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PU on established friendship
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Author:  duck [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  PU on established friendship
All,

Been reading "The Game" like most everybody I guess. I think that aside from a "manual" it's excellent reading as simply a memoir but back to the topic.

Doing a set on someone new - ok I can see that working etc. (worked in a bar for a long time - it does work. the PUA's that maybe figured it out on their own - they follow the methods set by Style and Mystery without realizing it)

It seems to me that if you had a friendship with someone for awhile and decided you wanted to turn that into more - that's the harder nut to crack.

How do you simply go up to someone you have known 8 years and start your routine? They KNOW you and are gonna blow thru that in a second.


As an aside - been looking for a tutorial on levitating a beer bottle - any advice or places to check would be appreciated also.
Author:  Magnus [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 5:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
why are you friends with this girl in the first place? that's question one...
what are you looking to get out of it? that's question two

I'm a noob PUA but out of my numerous encounters as a "natural" I wouldn't suggest doing it at all. Friends are a lot harder to gain then a one-night stands. If you have known this girl for 8 years, keep it that way. There was a reason for why it happened. Don't ruin a good friendship for a night of ass...
Author:  duck [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lemme put it this way - tension has been there about moving to the next level since day one - we are friends but have our own busy lives as well.

Simply put it isn't one-itis but it could be a very good thing long term and we are both mature enough that if it wasn't - neither one would jump off a bridge.

I was wondering about a way to finally break that ice. Of getting her back to considering that more than friends is worth taking a shot.
Author:  duck [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
And we NEVER had the LJBF talk - it's the elephant in the room. Neither one had the talk because (obviously) neither one of us believes it.
Author:  EvoJ [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: PU on established friendship
Before you bother to read this duck you need to answer a question to yourself. "Are you here to get a relationship with your friend or are you here to learn to be a PUA?" If you are here to be a PUA then continue.

Quote:
How do you simply go up to someone you have known 8 years and start your routine? They KNOW you and are gonna blow thru that in a second.

First off, Yes, they know you. But what you are really saying here is that they know the Real You. The most important point of learning the art of PU isn't the lines to pick up women, it is to improve yourself. To improve yourself and your inner game enough so that you know beyond a doubt that you are the prize. Once you know that you are a bad-ass and they would be lucky to be with you then You will act like it. You will treat them like their beauty doesn't matter, because frankly... to you it won't. You will be able to pick up a hundred just like her but she can't find another YOU.

From what I have been able to learn there are 2 important things in that last paragraph that relate to you.

1. It isn't just routines and it Certainly isn't you faking it. It is the NEW you that you will be portraying. And no it isn't you ditching who you really are. You are just accentuating the good parts and pushing back the bad. On these forums it has been said a thousand times. Women can smell confidence and they want it like a crackfiend with 50$ wants a rock. Basically what I am saying is that your friend won't see through the "sham" because there ISN'T one. Everyone changes... you are just directing yourself in a more confident ladies man.

2. You have to be willing to lose her. That is a huge part of it. Because if you see her as important then you will do what is required make sure you keep her. And that, Duck, is keep her as a friend. That is why the cure for One-itis isn't "Going and win her heart" it is "Go and F!ck ten better looking girls till you forget about her." So are you willing to lose her forever or would you rather keep her in your life as a friend?


*** Before I give this advice I want to tell you one last time to just keep her as a friend and go use your soon to be PUA skilled ass to go beat the breaks off a few HB10 blondes.***


Now, Since you have read this far then I know you chose to be a PUA and IF you decide that you are really willing to lose her completely then I have some very simple advice. Relax about her for now, don't pressure her or do anything new yet. Learn to be a PUA, go out, meet women, show yourself that You are desirable. Over the next few months while you are learning and dating and realizing that inner badass she will notice it too. Your good friends then she will be around. She will see that you are modifying who you are. You are becoming more desirable to women more attractive than her. You will get social proof that you are an amazing catch. And then it is time to begin.

Since you are Already in the comfort stage (waaaaaay too far in to be precise) you need to get out of it. You need to sit down with her and tell her about what you have "realized" about yourself and your wants and needs. How inadvertently in this trip of self discovery you finally realized that this friendship isn't all you would like from her. You have cherished your friendship together but you want more. Don't make it sound like an ultimatum, but make it sound serious. Make a completely clear SOI (Statement of Intent). Afterwards say something along the lines of "I know what I want now, and I need to know if you want it too."

If she does want more. Great and easy. Date.

If she doesn't then it becomes very very hard. You can try to salvage your friendship if you want at this point but it is pretty much useless. She will probably feel awkward around you for a long long long time.


Thats the best I can do. Yes, it sucks and that is why we don't do it. Best of luck.


EvoJ
Author:  duck [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Good points - I guess I looked at it like I needed some PUA mojo to get passed that familiarity stage with her.

