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Lost for words
https://pick-up-artist-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=204375		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Rigel [ Fri May 26, 2017 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Lost for words
Hey guys, wondering if I could get some advise.
Recently I've been building up to asking a female bartender out (I know, hired guns) but I feel like she's a little interested, talking and asking me questions while she's serving other people and the bars busy.

I didn't have a problem speaking to her at first, but I've now found I find it hard to actually say things, even ordering a drink, my hands start to shake and I panic.

I typically then get home that night and find myself thinking it over and thinking what I should have said at the time...

Does anyone have any advise to help me out?

Rigel.
Author:  Heywood Jablowme [ Fri May 26, 2017 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
Hey guys, wondering if I could get some advise.
Recently I've been building up to asking a female bartender out (I know, hired guns) but I feel like she's a little interested, talking and asking me questions while she's serving other people and the bars busy.

I didn't have a problem speaking to her at first, but I've now found I find it hard to actually say things, even ordering a drink, my hands start to shake and I panic.

I typically then get home that night and find myself thinking it over and thinking what I should have said at the time...

Does anyone have any advise to help me out?

Rigel.
Re-frame how you view women. You fear comes from thinking you have nothing to offer a girl as hot as her.

Do not place women, or any particular woman, on a pedestal before you even know them. No woman is perfect. Women are human beings just like you, with their own struggles and challenges. They take a shit. Get BO, fart, menstruate, and many times feel just as scared and vulnerable as you are.
Author:  puaninja [ Sat May 27, 2017 1:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
I'll tell you right now that the bartender doesn't like you in the way you think she does. Because the only way hot bartenders would like a male customer is if he is in that 1 percentile of hot dudes, and you'd know if you were that dude because you would have no problem getting women. They get hit on so much and have a lot of options, they have no need or time to have crushes on random patrons. She probably has boyfriend and several orbiters at her disposal. Their job is to be social, and they'll sometimes even pick the lonely looking people to talk to the most because they feel sorry for them or they are just bored.

That being said, you can still try to game her. I don't want to discourage you from that. But just know what you are working with. You need to get out of your head and develop your inner game. If you approached it from the perspective that this lowly human bottle opener is lucky to have your consideration for a date sometime, then I guarantee you wouldn't have any anxiety toward her whatsoever.
Author:  jasonm [ Sat May 27, 2017 1:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
I'll tell you right now that the bartender doesn't like you in the way you think she does. Because the only way hot bartenders would like a male customer is if he is in that 1 percentile of hot dudes, and you'd know if you were that dude because you would have no problem getting women. They get hit on so much and have a lot of options, they have no need or time to have crushes on random patrons. She probably has boyfriend and several orbiters at her disposal. Their job is to be social, and they'll sometimes even pick the lonely looking people to talk to the most because they feel sorry for them or they are just bored.

That being said, you can still try to game her. I don't want to discourage you from that. But just know what you are working with. You need to get out of your head and develop your inner game. If you approached it from the perspective that this lowly human bottle opener is lucky to have your consideration for a date sometime, then I guarantee you wouldn't have any anxiety toward her whatsoever.
Exactly. I once had a friend who made friends with all the hot bartenders and waitresses in the area we lived. When I'd go out drinking with him, he'd make a point of dropping by a bunch of different places to chat each one of them up. He always thought that sooner or later one of them would want to date him. I tried to convince him otherwise, but he didn't want to hear it as long as he believed he had a chance. Unfortunately, these women market their hotness to get "followers" who will spend money and tip them well. They are all up and down social media promoting their bars and restaurants with sexy pics of themselves. I don't have to tell you how many thirsty guys are liking and commenting along the way. This is no different from trying to date strippers, except these women are simply not taking their clothes off.
Author:  Arch Stanton [ Sat May 27, 2017 2:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
I specialize in fucking hired guns, and just got back from my favorite watering hole, where the two hottest girls in my town stole my business cards off the bar, stuck the cards in their ass pockets and looked me over their shoulder grinning while they did it.

