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Worse than the usual LMR...
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Author:  Tephros [ Thu Feb 20, 2014 10:14 am ]
Post subject:  Worse than the usual LMR...
So I'm talking about a 32 year old HB9+ with a doctorate in counseling, for context I'm a 30-year-old medical student. Well I thought it was on since she invited me to her place for the 2nd date, well I guess that would have been right about 66% of the time given past experience. How wrong I was.

Most of the night was pleasant, but I'll stick to where things went wrong. She agrees to a comforting massage after a boardgame that I crushed her at. Typical "need to undo your bra" sort of stuff works, but she physically doesn't let me take her shirt completely off (without comment on either side). I start out with a conventional massage and start massaging her butt over her pants after awhile, she comments that it feels really good and I call her a tight-ass, she laughs. I make out with her as she's face down for awhile, she raises her body when I start to feel her breasts under her bra. After about 20 minutes on the bed, as I start to flip her over she stops me dead, saying that's as far as it goes and asks me to just cuddle with her. In retrospect, I think maybe I should have massaged her pussy through her clothes as I massaged her butt as well, but I don't know if that would have made the difference, she was already horny per her breathing and fidgeting.

I was kind of thrown off, saying, "Hmm that's funny, I was under the impression you were into me." She says she is, but doesn't know me enough; to make a longish conversation short she says she's been hurt a lot in the past and isn't going to let it happen again. She asks me about my sex life and I underplay it, "Oh yeah I've gone on dates with other girls since I last saw you a week ago(true), but I'm not having sex with any of them (that's a lie)." She mentions things that would have to happen, including me getting tested (later she takes this one back), and by mistake admits that she's had sex with a guy she was dating for a few weeks since she was last tested, and then goes on a long speech saying how mad she is that she had sex with him. And also how she wishes she hadn't said that and doesn't know what she can say to make it better. (I wasn't saying anything, but probably had an unhappy look on my face). I say, "Well, feels like special SPAM in a bad way to me. Don't see why you want to punish both of us." She said, "Well it's not special SPAM, this is just the 2nd date." I say, "Well it's your decision, but at the same time I don't feel like it's going to do either of us any good. Dating is just difficult sometimes, and withholding sex isn't going to make it any better." She really didn't like the word withholding, but I forget what she said. She kind of went back and forth in saying she wants sex but can't have it, and doesn't want sex because she needs to feel like it's with the right person. Clarifies that she likes me but doesn't know me. She mentions she didn't shave her legs in order to force herself to not have sex. Then she looks upset and says she will understand if she doesn't hear from me again for her oversharing, but would be disappointed, but expects to hear from me again because I'm a good guy. Have no idea if the whole thing came across as DLV or just not pleasant. We agreed we had fun for "most of the night." We agree to hang out again... tomorrow. For bowling and/or a cooperative board game at her place. She'll be gone to see family this weekend.

Her: "We're hanging out late tomorrow, but you know I'm not going to have sex with you tomorrow either, right?"
Me: "How do you know?"
Her: "I just do, I can't."
...
Later as I leave she says to be sure to text her that I got home safe, and in her reply said she's looking forward to seeing me again.

I'm frankly... kind of irritated and am not sure if this one is worth whatever effort it would take to fuck her, it's sounding like a lot. I mean, she is a HB9+, and I like being around her. Not sure how to act tomorrow. We'll see if she cancels (she would have to cancel, because I'm set to show up at her house as the plan). Part of me wants to completely turn off initiating any physical touch when I see her and see if she comes to me, but that's just the anger talking. Then again, I have no idea how I should act. My best guess is just to have fun and gently escalate without being pushy..?
Author:  Hejsan [ Thu Feb 20, 2014 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Worse than the usual LMR...
You kissed her already?

Take attention to the escalation ladder. If she does'nt want to fuck you thats ok
Quote:
Her: "We're hanging out late tomorrow, but you know I'm not going to have sex with you tomorrow either, right?"
Me: "How do you know?"
Her: "I just do, I can't."
Could be better. Your frame got destroyed by her and you became beta in that sense. Maybe she has her period ... things can happen.

Better would be to tell her: What a dirty mind you have. How on earth do you think were gonna have sex tomorrow. I usualy dont do that on the third date.

Bla Bla result is you tell her something else and do the other thing which is escalation. If she blocks ... withdraw the attention and she seeks it. IF she wants. If she doesn't you can not force her. Thats the difference between seduction and raping :D
Author:  Tephros [ Thu Feb 20, 2014 10:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Worse than the usual LMR...
Quote:
You kissed her already?
We kissed about 20 minutes into the first date, and this was the 2nd date. We've kissed pretty often since then, but she's only initiated it a couple of times (like 10% of the time). I'm guessing attention to the ladder would suggest I should have done some vaginal stimulation from behind over her clothes, especially if I could do it indirectly without using my hand.

Sure if she doesn't want to fuck me that's "okay," but I don't like to waste time. I dunno, feels kind of hopeless now. I guess I'll still show up unless she cancels though.
Quote:
Better would be to tell her: What a dirty mind you have. How on earth do you think were gonna have sex tomorrow. I usualy dont do that on the third date.
Yeah that line was off the table in the process of normalizing early sex, in which I said that all of my LTRs started with sex on the first or second date (which is true, actually). Your tactic probably would have worked better.
Quote:
Bla Bla result is you tell her something else and do the other thing which is escalation. If she blocks ... withdraw the attention and she seeks it. IF she wants. If she doesn't you can not force her. Thats the difference between seduction and raping :D
So I suppose when she blocked I should have done a freeze out? Do you think I should tone down the physical attention a bit, act a little like I'm friend zoning her?
Author:  Hejsan [ Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Worse than the usual LMR...
Quote:
So I suppose when she blocked I should have done a freeze out? Do you think I should tone down the physical attention a bit, act a little like I'm friend zoning her?
Dont know about that one. If she likes you and likes kissing you I think its ok to date her on. If she is not sure about her feeling give her some good reasons. Girls usualy dont kiss a guy without any physical attraction. However I was thinking about the combination of:

- "I am not having sex with you, dont even think about it"
- Escalate further and slower. You see when she gets reserved.
- Make her touch your dick first through the pants (with her hands) --> Your not getting this ... too bad for you. Check how she reacts.
- See how far she will escalate for you, like massaging your dick. Normaly she wont be like: "I dont touch a penis . . . with my hands"
Author:  Tephros [ Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Worse than the usual LMR...
Quote:
Quote:
So I suppose when she blocked I should have done a freeze out? Do you think I should tone down the physical attention a bit, act a little like I'm friend zoning her?
Dont know about that one. If she likes you and likes kissing you I think its ok to date her on. If she is not sure about her feeling give her some good reasons. Girls usualy dont kiss a guy without any physical attraction. However I was thinking about the combination of:

- "I am not having sex with you, dont even think about it"
- Escalate further and slower. You see when she gets reserved.
- Make her touch your dick first through the pants (with her hands) --> Your not getting this ... too bad for you. Check how she reacts.
- See how far she will escalate for you, like massaging your dick. Normaly she wont be like: "I dont touch a penis . . . with my hands"
Thanks! I'll give it a shot. :)
Author:  Hejsan [ Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Worse than the usual LMR...
Good luck!

Tell me how it went :D
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