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Can't approach due to AFC friends..
https://pick-up-artist-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=128492		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  sawyer24 [ Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Can't approach due to AFC friends..
Ok So long story short, I recently moved to a big city, so currently I only have 2 male friends that I go out with. One of them is an afc but at least tries, and is okay at opening, the other makes no attempt and will actually walk away from girls ( this is because he's in love with some broad who doesn't love him back...)

So with that said, it is hard for me to approach women when they are around since neither of them approach with me.. Needless to say going out with them is holding back my game big time.

Should I approach by myself? and just act like they aren't there. Or should I go out alone to begin with? Or can I some how use them to my advantage? "hey ladies these 2 friends of mine are scared of women, what should I tell them."

Any ideas would be great!

-Sawyer
Author:  madmax3000 [ Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
If I were you, I'd start going out alone and see how far that gets you. Friends like that are just gonna continue to hold you back and thats clearly not what you want in your game right now. Also, do you know of any potential wingmen that might live in your area? You might want to consider looking into that as well. Something to think about. Hope this helps
Author:  sawyer24 [ Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:59 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
If I were you, I'd start going out alone and see how far that gets you. Friends like that are just gonna continue to hold you back and thats clearly not what you want in your game right now. Also, do you know of any potential wingmen that might live in your area? You might want to consider looking into that as well. Something to think about. Hope this helps
That's a good idea, except I don't know the area yet like they do, and also I always feel weird going out alone, Just standing in the bar not talking to anyone.... I am not very good at flying solo.
Author:  PurpleSmash [ Sun Feb 12, 2012 10:14 am ]
Post subject: 
AFC friends can be a real burden sometimes. The worst is when you take charge and have little or no approach anxiety, and you have 4 guys following you around like puppy dogs. If I'm out with a group of guys, I'll make sure to let one of my more experienced friends know that I want him to back me up when talking to groups of girls. The rest are left to their own devices.

If they are all equally bad, I will choose the friend that I know enjoys dancing the most, and have him come with me to open girls on the dance floor. It works really well with dancing, because even if they get blown out, you can already semi-isolate your girl by spinning her around and putting your back to her friends. Once they get past the initial rejections or success, I find they can easily occupy the potential cockblocking girls by simply dancing with them. Let them know they are free to go after a girl they fancy, and you will not complain if you have to wing them. It can actually work to your advantage when they forget their own approach anxiety and start opening groups of girls with more than one desirable girl in them.

If you choose a friend who is visually attractive, or can at least handle himself socially, you can also open 2 or more sets and introduce your friend. It's an indirect opener, but I find girls that would normally reject you instead accept you initially because you assume you're already 'in' by introducing your friend. Worst case scenario is you just opened some bitchy girls, then move onto others.

In all of the above scenarios, you have to accept your role as a leader. Tell your friend very simply that all he has to do is talk to the other girl, or dance with her. Take the guesswork out of his hands by giving him a single instruction like "when I start dancing with this girl, grab her friends hand" or start talking about how wild the night has been, and the crazy hobo he encountered on the way in. Make some story up, he just needs to distract his girl, not close her.

For friends that are just terrible with girls, I just don't bother trying to include them. I have a friend who is a hilarious dude, but I suspect he's in the closet, and he really enjoys outright insulting girls on their manner of dress or makeup. No other way to describe it than anti-game. If he comes out to the club with us, I'll joke around with him for a bit while I'm getting used to the scene, but when it comes to talking to girls, he can stand by the bar and wait. There's no point in giving yourself a headache by trying to use guys like this as a wing.

At the end of the day, I'd still rather go to the club with my anti-game friend, than by myself. If the night sucks, then we can amuse each other by making fun of the stupid ways girls act in the club. A favourite of mine is the hilarious girls dancing on table tops or couches when "the club can't even handle me right now" comes on, haha.
Author:  pumpington [ Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:55 pm ]
Post subject: 
hey man, even when I got out with friends I approach alone, there is no point in entering sets tandum with a guy, it is just a comfort blanket for you at the moment,

1)tandum with a guy will result in him getting less or more attention then you, that can either make him look bad, or you look bad, often girls will gravitate towards the coolest best looking person and the group and compete for him, instead of one ''taking one for the team'' girls are competative in nature and are most likely to just go for the best guy, instead of any available guy

2)if you are going to go in tandum, do so with a female wing, not a male

3)if you are using male wingmen, you should split off and open different groups of girls then try to bring those groups to meet your friend, introduce them, get him to introduce his group to you, and trade off meeting each others girls and game that way

4)learn to judge body language and if your friend is in a set and it looks like it is starting to stall, go give him attention and let him know before hand it is his job as a wing to introduce you to the set as soon as you enter (he should already know this), if he is being cockblocked, it is also your job to help him avert that, isolate the cockblocks and talk to them, do what ever it is you can to keep them away from your wing and the girl he is trying to game, but if his set is going well there is no need for you to enter (works vice versa)


GOOD LUCK
Author:  sawyer24 [ Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:52 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
AFC friends can be a real burden sometimes. The worst is when you take charge and have little or no approach anxiety, and you have 4 guys following you around like puppy dogs. If I'm out with a group of guys, I'll make sure to let one of my more experienced friends know that I want him to back me up when talking to groups of girls. The rest are left to their own devices.

If they are all equally bad, I will choose the friend that I know enjoys dancing the most, and have him come with me to open girls on the dance floor. It works really well with dancing, because even if they get blown out, you can already semi-isolate your girl by spinning her around and putting your back to her friends. Once they get past the initial rejections or success, I find they can easily occupy the potential cockblocking girls by simply dancing with them. Let them know they are free to go after a girl they fancy, and you will not complain if you have to wing them. It can actually work to your advantage when they forget their own approach anxiety and start opening groups of girls with more than one desirable girl in them.