How?

1. If you're fat, get your fat ass in shape. Hired guns work out hard, and respect a man who also does. Be what you want to attract. They see hundreds of average bros a day. Invest in yourself and stand out.


2. No sports team clothing. Don't dress like a slob.

3. Shocking honesty. Get sexual and direct, fast. Don't be the bitch ass chatty friend guy who has no balls. I told one of the girls tonight after i finished my salad, "why dont you do what you've been doing all night and check me out. " took her a second to get it, then she called me a cocky asshole while taking my business card without me offering it ( I was at a business meeting earlier and didn't want the bulk of them in my wallet anymore).

This also plays into confidence. I'm a big, big fan of fit, sassy hired guns. Almost always bisexual and a little crazy. And they know how to banter, which is a turn on.

I would not compare them to strippers.
Author:  poeticlyskuac [ Sat May 27, 2017 4:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
I specialize in fucking hired guns, and just got back from my favorite watering hole, where the two hottest girls in my town stole my business cards off the bar, stuck the cards in their ass pockets and looked me over their shoulder grinning while they did it.

How?

1. If you're fat, get your fat ass in shape. Hired guns work out hard, and respect a man who also does. Be what you want to attract. They see hundreds of average bros a day. Invest in yourself and stand out.


2. No sports team clothing. Don't dress like a slob.

3. Shocking honesty. Get sexual and direct, fast. Don't be the bitch ass chatty friend guy who has no balls. I told one of the girls tonight after i finished my salad, "why dont you do what you've been doing all night and check me out. " took her a second to get it, then she called me a cocky asshole while taking my business card without me offering it ( I was at a business meeting earlier and didn't want the bulk of them in my wallet anymore).

This also plays into confidence. I'm a big, big fan of fit, sassy hired guns. Almost always bisexual and a little crazy. And they know how to banter, which is a turn on.

I would not compare them to strippers.

LOL you wouldn't? HMMMM... that's interesting. I do compare them but that's because I understand they really are the same. Doing something for money using their looks to their advantage and getting hit on daily... turned off by "ballers" dropping lots of doe.

Thought you knew game in and out? You don't even see the similarities between the two. There are some slight differences in WHEN you game them but it's actually nearly identical.

You think an ugly woman isn't attracted to the same shit as a hot woman? As another hot woman? Na they are all attracted to the same shit, they are all turned on by the same shit, so I feel like you really need to go back to school dog.
Author:  Arch Stanton [ Sat May 27, 2017 8:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
If you can't see the difference between what a bartender does and what a strippers does, then your analytical skills are severely impaired.
Author:  Rigel [ Sat May 27, 2017 8:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Cheers for the replies guys...

While I understand where you're coming from about them being hot and going for the top tier of guys etc, she's not smoking hot or anything and my group of mates don't seem to find her attractive, there's just something about her!

Anyways...
I was there last night, and my mates managed to drive me to asking her for a drink one night.

Now bearing in mind this is the first time I've ever asked someone for a drink in person..

"Do you have anything against drinking socially with customers?"
"Nope, not really"
"Oh good, was wondering if you fancied a drink next week"
"I think don't have the time unfortunately, I'm working every night until I leave and I've not even said bye to my mum yet"

She's actually going to one of these US summer camps for 3 months in 2 weeks (know for a fact as she follows me on insta and we've spoken about it before).

The way I see it, I either get over her or try and ask her for a coffee the next time I'm in.
Author:  puaninja [ Mon May 29, 2017 12:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
"Do you have anything against drinking socially with customers?"
"Nope, not really"
"Oh good, was wondering if you fancied a drink next week"
"I think don't have the time unfortunately, I'm working every night until I leave and I've not even said bye to my mum yet"

She's actually going to one of these US summer camps for 3 months in 2 weeks (know for a fact as she follows me on insta and we've spoken about it before).

The way I see it, I either get over her or try and ask her for a coffee the next time I'm in.
I've said it a million times guys, why are you asking these girls anything? You tell them. "Hey, let's go for a drink later when you get off." No question mark.

