

Thanks for the reply. Phone game's good, convo's good, whole game's good really. I'm just feeling my sticking point's around the corner and i'm scared to even talk to her now cause i'm sure i'm gonna mess it up :S lol. I'm psyching myself out, but i'm hoping someone could point me in the right direction so i can regain a little confidence in the situation.

Some reading i've found says i should just keep being interesting to avoid her getting bored. But i don't like the idea of being a "dancing monkey" though right? So maybe i should run some more routines with more DHV spikes to keep her interested? But i'm not sure how effective that'll be cause there's already rapport there?

Another suggestion i'm considering might be to get her to talk more at this point to strengthen the bond a little. So in that case, the goal is to find things for her to say that keep her close and bring her closer to me. Sharing intimacy kinda deal. Any suggestions here? Things i could ask? or even if this is a good approach?

Still confused, hoping for some answers and clarity guys.

Thanks,

-=JeDi=-

PS. Conceit, a little advice for the needy-guy/caring-guy confusion. Build an idea in your head of what a non-needy guy is like. James Bond for example 8) And ask yourself what would that guy do? I started mine by looking at the Alpha Male qualities and comparing my responses in given situations to the idea of the Alpha Male in my head. You can do the same with a needy guy. In this situation for example, i don't want to say too much too her without reason or express my emotions simply because i can't handle the uncertainty of the situation. That would be a "needy" guy seeking satiation from her because of his uncertainty in the situation. Like a kid with needs he wants her to take care of. The more you practice referencing the idea of needy/non-needy, the faster you'll be able to apply it in a given situation and come off as caring and not-needy. Make sense? Hope it helps.
Author:  Mithos [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
The problem your having is escalating. Once youve built attraction and comfort your supposed to take it to the next level... get her number, plan a hang out then after that a movie back at her or your place and dont forget kino kino kino. In PU you must always be escalating cause if you take too long the chick may lose interest in you. Also dont tell too many DHV stories cause you may come off as bragging.
Author:  R.G. [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
^Yeah Mithos is right.

You need to escalate. I bet you don't have enough kino from the start, so wack in as much kino as you can. Once you're in comfort your aim is to reach seduction. It's not enough for a girl to want to be seduced by you, you have to do it in the right way.

I know a HB8 in my chemistry class who is dying for me, but at the same time she knows how I pick up chicks all the time and so I'm in C3/S1, but I have to escalate very carefully so I don't:

-Make her feel 'like another girl'
-Hit her anti-slut defense
-Make it seem unnatural
-Give herself any reason to feel guilty
-Allow her to feel buyer's remorse.

At the same time, I can't continue sarging her without escalation. Because I am in C3/S1, if I continue comfort material on and on, she will just be friendzoned by me. Bad move! Thus I am leaving it on freeze outs until I can work out the logistics for seduction.

This example is very useful for you. First off, when you say you're in comfort, you must actually be in comfort! She must actually be attracted to you!

Second, DON'T GIVE IOI's, or 'explain your feelings to her'. The latter is completely AFC. I never give a bare IOI, ever. If I do, it is mixed with push/pull me or me qualifying her.

If you say "hey, I actually have feelings for you", or something like that, EVEN IF SHE LIKES YOU, like my chemistry girl, it will be a complete turn off because of the way you have pitched it.

So stop giving IOI's and wait for her IOI's. When you have got enough, then just kino escalate. If she rejects, neg her, maybe DHV and then try again. Just keep going. Make the ho say no.

Seducing a girl is like playing a musical instrument. The instrument may like you, but if you play out of key not you nor the girl is going to enjoy the music, and it will be awkward => fail.

Remember to throw in challenges and the odd neg. You seem as if you may be too nice. Girls love a challenge. Here's one I use:

(Say this after the hook. If you use it before, she may say no):

Gamble: "Are you pretty spontaneous?
HB: "Yeah...I guess"
Gamble: "I bet you're not as spontaneous as me! (Challenge) Go on, do something spontaneous."
HB: "Er....I don't know (blushing)
Gamble: "OK MY TURN!" (I slap the HB)
HB: "OMG" (Tries to slap me back)
Gamble and HB: (We start fighting each other until we end up in one big massive beautiful and comfortable HUG.)

See what I mean? Also you can get away with strong Kino because you've been hitting her beforehand.
Author:  -=JeDi=- [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 11:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
First off, thanks for advice guys. I'm really in a bind here.

Ok, i think i understand where you guys are coming from. More escalation and kino i can see is clearly the next step. And believe me, i've built it up very high. I think i might've built it too hard and fast even and there may be no higher place to climb to :S What if i'm getting resistance? Should i try to break it? Should i push? Ignore it and do what i feel like? Should i freeze her out? Throw her an IOD? Like i said, things are going well, but i think i'm psyching myself out.

I can totally understand the DHV bragging and that's what i'm worried about, and i've been pretty good with the IOIs mixed with a little push/pull and i think that's what's helped me get this far. Turning it into a qualifier is something i'm gonna start thinking about and working with too. Good tip, thanks Gamble. And great instrument analogy, hehe so true.

What's a good example or link to some examples of challeges when i can't physically touch her? I wanna peak her interest before i get to actual physical contact. Suggestions? I'm definitely using the one Gamble posted on a date for sure ;) hehe.

Looks like you guys gave me a little HW tonight :) Gotta brush up on the JeDi mind tricks ;)

I look forward to more input guys, thanks again!

-=JeDi=-

PS. I'll follow up with field reports as i go for anyone else facing the same problem out there.
Author:  Bronco [ Wed Dec 03, 2008 12:21 am ]
Post subject: 
This is a problem of mine too. I get attached. I honestly think it's insecurity and failure of rejection from her. One thing you need to do though, is use time to your advantage. It sounds like you haven't been out with this girl too much, if you haven't escalated kino at least to being able to hold hands with her, put your arm around her or other ways of being in a natural, comfortable setting. I'll be following this thread. I hope guys continue to contribute to it.
Author:  nermob [ Fri Jan 02, 2009 8:31 am ]
Post subject: 
ok, it's been a month. what happened?
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