If you choose a friend who is visually attractive, or can at least handle himself socially, you can also open 2 or more sets and introduce your friend. It's an indirect opener, but I find girls that would normally reject you instead accept you initially because you assume you're already 'in' by introducing your friend. Worst case scenario is you just opened some bitchy girls, then move onto others.

In all of the above scenarios, you have to accept your role as a leader. Tell your friend very simply that all he has to do is talk to the other girl, or dance with her. Take the guesswork out of his hands by giving him a single instruction like "when I start dancing with this girl, grab her friends hand" or start talking about how wild the night has been, and the crazy hobo he encountered on the way in. Make some story up, he just needs to distract his girl, not close her.

For friends that are just terrible with girls, I just don't bother trying to include them. I have a friend who is a hilarious dude, but I suspect he's in the closet, and he really enjoys outright insulting girls on their manner of dress or makeup. No other way to describe it than anti-game. If he comes out to the club with us, I'll joke around with him for a bit while I'm getting used to the scene, but when it comes to talking to girls, he can stand by the bar and wait. There's no point in giving yourself a headache by trying to use guys like this as a wing.

At the end of the day, I'd still rather go to the club with my anti-game friend, than by myself. If the night sucks, then we can amuse each other by making fun of the stupid ways girls act in the club. A favourite of mine is the hilarious girls dancing on table tops or couches when "the club can't even handle me right now" comes on, haha.
Yeah one of my afc friends is sort of like the anti-game. Flat doesn't even attempt to talk to girls.. Its a little annoying actually.

But those are some good advices. I will probably leave him alone at the bar while i approach solo.

And I agree approaching solo is usually better, for reasons you stated.
Author:  sawyer24 [ Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:54 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
hey man, even when I got out with friends I approach alone, there is no point in entering sets tandum with a guy, it is just a comfort blanket for you at the moment,

1)tandum with a guy will result in him getting less or more attention then you, that can either make him look bad, or you look bad, often girls will gravitate towards the coolest best looking person and the group and compete for him, instead of one ''taking one for the team'' girls are competative in nature and are most likely to just go for the best guy, instead of any available guy

2)if you are going to go in tandum, do so with a female wing, not a male

3)if you are using male wingmen, you should split off and open different groups of girls then try to bring those groups to meet your friend, introduce them, get him to introduce his group to you, and trade off meeting each others girls and game that way

4)learn to judge body language and if your friend is in a set and it looks like it is starting to stall, go give him attention and let him know before hand it is his job as a wing to introduce you to the set as soon as you enter (he should already know this), if he is being cockblocked, it is also your job to help him avert that, isolate the cockblocks and talk to them, do what ever it is you can to keep them away from your wing and the girl he is trying to game, but if his set is going well there is no need for you to enter (works vice versa)


GOOD LUCK
Great advice. Thanks man.
Author:  madfranc [ Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:21 am ]
Post subject: 
I have a similar problem, my two best friends, who I often go out with have zero game. One occasionally lands himself a drunk chick but she's usually first to move.

But anyways, I know that if i try to enter a set with them they won't have much to say and this will lower my value to the girl I'm trying to open. I'd also feel bad telling my friend he has no game and can't come out with me. I have 2 solutions I use to get around this:

1) I will make an excuse to leave my friend, maybe go to the toilet or get a drink. This only gives you a small amount of time to pick up and girls but it should be enough time #close. If the club is busy even better because you can use the excuse you couldn't find them. If they do find you before you close it is more than likely they will ruin the whole thing.

2) You can open an easier set and introduce your friends. If you know people there you can introduce them to them too. While they are busy talking this is your window to open a couple of sets.

Hopefully the girl will like you enough by the time your friends come moping back and ruin it for you and you can say "I need to get back to my friends" and as you roll off turn back and say you'd like to continue the conversation later. Get her number. You could even speak to her a bit later. Maybe just before the club closes ;)
Author:  PitchPerfect [ Mon Feb 20, 2012 3:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
Go out with your friends, but approach alone. Use them as a time-constraint (hey, this'll be quick, I need to get back to my freinds...) also, before you hit a club, meet up somewhere before. Give them few hints and tips, try groom them into wings.
Author:  maleaco [ Mon Feb 20, 2012 7:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
What pitch said is good, and also try to meet guys who are good with women, open them as if you were opening women I suppose
Author:  Mr.Confident [ Tue Feb 21, 2012 1:07 am ]
Post subject: 
I know were your coming from. I have one of my best friends refusing to do anything pua. He doesn't want to even approach girls (He is not gay trust me). And another one who is so far up this girls ass he is doing her college assignments for her. When it comes to afc friends do not sarge with them. Find some guys who have a decent skill set when it comes to girls. I have a few friends like that, were not close friends but were solid friends. take someone like that sarging with you. Makes all the difference.
Author:  silverito [ Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:57 am ]
Post subject: 
When I am with friends I mostly open solo, opening with friends seems like I need someone "to hold my hand" :)
Untill I read this post I even did not think about it because it was so natural, even if I am with 10 friends I still open solo. Other friends usually do the same.
So I do not see big issue here, and few people stated that already as well :)
So do not worry.
Author:  _Action_ [ Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:44 am ]
Post subject: 
It's not hard to turn AFC's into wings - if they're willing to listen.
Author:  danger42 [ Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Definitely open solo. They you can establish time constraints by using your AFC friends (I gotta get back to my friends...) or just return to them and compare notes.
Author:  0uch [ Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
You have to lead your friends here. Open solo, game, introduce them to your friends.

If your friends can't game, once you introduce the girls, make it a group instead of where everyone is talking instead of isolating the girls. And lead the group.
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