You have to really consider your wording and be intentional. You should be telling the woman what you want. You are a man, not a permission seeker and question asker. You have the answers already. You know what you want. You are simply telling her what you want to do and she is either on board or she isn't.
Author:  GFRESH2DEF [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
Exactly. I once had a friend who made friends with all the hot bartenders and waitresses in the area we lived. When I'd go out drinking with him, he'd make a point of dropping by a bunch of different places to chat each one of them up. He always thought that sooner or later one of them would want to date him. I tried to convince him otherwise, but he didn't want to hear it as long as he believed he had a chance. Unfortunately, these women market their hotness to get "followers" who will spend money and tip them well. They are all up and down social media promoting their bars and restaurants with sexy pics of themselves. I don't have to tell you how many thirsty guys are liking and commenting along the way. This is no different from trying to date strippers, except these women are simply not taking their clothes off.
I agree with jasonm 100%. It's more than likely that you're not going to get her. I have a wingman (my 1st ever wingman) that all he does is strip club game, because he knows that the strippers are paid to chat guys like him up. And he knows that he doesn't have to game them up too hard to get ioi's from them..even though he knows that most of them are "fake ioi's". He's too scared to approach regular girls on the street and in the bars. He still has alot of AFC mind sets, and blows alot of money pursuing strippers. He also is very strong in social proof game (far more better than me when it comes to this one particular area of game). He knows nearly all the staff members, and at least half of the strippers who work there. And in the process..he never bangs any of them. Don't be like this guy. That doesn't mean that you shouldn't try anyway, it's just about not diluting yourself. But i would definitely still try to game up hired guns (like strippers, bartenders, and waitresses) anyway. Just coming from purely a "i'm just practicing" or "i'm doing this just for the reference experience" outcome independent frame. That way..you won't be too outcome dependent, getting frustrated because you can never seem to pull a hired gun. And you'll actually free your mind, to be open to the possibilities (a re-frame that actually serves to get you out of your head whenever you talk to them). And just maybe you may score one coming from that frame. At the very least a number close :wink:


-G
Author:  oceanx [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 6:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
That's real interesting about your friend GFRESH2DEF.

It's amazing the lengths some will go to avoid facing rejection or their unfounded fears aka False Evidence Appearing Real.
Author:  Rigel [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 8:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
So I've had a busy few days and haven't had chance to post here!

Basically given up on this bartender after asking her for the drink, was expecting it to be a little awkward but all seems to be fine!

Went out and got pretty wasted on Sunday, hit on a load of girls. Wingmanned my mate (somehow). Now have a date on Wednesday with a girl off tinder.

All seems to be going pretty well for me at the moment, I just need to conquer the AA when I'm sober! I've been taking small steps by just holding eye contact and smiling at strangers which is starting to feel less awkward now!
Author:  GFRESH2DEF [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
That's real interesting about your friend GFRESH2DEF.

It's amazing the lengths some will go to avoid facing rejection or their unfounded fears aka False Evidence Appearing Real.
It is a shame oceanx. I tried talking some sense into him many of times, but he refuses to listen to me. He chooses to actively pursue strippers at strip clubs, because strippers approach him (That's their job. That's what they get paid to do). He is more comfortable with them doing most of the work approaching him..as opposed to regular everyday girls, which he would have to approach them. Unfortunately..it comes at the cost of his wallet Lol He spends hundreds, maybe even thousands of dollars on dating advice and SPAM sessions with dating coaches, just for them to tell him what to do and give him permission to approach girls. One of the coaches that he mentioned to me was DeAnna Lorraine. But even with all the money that he spends on dating advice from dating coaches..he still avoids approaching girls on his own at the end of the day, which would actually cost him zero dollars if he did that instead. He lost his virginity to a prostitute last year..which costed him a couple hundred dollars. Not just for the sex, but he also wined and dined her too, and drove her places when she needed to run some errands. He told me that at least she was hot (an HB9 Blonde Chick), so i gave him props for that, but still..all of this because you're too scared to approach girls (primarily because he fears what onlookers seeing him approaching girls will think) come on bro... :? Strippers on the other hand..i view them as legalized prostitutes, but that is a story for another day.