We both date others, I was even married for a period of time in there (am guessing I am a touch older than most here but many say I still look 20-24).
Author:  Magnus [ Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm not sure that a PU is your best choice in this situation, don't run a set on her, she already knows you, you can't impress her with anything at this point... my suggestion would be to create competition, invite her to a club, leave her close, make out with 3 girls, create some value on yourself to make her understand she has something good but maybe she doesn't fully understand it. However leave with her... on the way back tell her something sweet, give her your jacket if it's a bit cold, tell her "I think I finally understand it now, those girls in there today were all fine, but they didn't have what you have, a good heart and great personality that I can imagine myself being with for a long time" work around that and change it up a bit to suit you, see where that takes you... I'm saying it out of personal experience, I have a friend who I've known for a long time and every time I bring up other women, she stops, stares and like drools at me... it will work! ;)
Author:  Sleeper [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:13 am ]
Post subject: 
I have to totally agree with Magnus!!!!! Just make her your pivot or wing when you guys go out and hit on other HB 9's and 10's. Then once those HB's give you those puppy dog stares, just take their number and go home with your friend. Then just run what Magnus stated, ""I think I finally understand it now, those girls in there today were all fine, but they didn't have what you have, a good heart and great personality that I can imagine myself being with for a long time". This will show higher value and show her what she's missing out on.

I feel your pain, duck!!!! I've put myself in the LJBF zone when I was a AFC but will try to slowly change their perspectives by using this same concept stated by Magnus. Good luck and keep us informed.......
Author:  Hungry Like the Wolf [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:13 pm ]
Post subject: 
EvoJ, I tend to agree with you more than the rest (sorry sleeps) but I have to consider two alternatives and I would like to hear the forum's input on this. After an 8 year friendship, (I have a pgf - platonic girl friend - of 20 years who is my common frame of reference) I'd have no trouble asking her why (or why she thought) we never went further. That, to me, is just an innocent question poised out of curiosity and shouldn't threaten the friendship. As an alternative, I might just start touching her more but I'd first have to psych myself up to where it seemed like the most natural thing in the world before I started and then proceed very slowly. If it seems natural to me then it would seem that way to her. No bad vibes sort of thing. Comments gents?
Author:  Sleeper [ Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:56 am ]
Post subject: 
hahaha, it's cool Wolf!!!! After reading everyone's post over and over, we all pretty much have the same concept in mind, " MAKE HER REALIZE WHAT SHE IS TRULY MISSING OUT ON". Wolf brought up a good point when he said that he was referencing from a certain frame. Goes to show that we all relate things to past experiences.... Which would mean that a lot of things that you and your friend did together or past experiences would have to be taken into account, if a specific type of game plan to be formulated for the situation.

Here's an example from my frame. In high school, I was probably viewed as just a jock and nothing else. Wasn't known to be good with the ladies and pretty much a true AFC. So, whenever I did like a girl and tried to approach her, I was automatically put into the LJBF zone because of how she viewed me and the way I carried myself. The cocky funny was always part of my personality but getting with the ladies was a different story. So as years went by, I made really good friends with these girls and too make it more worse, I was always giving them advice when they had guy trouble. Now this was an example of my history with all of the girls that I'm referencing my view points. So my game plan of changing the situation and it is only a game plan because it hasn't been put to the test yet. Meetup with them in a club and sarge other HB's with the same cocky funny attitude that I've always had but with a little added spice of PUA. Pretty much just have fun, demonstrate value of yourself. This should switch her view point of me not being good with the ladies. This should also show that I'm a pretty confident person and changed since we first met. Then I would continue with my usual cocky funny ways on her but slip in a few comments here and there along with some kino. Which should work cause I changing her perspective of me. I have to put it to the test though..... But that's an example from my frame

From what Wolf posted, it seems that this is his game plan on bringing himself out of the LBJF zone which sounds pretty awesome is to kino and throw the idea out for you and her to kick around. Kinoing and escalation is what seems to be the difference of being in the LBJF zone and being more then friends. But that's the hard part, to be able to kino without her thinking, "What the f@ck are you doing?"....LOL.... It's got to feel natural and playful then the escalation gives her hints of what if..... AWESOME!!!!!
Author:  EvoJ [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
Wolf, damn 2 decades with her as a friend. Ouch. There is a huge diff between LJBF and sleeps next to you on weekends while drunk in her undies because she feels safe. LJBF's MAY be able to be worked out of... but best friends is probably a whole shitpot harder and I would rather not step into that convo lol.

Careful, 2 decades is a lot to risk.

EvoJ
Author:  Hungry Like the Wolf [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 7:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm not going to risk it EvoJ but thanks for the warning. I like the relationship just the way it is but if I ever wanted to escalate, that's how I would go about it. Then again, she may not be like every other woman. She's a handful of credits and a dissertation away from her doctorate and she just up and quit because she "wanted a life."
Author:  zachary0611 [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 7:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
Im in the same predictment, but I live with the girl. She is unhappily engaged and her ex still comes by to "hang out". lol We have known each other for 4 years and have had sex twice 3 years ago. She asked me about 4 years ago how come we are two attractive people why arent we dating I told her then that we were just friends, but now I want to change this. How do I get around this?
Author:  Hungry Like the Wolf [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:11 am ]
Post subject: 
Zachary, it sounds like SHE has already made the offer. Would it be inappropriate to ask her if she is still interested? If you think it ill advised to ask her directly, then start with a little kino. Caress her arm when she says something sweet or touching. You two are friends. Friends can do that, especially if they are of the opposite sex. Just make sure it feels ok to you. Not creepy.
Author:  Lefty Kirkcaldy [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
I had this same discussion with another guy
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