Regular everyday girls from the street and in the bars, aren't paid to be chatty with you or nice to you. That unpredictability is too much for my friend (my 1st ever wingman) to accept. So he thinks that regular girls are typically mean (that's what he actually thinks), which some regular girls are mean, but not all them. So that primarily is just his limiting belief. Although it is true that these type of girls can be more unpredictable, since regular everyday girls aren't being paid to be nice to you..you're still more likely to pull and/or date one of them than you would a stripper. Just because strippers are paid to be chatty and friendly to you, doesn't necessarily guarantee that they will actually be nice to you either. I have definitely met some rude, nasty, and mean spirited strippers in my lifetime.


I've banged several girls from the streets and from bars, but i only banged 1 stripper ever. So even for me..the odds of banging strippers more consistently than girls from the streets and bars, is slim to none. It's possible, but not likely. Also since strippers technically aren't supposed to bang their customers (even though they sometimes will still do it), most of them will not risk their jobs to bang some little joe schmo chode. What you will end up doing more consistently with these strippers at the end of the day, is giving them alot more of your hard-earned money than you'd wish to. :lol: So you'll have more luck with banging regular girls from the the street and in the bars far more consistently than you would with strippers. And it's far more cheaper too. LOL It's not a limiting belief, it's just the truth. Of course there are some guys that are exceptions to the rule, but it still only proves the rule for most of us guys.


-G
Author:  masterm1ne [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Strip clubs are the stupidiest thing ever. I don't understand a lot of the things people spend their money on. The first time I went, I spent several hundred. JUST FOR A TEASE. I think I managed to play with her vage but that was cuz we connected a lil. Anyway... on to the point:

There are so many young college "8-10s" that need help with money they will screw you for a few hundred. Your buddy should save up some of his money...I've banged "hooters girls, actress, models, hired guns w/e" ... it's very liberating. Hot women don't intimidate me anymore. You realize, once their clothes are off, we are all human.

I just remembered - I turned down a stripper a few months ago bc she wouldn't comply with a simple request lol. You're right about the whole getting caught thing too - she was scared about getting caught and had to walk far to my car and then go to another hotel.
Author:  GFRESH2DEF [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost for words
Quote:
Strip clubs are the stupidiest thing ever. I don't understand a lot of the things people spend their money on. The first time I went, I spent several hundred. JUST FOR A TEASE. I think I managed to play with her vage but that was cuz we connected a lil. Anyway... on to the point:

There are so many young college "8-10s" that need help with money they will screw you for a few hundred. Your buddy should save up some of his money...I've banged "hooters girls, actress, models, hired guns w/e" ... it's very liberating. Hot women don't intimidate me anymore. You realize, once their clothes are off, we are all human.

I just remembered - I turned down a stripper a few months ago bc she wouldn't comply with a simple request lol. You're right about the whole getting caught thing too - she was scared about getting caught and had to walk far to my car and then go to another hotel.
I actually could've banged this stripper chick last year, which if i did..that would've made 2 in total. She was a blonde about a 8.6 out of 10, 5' 5", and curvy-thick. All i had to do was go to her crib and bring her back to my house (she was living with several roomates - she had bad logistics). She was craving the D bro! But i decided to lay in bed and be lazy and not answer the phone when she hit me up early in the morning to come get her. Which surpize!..surprize! laziness became a sticking point for me. As many girls that i banged over the 4 years that i've been in the game..i lost alot of close ones that i should've banged. Majority of them were cute HB8s too. I lost too many girls either because of laziness or for falling into the girl's frame (because my frame wasn't strong enough, failing girls' shit tests and LMRs). It still sucks whenever i think about it, and hurts my soul to this very day. :( lol


-G
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